Emminent Domain, Adverse Use, easements, etc.

Posted by jdemaris on March 19, 2006 at 08:23:50 from (66.218.17.178):

This is a repost of a response to Billy NY. This is in regard to property rights and what is happening to them. I started out talking about what the power company tried to pull on me, but my ranting expanded to other related matters where my land has been threatened by "Quick Take" version of Emminent Domain (by the town of Worcester,New York),and by Adverse Use in another area on New York (Worth, Jefferson Co.). It amazes me how some people will stand by and watch it done to someone else - and do nothing as long as they feel it does not affect them personally. My claim is - to stand by and do nothing - not even speak out - it just might come back at you someday.
I recently saw a guy get a one-room school house taken from him. He had offered to sell it to a local historical society (a private one). They did not want to pay the $60,000 asking price - so they asked the town to take it instead - and the town did just that. Seized it by emminent domain, paid a price of $12,000 to the owner and the historical society got it. It could have been stopped if enough people had gone to the town meeting and voted it down - but no one showed up - except the guy it was taken from. I've read of many such cases all over the country.
In my own situations, the following is my dicussion - starting with the British-owned power company here in Otsego County, NY. Formerly known as Niagara Mohawk, now called National Grid. They initally asked me for permission to build a road through my land for a "one time" project of replacing high-lines. Nothing commenced as promised by them. Here is what I posted elsewhere in this forum:

With the power company, there was no communication problem from my end. I've got fifty acres up on a steep mountain top and the power company owns a fifty-foot width of property cutting through it. Their high-lines ran through it in the center of the fifty feet. Their land runs to a town-highway, but it's real steep. When the lines were first put in, in the 40s, that managed to do it all using their own land for getting in and out - and probably did the work in the summer. Now, they wanted EASY access and wanted to do the work in the winter - which is nuts! Also, they didn't want to put the new highlines back in the middle of their own land - because they'd have to remove the old ones first to do that. So, they decided it would be easier to put all the new poles and lines on my land, get it all ready to energize, and then do the change-over in one day. Once done, they would tear the old stuff down, their original 50 foot width of land would be unused, and they'd now be using my land - forever. Communication on their part was poor mainly because they don't do any of their own work. The hired Asplundh to take down trees and build roads, the French-Canadian outfit to put in the new highlines, and even hired a separate company to negotiate new right-of-ways. Seems nobody knew what was going on outside the scope of their own particular job and it was a mess.
With the road-building - I walked the property with their "engineers", marked trees, and made my self available. They were supposed to notify me when road-work started, and I would re-walk the site and advise whoever was actually doing the work. Never happened. They showed up, cut in a new road, never called or asked me, and missed by a couple of hundred feet in certain areas. They then put a locked gate on the access with their own keys (didn't give me keys to access my own property). So - as I said before - I cut off their lock, put on my own, and chained some of their equipment to my tractor (that was on my land, not their's). They tried to bully me, it did not work. The reality is - the individual contractors wanted to be helpful - but they only knew what they were told by the power company. I confronted the French Canadian guys when I found their machine upside down along the side of my field - with over twenty trees knocked down where it came it. The one guy I found that spoke english told me he didn't even know it was private property - he said the power company told him they owned it. THAT IS when I threw them out and chained up their equipment. They are gone now (until next time), I got paid some money for damages, but they never corrected the road. I've got another 100 acres with power company right-of-ways zig-zagging all over it - and they're going to have a battle next time they come to work on any of it for any reason.
On the subject of owning property, sometimes I think it's not worth it. I've had my own sugar-woods, firewood and woodlots for years - but with what I pay in taxes now - I could go out and buy my firewood and maple syrup a lot cheaper than what I pay in taxes. And the good log lots with timber value get taxed very high. The town I live in tried to take some of my property last year by emminent domain - but so far I've held them off. Sad thing is - with the "quick take" means of emminent domain, they can do it anytime as long as nobody shows up at a public meeting to vote it down. And, there is no legal recourse if it is proved what they did is wrong! Right now, the law states - if your land is taken by emminent domain, and you prove later the taking was wrong and NOT justified, you can NOT get your property back - just some additional compensation if you're lucky.
Now, another related experience. I own a large tract of wetland and forest land up north (Jefferson County, Tug Hill, NY). It has been our own - what we regard as - private wildlife refuge. Very remote, frogs, beaver, deer, ducks, etc. all over the place. Ten years ago this was the most remote place in New York State - and it also gets the most snowfall in the contiguous 48 states because of lake-effect snow from Lake Ontario. It's a four-hour drive so I only get up there once or twice a year. In the past few years, a logger cut a road right through the middle of our property in order to log someone else's lot. We had to get the state police involved. Now, with the road in place, people are treating it like a public highway and trying to get the town to maintain it. And, snowmobiles and ATVs are using it. It's NUTS! We've been sending out "permission letters" to all the tresspassers we know of. We are giving permission so no one can claim "adverse use" and get a judge to grant them permanent access. Our only other option is to gate it - but since we are not there to watch it - it's likely the gate will be torn down as soon as we leave. I already tried replanting trees in the new road - and they were all gone the next time we went there.
So what is the answer? Give up, sell all this sh*t, and get an apartment somewhere? People need to wake up, and realize - they must stand up for other people when they see their property rights being trashed - or their own land will be next.
When I went to a town meeting trying to stop the emminent domain where I live - a neighbor spoke up. I don't know this guy, he's a newly arrived city person who lives 2 miles from me - but he is my closest "neighbor." He said, publically, " I don't give a damn what you do to this other guy (meaning me), but you're not gonna' take my land." THAT is the mentality that will lead to everyone losing their rights.

Replies:

• Re: Emminent Domain, Adverse Use, easements, etc. NC Wayne 20:38:39 03/19/06 (1)
  • Re: Emminent Domain, Adverse Use, easements, etc. Midwest redneck 02:09:20 03/20/06 (0)
• Re: Emminent Domain, Adverse Use, easements, etc. VT Guy 12:12:00 03/19/06 (0)
• Re: Emminent Domain, Adverse Use, easements, etc. Mark - IN. 11:55:50 03/19/06 (0)
• Re: Emminent Domain, Adverse Use, easements, etc. Cosmo 10:46:38 03/19/06 (0)
• Re: Emminent Domain, Adverse Use, easements, etc. Jimmy King 10:16:03 03/19/06 (0)
• Re: Emminent Domain, Adverse Use, easements, etc. Midwest redneck 09:19:22 03/19/06 (0)
• Re: Emminent Domain, Adverse Use, easements, etc. 37 chief 08:51:13 03/19/06 (2)
  • Re: Emminent Domain, Adverse Use, easements, etc. Midwest redneck 09:03:51 03/19/06 (1)
    • Re: Emminent Domain, Adverse Use, easements, etc. 37 chief 21:35:58 03/19/06 (0)

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