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What's a guy supposed to do!

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BOBM25

03-09-2007 09:15:09

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There is a big land auction coming up in a few weeks. 153 tillable acres of some of the best ground in the county. Me and a few other young farmers from the area would love to get a shot at some of it. Auctioneer figures it will bring 5-5500 per acre! No way in H-E double hockey sticks do any of us stand a chance. It makes me sick! Good hard working young men who've just wanted to farm since they were old enough to walk cuz its all they've ever known, but will likely never get too. Once their old man gives it up all that will be left is the 100 or so acres that stays in the family. (maybe) Ag institutions of all types are offering discounts to young farmers to help get them going, until that land price gets somewhat reasonable again, its just a fart in the wind!

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dad's88

03-10-2007 01:03:29

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to BOBM25, 03-09-2007 09:15:09

I assume you read all of the posts on here, some real good advice by folks who have walked that road. I do really feel for you, timing is everything. In another era things would be different. I started farming in 1983, went through a drought, 4 years of farm crisis, another drought,etc. Would have liked to have been 20 years older but THIS was my time and I couldn't change it. Guys who started 10 years later fared much better but that's how it is. My family never farmed real big so those whos familys were bigger operators had a better base to work with than I did. Some things you have no control over. You will never be able to go head to head with a guy that owns a couple thousand acres on a rented piece of ground. Your best bet is to try to find an older farmer who has no one that wants to take over. See if you can go to work for him, maybe someday he will rent it to you cheaper than the neighbor. If you have some large operators in your area see if you can hire on with them, at least you will be doing what you love. Maybe there will come a day when you could become a partner on some level. The sad fact is it's just not going to happen over night. The days of starting with nothing and buying a good crop farm are behind us. No way you could cash flow the 7000+ acre dirt around here. You are going to have to want it real bad and be willing to do some of the things suggested on these posts or anything else you can think of yourself. Be thoughtful in all that you do.

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Clint Youse MO

03-09-2007 20:25:56

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to BOBM25, 03-09-2007 09:15:09

BOB I know what you are going thru I am 25 and bought my farm a year ago I couldnot compete with the rowcrop guys that are farming 3000 to 6000 acres in my area so I went another route with animals I got a sow farrowing operation that I bought off of a guy I worked for in high school. The first thing you need to do is talk with a good banker than check into the beginning farmer loans thru the Farm Service Agency office in you county it is low interest govt loan to help us young guys get started. I went to all the trouble now my state senator wants to ban the construction of any more CAFOs (concentrated animal feeding operations). but that is the only way i could come back and farm If any questions you can email me

Clint

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kyhayman

03-09-2007 18:47:07

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to BOBM25, 03-09-2007 09:15:09

Rent, lease, and save. Your time will come. I felt exactly like you do now back in 1980. Good land here was bringing $2000 an acre, cattle were 60 cents a pound. No way I could make it work. So I share cropped, worked off the farm, and saved everything I could. Every penny I spent went into revenue assets. I drove a junk truck, owned junk equipment, rented equipment if I needed something decent, and bought good cows. It took 7 years, land came down, I had cash in the bank and that same farm sold to me for $1000 an acre.

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msb

03-09-2007 16:15:53

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to BOBM25, 03-09-2007 09:15:09

Patience, patience, young man. Reading your post tells me a couple things. Youngsters are still born with that gung ho attitude that says they should be able to jump in where no one before them ever could. The other and much more important thing your post tells me is now is SIMPLY not a good time to buy land unless you have the cash setting in the bank.
Keep your nose clean, your powder dry and don't make any enemies.Your time will come if you wait for it to come to you.

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FreeRanger

03-09-2007 15:07:31

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to BOBM25, 03-09-2007 09:15:09

Owning land is complex game today.

In 1996, my wife and I wanted to move out of the city to small acres. Kept looking in bigger circles out from the city but couldn't find anything "affordable" in the county. So move circle farther out into next county. Summer of 1997 stumbled across three parcel being sold by a foreiner who inherited the land many years previous. We purchased the smallest and least desirable peice of 24 acres with NO road frontage for $1,800/acre. At the time most land was going for $3,000. In 2005, I could have purchased adjoining non-buldable 20 acres for $5,000/acre but I could afford to add more loans. Today, 20 acres if you could find it cost $12,000.

