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Tractor Talk Discussion Forum

the new diesel?

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bill from MA

08-09-2006 19:08:04




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So what is it with the new diesel? I just saw a sign on a pump saying "can't be used in 2007 and newer vehicles".

I know MA has some regulation delaying the introduction of cars & trucks that use this cleaner fuel.

Will older iron be okay with?

Bill




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John M

08-10-2006 03:13:55




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 Re: the new diesel? in reply to bill from MA, 08-09-2006 19:08:04  
ULSD is currently being blended in to meet the requirments by 2007. The sticker you saw will be changed on or before Jan. 1 07. No 07 diesels are being released until the fuel is all ULSD. Dont worry about your old iron.



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NC Wayne

08-09-2006 22:38:46




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 Re: the new diesel? in reply to bill from MA, 08-09-2006 19:08:04  
I'm not sure how far back the online version of diesel progress goes so far as reading past articles but in the print version there have been articles for some time now concerning the new Ultra low sulfur fuel. It's basically like one post said, the higher sulfur content of the current on highway fuel tends to cause premature plugging of the DPF's (diesel fuel particulate filters) used with the new engines. The EPA requires a minimum of 150,000 miles before the first ash removal but if damaged and in need of replacement a new DPF is estimated to run in the $5000-7000 range. Add to that the real problems for the consumer in that it has a lower BTU content than todays #2 duel and is expected to reduce MPG around 2% along with being say 5 to 10 cents more expensive and there you have it. For one large trucking company this reduced MPG is expected to cost them nearly 8 million a year, not including the cost increase of the fuel...and we thing we have rpoblems...according to the article in this months issue. As far as the availability of the "regular" stuff, ULDS will be the only fuel permitted by 2010. In the end it all boils down to the EPA doing what's looks good on paper for the environment, if everybody could afford or wanted to own a brand new vehicles every year, but not really seeing or caring about the real world consequenses of their rules as applied to the rest of us....Just my .02.

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Bob

08-09-2006 22:04:47




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 Re: the new diesel? in reply to bill from MA, 08-09-2006 19:08:04  
bill,

Do you HAVE a 2007 or NEWER vehicle?

No?

Well, no problem, then!

(The catalytic convertor and other emissions components of 2007 diesels need BETTER fuel than the older vehicles. The fuel from the pump you saw is PLENTY good for the vehicles OLDER than 2007 models.)



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Bill from MA

08-10-2006 05:33:32




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 Re: the new diesel? in reply to Bob, 08-09-2006 22:04:47  
No, but I am interested in one. Seems it will be difficult if your the first person on the block with one and can't find a station who as switched yet.



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john in la

08-09-2006 21:54:51




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 Re: the new diesel? in reply to bill from MA, 08-09-2006 19:08:04  
You are seeing the old diesel not the new stuff.

If you can remember when we changed from regular leaded gas to no lead gas back in the 80's and think of it in that matter it is a lot easier to follow.

While I do not remember all the dates I will try to explain it to you.

Years ago there was only high sulpher diesel. (less than 5000 ppm of sulpher) Now a days high sulpher can only be sold for off road use and must be dyed red.

To cut emissions they came out with low sulpher diesel. (less than 500 ppm of sulpher) This is road diesel and can be sold green (road use) or off road (dyed red) This is the stuff they are selling out of the pump marked can not be used in 2007 vehicles.

To cut emissions even more the law has changed that after June 1 2006 manufactures must start phasing in Ultra low sulpher diesel. (less than 50 ppm sulpher) Stations have a even longer time to phase it in but I think it needs to be 100% for all road diesel in 7 years.

Since all 2007 diesel vehicles can ONLY use Ultra low diesel and stations can sell either Ultra low or regular low during the phase in period all pumps that have the old diesel; low sulpher; must be marked with a sign that says this diesel can not be used in 2007 or newer vehicles.

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Bill(Wis)

08-09-2006 19:52:29




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 Re: the new diesel? in reply to bill from MA, 08-09-2006 19:08:04  
Let me take a guess. After 1 Jan, 2007 there will no be diesel fuel sold with sulfer in it. That means the manufacturers of diesel engines built after 1 Jan, 2007 don't have to build engines that will clean out sulphurous emissions. The two go hand in hand. If MA has the approval to continue selling diesel fuel after 1 Jan, 2007, that has sulphur in it, then that fuel shouldn't be used in the new engines that won't be designed to clean those emissions. There, that's my guess.

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