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Which tractor to buy? 4020?

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Lidya

07-25-2006 20:25:36

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I'm an unemployed mother of four and going to college. My husban works 60 hour weeks to make ends meet. That said, we just purchased some property and want a good tractor on a very tight budget. My husbands grandpa had a 4020 and he loved driving it around. Would you recommend this tractor? Could I find one for under 3 thousand? We would use it to bale 15 acres grass. How long would it take to pay for it with the hay? Thanks for the advice!

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Dave from MN

07-27-2006 09:56:17

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Re: Which tractor to buy? 4020? in reply to Lidya, 07-25-2006 20:25:36

I myself KNOW that if you dont have expensive eqiupment. Like me, you can make some money on that 15 acres, or use it yourself for feeding. I am tired of peoiple always telling others to rent their land out. I am quiting renting mine out. Should have last year already. Sure, scare the land owner out of running, rent it, enroll it in programs, grow nothing but RR beans and corn for years, cause the weeds to become resistant to round up, and laugh all the way to the bank cause the government paid your rent and more. This aint directed at anyone in particular, but you all know darn well its what is going on. It's your 15 acres do with it what you will. Just dont borrow to do it.

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Kelly C

07-27-2006 21:35:30

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Re: Which tractor to buy? 4020? in reply to Dave from MN, 07-27-2006 09:56:17

You sure can. I have about $8000 in my equipment. Made $5000 year before, $7000 last year and $7500 this year on 30 acres. I think my hay paid for my Equipment and its still worth what I paid for it.

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gene bender

07-27-2006 02:28:37

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Re: Which tractor to buy? 4020? in reply to Lidya, 07-25-2006 20:25:36

the cost of making the hay with all the stuff you need to buy on just 15acres will no way justify you owning any equipment. rent out the 15a should bring anywhere from 50-150 per acre if the land is any good and if it is poor land it wont raise any hay either. where do you live? have you checked into what it will cost per acre to raise hay on your ground. better check with your local extension office to get cost figured.

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JohnDeereGreen

07-26-2006 13:21:32

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Re: Which tractor to buy? 4020? in reply to Lidya, 07-25-2006 20:25:36

To really answer this, we need to know more about what ground you have. Is it flat, rolling, or fairly steep? Also, will you be using it for anything else, like loader work or running a bush hog? There's no way you'll ever find a 4020 for under 3 grand. They are in decent demand, and are easily bringing 8 to 10 thousand.

I think I would try to get someone to bale for you on shares, and then try to sell what you get as your share. On 15 acres, it will be very, very difficult to pay for the equipment needed to bale. If it were possible, you'd see a lot more people making small patches of hay.

Again, I would try to get someone to bale on the shares, or just rent the ground from you. If they rent it, you're guarenteed the money, and there's no hassle handling hay.

I'm not trying to sound negative, but it sounds like you're already in a pinch, and buying all the equipment for haying 15 acres won't help your problems.

Best wishes and good luck,
JohnDeereGreen

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cj3b_jeep

07-26-2006 12:23:30

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Re: Which tractor to buy? 4020? in reply to Lidya, 07-25-2006 20:25:36

I saw an Oliver 1850 go at auction recently for around $1600, ran like a champ, that would be a great tractor for your haying. MF 135 is a great all around tractor. Get the diesel if you can, they were a perkins and diesels run a whole lot cheaper than the gas versions. If you look around at auctions and such you'll find what you need. 15 acres of hay will not make you all that much money, but might keep up your maintenance + a bit extra.

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Bob/wis

07-26-2006 10:35:13

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Re: Which tractor to buy? 4020? in reply to Lidya, 07-25-2006 20:25:36

Well I geuss it time for a case guy to chime in. I would pick a 930 comfort king. They have good hyd, 3 pt hitch and wide fronts. Now days with the price of fuel one has to look at fuel economy too. Most will agree the 930 was about the cheapest running horse power out there. It will close to the 4020 power. One benifit over a deere is that if the tractor stall or dies in the field it still has brakes and still turns. We lost a local kid last summer to a 856 the hyd went dead on. If you watch around and bid your time you should beable to get one from about 1500 too the 3000 range. Just make sure its a diesel. We are small farmers and all we run for big tracotrs are cases.
Later
Bob

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Carp

07-26-2006 09:04:08

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Re: Which tractor to buy? 4020? in reply to Lidya, 07-25-2006 20:25:36

I have seen a lot of good suggestions below, so I thought I might add my 2 cents worth. This would be my picks of haying tractors under $3,000
IH tractors can be had for well under your costs. I would suggest as others a 300 through 560 with a fast hitch. My personal suggestion would be a 560 diesel. This is the most modern of the bunch and is big small enough to do the work and big enough if you grow.
In an allis I would go with a d-14 through d17. More modern than the WD's and very good tractors
In fords andy of the 600/800 series and clear up into the 3000 and 4000 can sometimes be bought for your budget. These are great tractors for what you are looking for, even though I am not a ford man.
Massy also has good tractors models 35 to 65.
I don't really know enough about the others except for JD and I cant really think of a good JD that will do the work and fit into your price range unless maybe the JD's from the late 50's, and they are probably a bit pricy for what you get.
The reasons for my choices is that they all to the point of being fairly modern, all have live PTO, live hydralics, 3 point hitch or readily avialable conversions, are fairly reliable and easily repaired and most improtantly can be had for your budget.