We actively farm 20 of the 24 acres to keep our taxes down. Otherwise I couldn't afford the taxes on this property. This year I paid $5,000, if no farming I worry taxes would be over $10,000.

All the rich baby-boomers retiring from Chicago area are purchasing land in Southern Wisconsin. It's only a few hours drive back to their home towns and the price of land is a fraction of Chicago area land.

I don't see the price of land going down even if the price of gas continues to go up....they've got money to spend. (hopefully on horses because I'm selling horse hay! ;-)

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Poor caucasian guys like

03-09-2007 13:46:23

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to BOBM25, 03-09-2007 09:15:09

Buying land is tough, especially 150 acres at $5k per acre. Here is what you do. 1. Call up your congressman and tell him you need help. 2. Tell the governement that you qualify for all the minority handouts. say that you are Black, Indian (american) and Hispanic, your mommy didnt love you enough when you were a baby, your daddy is a disabled vet and you are too, and your dog died. Hey its worth a shot. 3. Knock over a bank.

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Jim St. Aubin

03-09-2007 13:38:05

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to BOBM25, 03-09-2007 09:15:09

I tried buying land for years. Its so difficult to do. Either they want a million bucks, literally, or its not the right piece, or whatever. Keep trying and trying. Someday you might hit the jackpot.

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buickanddeere

03-09-2007 13:03:54

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to BOBM25, 03-09-2007 09:15:09

Think that's bad. Imagine being in Europe and wanting to purcase land and farm. It just isn't possible.

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Allan In NE

03-09-2007 11:24:00

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to BOBM25, 03-09-2007 09:15:09

Aw heck,

Just to balance it out, I've got a lot of ground that isn't worth a plug nickel. :>(

Allan

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2x4

03-09-2007 19:04:33

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to Allan In NE, 03-09-2007 11:24:00

its gotta be worth something just to hold your 2 neighbors properties together

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Case DI

03-09-2007 11:18:04

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to BOBM25, 03-09-2007 09:15:09

My wife and I bought 80 acres about 8 years ago. It has a house, barn, pole building, etc. the house is from 1856 and wore out, but the ground was nice pasture and 15 acres tillable. We paid $110,000 for it. Back then land was a lot cheaper. and everyone though we were crazy. They (our friends)said we'd never be able to afford it. They were almost right. We scrimped and saved, especially the first couple years. Well, 2 years from now and it's paid off! We have rented it out to local farmers while we both kept our jobs, waiting to pay it off.
Some advise, do what we did. Talk to the farmers. If you're young and eager, like we were, you may find someone willing to sell directly to you. Thats what we did. We started talking to realtors and quickly realized that we could not afford a farm by purchasing in a conventional manner. So we talked. And talked. Eventually, we met a man about to retire who was looking to sell. He liked us, we talked about buying, and he sold to us directly. Also, he financed the sale! this is not as uncommon as you would think. He gets a nice check from us every year, taxes are less because it's not in one lump sum, it's backed by his ground (if we default he gets his land back)and he knows who's buying his land.
Try it. The hardest part is knocking on doors. get a plat book and start working. I tried to explain this to a friend of mine, but he did not believe anyone could really buy land this way. (the old fashioned way)I explained it to my brother, he listened, and bought 40 acres the same way. At 6 percent simple interest. Paid directly to the farmer who was retiring. It takes work, like anything that's worth it does. The hard part is separating yourself from the rest of the people that say it can't be done. PS. My friend still complains that he can't buy any ground.

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Triplerange

03-09-2007 11:14:04

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to BOBM25, 03-09-2007 09:15:09

If it was easy, everyone would be farming. If you're willing, be smart, be competitive and find a way to make it work. Otherwise, I'll be the only young guy doing it, which would be just fine with me. ;-)

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jack-iowa

03-09-2007 11:04:13

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to BOBM25, 03-09-2007 09:15:09

heck around c falls iowa $1.3 million for about 22.4 acres. can't even imagine it.

