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Re: Re: Oil choice
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Posted by jakee read this!!!! on November 06, 1999 at 22:29:15 from (208.0.21.142):
In Reply to: Re: Oil choice posted by jakee on November 06, 1999 at 21:57:25:
What Oil Should I Use? by Francis Robinson
I keep seeing this question pop up over and over
again in discussion groups all over the web. As
with many things there are often several right
answers and a few wrong ones.
Some purist I'm sure will disagree to no end with
what I will tell you but most of us out here in
the real world don't really care do we ? Some of
them only bring their noses down out of the air
long enough to look down them anyway. If you are
like me you are only doing this old tractor stuff
because you enjoy it. You will find that in
general, "old tractor" buffs are a great bunch of
people and more than willing to help you any way
they can. I would give you a brief warning about
advice from someone who may be more of a novice
than you are, if possible get several answers and
"average them out". Most discussion group answers
are really good but I have seen a few where their
"BS" didn't indicate a college degree.
On to the slippery subject, one reason I mentioned
the purist is that the lubricants called for in
most old tractor manuals were simply the very best
recommendations they could make at the time of
manufacture and many of the products we have
available today just didn't exist. Had todays
products been available then, not only would the
manufactures have recommended them, they would
have been thrilled by todays quality.
"Can I use detergent oil in my 1945 Farmall "?
Of course you can ! In fact if you don't, I may
have to come by your house and smack you up the
side of your head with a board ! Very early
detergent oils had a few problems but those were
eliminated over forty years ago. ALL four cycle
engines in normal use today should be running with
detergent oil. Yes even lawn mower engines. Non
detergent oils belong in your oil can. The
detergent helps to keep the contaminates in
suspension in your oil so they drain out when you
change oil. I have farmed for many many years and
have operated businesses repairing automotive and
small engines and I have always been amazed at the
number of "old wives tales" that otherwise
intelligent people in the business buy into.
"Joe Blow said if I put oil made for a diesel in
my gas engine it would ruin it".
Nonsense ! Forget what Joe's grandmother heard at
the quilting bee and think a minute. Do not diesel
engines and gasoline engines both use basically
the same pistons, rings, rod and main bearings ?
Does not the oil perform the same function of
lubrication and cooling in both ? Now for the
clincher, in case you have not been watching, do
not the oil companies now rate their premium oils
for both services as well as turbo service ? Your
gas engine has a compression ratio of anywhere
from 5:1 to 8:1 while a diesel engine runs from
13:1 up to 18:1 and so needs to use only a premium
oil to protect it better. The diesel service oil
also needs to be higher detergent in order to
suspend the carbon particles inherent to their
operation. Turbo approved oils must be tough
enough to hold up in the extreme temperatures and
ultra high shaft RPMs inside the turbo charger
unit. Don't let "Joe Blow" tell you it will harm
your old tractor. Buy the best and change it
often, it will save you money.
"My Allis Chalmers "C" calls for 20 weight motor
oil in the transmission and differential, but it
is really noisy".
This also applies to several other tractors as
well. Back when they built these, the old standard
90 weight gear lube wouldn't flow thru their tiny
little pistons and valving of the hydraulic pumps
at anything cooler than a summer day, thus the
motor oil. Even the old 30 weight oils got pretty
stiff when cold and the automatic transmission
fluids available then would never have been enough
protection for heavy pulling, plus they were prone
to excessive foaming. Due to todays better oils,
that motor oil recommendation is safer than it was
back then but I changed all of mine years ago to
the newer "universal trans-hydraulic" oils which
are compatible with such lubes as Massey-Ferguson
"Permatran" or John Deere "Hy-gard" and many
others. I also used it for years in a backhoe and
other construction equipment. One side benefit of
using it in all hydraulic systems is that I can
change equipment from tractor to tractor (I have 9
in use) with out worry that I am mixing different
types of oil due to oil still in remote cylinders.
"The book says to only use their brand of oil".
I would say that too if I was selling oil. Don't
buy dimestore oil, and check the label for
ratings. If you don't have to worry about mixing
oils go ahead and buy the factories brand of
trans-hydraulic oil, it doesn't cost that much
more. I have always preached that buying
ultra-cheap oil is the most expensive money you
can save. On tractors with out combination systems
I still use regular gear lube for transmissions,
differentials and final drives and the
trans-hydraulic oil in the hydraulic systems.
Steering gear boxes are another matter, I have
several tractors with out power steering so I like
to use some kind of "super-lube" such as Slick 50
or Duralube. It really does make them steer
easier. Here is a simple "cheap skate" tip (muzzle
yourself purist), if your steering gear seals leak
badly and won't hold oil (common) and you don't
have the time or money to rebuild them now, put a
grease fitting in place of the plug and buy a tube
of Slick 50 grease, it works fine. Ok, release the
purist.
There isn't room here to cover how much or where
to drain or fill each model but there are a few
common sense guidelines to go by. Engines always
have either a dipstick or a petcock to check the
oil level, DO NOT OVERFILL. Transmissions and
differentials typically have a oil level check
plug about 1/3rd of the way up on the side of the
housing. They get filled through this or a larger
plug up on top, but take the side plug out to
avoid overfilling. The drain plugs are on the
bottom (duh !) but you might need to remove
several in order to drain all of the separate
compartments. As a rule of thumb gear oil levels
are kept below the bottom of any horizontal shaft
which runs through an opening with seals and
depend upon the gears to carry the oil up to the
shaft bearings. Final drives normally run with
just a few inches of lube which is carried up by
the lower gear to the upper. These are often badly
ignored.
If your tractor does a lot of hard work like
bush-hogging you might want to see if you can
install an oil filter in the hydraulic system in
some non destructive manner. I have a couple of
Farmalls that use the hydraulic oil for the power
steering so I have a filter in the power steering
return line. Never put a filter in a pressure
line! Cheap skate tip two, I like to magnetize my
dipsticks so they collect iron and steel particles
floating in the oil and wipe them away when I
check the oil. You can also collect particles by
placing a powerful magnet on the side of the pan,
just remove it before you take out the drain plug
and they will drain out with the oil. Magnetic
drain plugs, available at some auto parts
suppliers also work very well. You can magnetize
your dipsticks (works on screwdrivers too) with a
two post soldering gun, simply pull the trigger
and pass the end of the dipstick through the loop
at the tip. Let go of the trigger before pulling
it back out. Reverse the process if you want to
demagnetize one.
Keep a close eye out for water in the housings of
tractors that set out in the rain a lot as it can
build up faster than you might think, especially
on some models. In addition to the rusting and
loss of lubrication it can freeze in the winter
locking the gears and if forced can cause
considerable breakage. Tractors in regular heavy
farm use normally build up enough heat to stay
dried out but in light use even condensation can
build up to problem levels.
All of my tractors are working tractors, not show
tractors and several have quite a few
modifications but I always try to do "bolt-on"
modifications and keep and label any removed
parts. This way I can always go back to
"original". This is something you might want to
keep in mind even if your tractor is strictly a
worker.
I will leave you with this simple thought, "oil is
cheap, parts and labor are expensive".
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