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dad's88

03-10-2007 01:23:55

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to jack-iowa, 03-09-2007 11:04:13

Yeah, but that's for ground with development potential, same way around here too. Scott County has the higest priced farm land in the state, always has had.

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03-09-2007 10:44:24

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to BOBM25, 03-09-2007 09:15:09

I don't think that's out of line at all.You have to remember that the dollar is in a highly inflationary mode so that 3/4 mill. will in short order seem cheap.If you are a young feller you could do well.

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1206SWMO

03-09-2007 10:28:29

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to BOBM25, 03-09-2007 09:15:09

Just 4 short years ago I bid up to $1200 per acre on the neighbors nice 80 acre farm across the road.Nothing had ever sold for much over $1000 before that but it ended up bringing $1425.It last changed hands in the mid 1930's.

Now we have dairy farmers from 10,000 miles away coming in here and paying as much as $3300 per acre.Now everyone thinks their land is worth that much or more.About 98 % of the people in this area have been priced out of the land market including many big farmers that mostly just rent.

Between 1972 and 1979 we saw land go up from $200 per acre to $1000 per acre.By 1986 it fell back down to $300-500 per acre.Will history repeat itself?Most land around here is in pretty secure hands as not much has been sold in the past 10 years.

Theres really only two ways to acquire land and thats marry it or inherit it.Its sad but true.The last time land cash flowed in this area was 1972.

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JOHN HARMON

03-09-2007 17:50:33

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to 1206SWMO, 03-09-2007 10:28:29

The same thing held true in the 1960's, times have not changed much,only the price of ground. No more is being made.

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WBWi

03-09-2007 12:14:51

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to 1206SWMO, 03-09-2007 10:28:29

Your last line reminds me of something I once heard "Find your dates in the phone book son....but look for your wife in the platbook!

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03-10-2007 01:29:25

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to WBWi, 03-09-2007 12:14:51

My neighbors say you can marry more in 5 min than you can make in a lifetime.

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Walt Davies

03-09-2007 10:25:43

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to BOBM25, 03-09-2007 09:15:09

I know what you mean but I'm on the other side. I bought 37.5 acres 15 years ago at $100,000 its now worth about $550,000 and climbing. its hard to farm land that's worth half a million dollars. Walt

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Nebraska Cowman

03-09-2007 10:24:40

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to BOBM25, 03-09-2007 09:15:09

Don't be so bitter. There are lots of ways to farm without owning the land. the times they are a changing and you better change with them or you will be lieft behind. Looking back is for old men.

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BOBM25

03-09-2007 11:31:37

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to Nebraska Cowman, 03-09-2007 10:24:40

No offense, Cowman, but around here there isn't other ways to farm. No land is rented out anymore. Its rented out till the elderly owner passes on, then the kids see $$$$$$$ and sell it all off. The family farm gets split up 4 ways from Sunday and some poor tenant farmer is now another 150 acres from making a living. The gentleman who owned this farm passed away recently in his 90's. The man everyone figures will buy it is in his 70's and his 50 year old son will farm it. The average age of the Ohio farmer is 59. It can't all be developed. Whats going to happen in 10 years? People need to eat. I graduated with 160 other kids, I can count on 1 hand the number of us who farm, who's going to do it all?

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Nebraska Cowman

03-09-2007 16:41:10

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to BOBM25, 03-09-2007 11:31:37

In responce to what people will eat, They will eat soybean grown in Brasil.

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Rick(IA)

03-09-2007 12:30:29

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to BOBM25, 03-09-2007 11:31:37

Yes, the farms get split up sometimes, but around here they're still being rented out. Unless you're living on the edge of a metropolitan area that's being developed, the landowner still needs a return on his investment and around here that means renting it out. There are a several doctors who buy up a lot of farmland around here, but they're still renting it out to younger, efficient farm operators who are willing to pay a decent enough rent to make it work for all parties concerned. The only difficulty for the little guy is competing with the guys who are renting enough land to really know their cost of production and are willing to pay top dollar rent. It's nothing new...it's a process that's been going on here in the cornbelt since the Depression.

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03-09-2007 11:51:15

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to BOBM25, 03-09-2007 11:31:37

I can understand your frustration, I work in the ag industry full time and also farm a little. I would like nothing more than to farm full time. It is really hard to get obtain land. But, I am very optimistic. The average farmer around here is no different than there. I look at that as a tremendous opportunity! I feel that it is as important as ever to try and build relationships with retiring farmers to try to secure land to farm in the future. I realize that land turnover is high and nothing is guaranteed, but many farmers have still managed to prosper under these situations for years. My advice to you is that if farming is truly your passion and is what you want to do, then learn as much as you possibly can about how to make it pencil out for you. Find people to help you come up with budgets, estimated costs of production, and then be ready when an opportunity presents itself. Trust me, if you look hard enough, they will be there and if you dont see them someone else will.

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Easy1

03-09-2007 10:20:40

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to BOBM25, 03-09-2007 09:15:09

OK... If it was your land, wouldn't you want it to bring top dollar? If you get left 100 acres worth $500,000++, you will be far better off than 99% of the population.

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Keith Allen

03-09-2007 09:58:21

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to BOBM25, 03-09-2007 09:15:09

My heart goes out to you . I live in the country and drive 46 miles one way to work just to stay in the country , I have a 1 acre lot, in a subdivision , and would truly love to have my own spread of say 5 acres LOL just to play in with my antigue tractors, but price is the deterent. I love the smell of a hand full of freshly turned soil, the crisp fall nights , and the smell of a freshly plowed field. I can only imagine how it would feel to want to make a living from this land and not to be able to , good luck to all you .
Keith

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Cue P.

03-09-2007 09:41:43

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to BOBM25, 03-09-2007 09:15:09

Big problem up here in the northeast. I"ve wanted a little land for the longest time but with developers paying top dollar, most of the farms in my area are gone, or one could never afford without hitting megabucks. You have to have the land in your family for generations to be able to do anything with it now...and then you cant afford the property taxes either!

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rrlund

03-09-2007 10:25:03

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to Cue P., 03-09-2007 09:41:43

Isn't just development land. I read last night where 719 acres of ag land in Fayette County Ohio sold at auction for 3.4 million. Guess you'll have to come to Michigan. I'm chairman of township board of review,we just lowered land values here to $2200 per acre. At a land auction a year ago a couple of tillable 40s sold for 1700 per acre.I'm telling you,the states economy has completely colapsed,it's in a freefall. If you're a farmer,it's the place to be. We'll be tearing down neighborhoods and farming over them pretty soon.There is an ethanol plant 30 miles from me and a new one under construction about the same distance in another direction.

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dad's88

03-09-2007 13:23:52

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to rrlund, 03-09-2007 10:25:03

Hey Randy that sounds great to me. Always wanted to farm more anyways. As a bonus we could "play tractors". Have ya got a sandbox that will hold my 30+ "toy" Olivers?

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rrlund

03-09-2007 16:41:39

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to dad's88, 03-09-2007 13:23:52

Might have to put an addition on the side of the hay barn for them,but as long as I can use them now and then. Did you see what I posted on the Oliver site about the Oliver HartParr Cockshutt show in Ionia this year? They have an indoor tractor pull in the arena too.Don't know why they don't use the grand stands. They have NTPA Grand Nationals there.

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dad's88

03-10-2007 01:46:59

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to rrlund, 03-09-2007 16:41:39

Is that show close to you? Pretty nice show is it? How many tractors do they draw? Tractor pull too? Would love to pull the SUPER88 diesel a little this year. Should be back together after a 7 year layoff, I can't wait!

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JoeBob/IN

03-09-2007 12:28:25

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to rrlund, 03-09-2007 10:25:03

What ethanol plant is 30 miles from you? Just curious if it is in IN.

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rrlund

03-09-2007 16:37:45

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Re: What's a guy supposed to do! in reply to JoeBob/IN, 03-09-2007 12:28:25

Nope,Michigan. We're north of the USBioWoodberry plant. They have started construction on a 100 million gallon plant in Ithica.

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