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Allan In NE

07-26-2006 09:22:27

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Re: Which tractor to buy? 4020? in reply to Carp, 07-26-2006 09:04:08

Oh I dunno,

A little 50 or even a 60 John Deere might work. But, what are they selling for now?

'Spose since they are painted green they are bringing around 99 thousand or so? :>)

Allan

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Lance R.

07-26-2006 20:39:56

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Re: Which tractor to buy? 4020? in reply to Allan In NE, 07-26-2006 09:22:27

Allen, I don't of many people who would want to use a 50 or 60 as a loader tractor too.

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Jim Oliver

07-26-2006 06:39:27

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Re: Which tractor to buy? 4020? in reply to Lidya, 07-25-2006 20:25:36

I have worked a lot of different brands of tractors in the same size range. Oliver is the best bang for the buck. Easy to work on, more power, more fuel miser. I have two Olivers and a WD45; the Olivers are rated less power but will run circles around that 45.

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Rauville

07-26-2006 06:11:51

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Re: Which tractor to buy? 4020? in reply to Lidya, 07-25-2006 20:25:36

If I where you, I would have someone put up the hay on shares, at least for the first year or two. Sell your share back to the operator, or try the hay market yourself. Take your time, and look around for the right tractor, and necessary equipment. Everything will come together if you exercise patience. You are getting a lot of good solid advice here...the best of which is that 4020's are too expensive and too big for little operations.
Good Luck in your quest.

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dhermesc

07-26-2006 06:07:55

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Re: Which tractor to buy? 4020? in reply to Lidya, 07-25-2006 20:25:36

The 4020 will never be paid for using it on 15 acres of hay, as stated below one in decent condition will run over $7000, and one in poor condition will cost a lot more in parts in the long run. I'm biased but I think the 300-350 IH Farmall ($1500-$2500) is the route to go. The haying equipment could easily run more then the tractor. Decent sickle mowers run $300+, a good baler runs $500-$1000 and rakes run $300+, if you're thinking about buying at a dealership you could easily double (or more) all the prices I listed.

The one thing that could cut down on the investment is swapping labor and sharing equipment with a neighbor who has a similar sized set up.

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Dachshund

07-26-2006 05:32:39

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Re: Which tractor to buy? 4020? in reply to Lidya, 07-25-2006 20:25:36

No matter what tractor you buy, there are gonna be nay-sayers telling you ya done wrong! How many acres TOTAL do you have and what OTHER jobs do you have in mind for the tractor? Loader? Brush hog? Snow Blade? Finish mower? I'd look at for sale adds online and in "Penny Press" type papers as well as dealers, auctions, and newspapers. The other equipment can be had cheap at farm auctions, too. Look for a small square baler that is TWINE, not WIRE tie. Depending on where you are located, balers and other hay equipment (here in SE Nebraska anyway) are still cheap at auctions. Several nice balers have gone in the $150-$200 range, rakes around $100, sickle mowers (get the "pitmanless" kind, if you can) for $400. Hay racks are going for $100- $300, or you can build one yourself.
You won't find the JD in your price range, but the IH 400, 450, 460, are great hay machines. I use an 8N to mow/rake, and an IH 454 to bale. Yesterday I helped a neighbor bale and ran a JD 3020 to bale with a NH 273 baler and pulled a rack. It worked great, but will probably still be out of your price range. A Ford 3000/4000/861/961 would also be a good choice. Massy makes some fine machines that sell reasonable. Look around and see what's out there. Live PTO, Live Hydraulics, 3 point and wide front end would be the things I'd look for, especially if you have other uses in mind. GOOD LUCK and GOOD HUNTING!

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hay

07-26-2006 05:31:40

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Re: Which tractor to buy? 4020? in reply to Lidya, 07-25-2006 20:25:36

perhaps consider something like the Ford 4000 diesel. it has plenty power(52 pto hp) and parts and service are widely available for it. they are popular all around utility tractors and will run either a square or round baler. usually the Ford 4000 can be had for the $3500-$5000 range.

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Dave from MN

07-26-2006 05:29:46

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Re: Which tractor to buy? 4020? in reply to Lidya, 07-25-2006 20:25:36

I baled last year with a $750 Farmall "H" and a $100 hew holland "super 66". I wasnt the fanciest guy on the block, heck I mowed with a bush hog and didnt even rake. Just picked up what I could, gave the hay to the cousens for horses. That is a low cost set up, but I learned to drive on an H and a newbie on one would have trouble baling. I would reccommend a farmall 300 or 400. Look for mech sound, pretty dont mean nothing unless it LA. An older JD with hand clutch will be very awkward for you unless you have driving them in the past. If $3000 grand is your max budget I would reccomend just getting either a tractor and borrow from neighbors the implements. Or buy the implements now and borrow a tractor. May cost ya a little $$ but most good neighbors will let ya borrow a tractor for a little help around the farm. My baling rig will be my H or 544, my $100 baler, my (getting today) $100 NH 56 rake, and 2 $100 hay racks. Last 3 are from a good older neighbor. I can have the 68 baler for a $100 bill as well. Supposed to be much nicer than my 66. Shop around and you can get a cheap set like that also.

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jubilee johnny

07-26-2006 05:01:48

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Re: Which tractor to buy? 4020? in reply to Lidya, 07-25-2006 20:25:36

Even though I'm a green lover a lot of folks around here use Massy Ferguson's for hay. I don't know prices either. I love a 4020 too but it is probably TOO big for the acreage you have.

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richard in nz

07-26-2006 04:27:52

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Re: Which tractor to buy? 4020? in reply to Lidya, 07-25-2006 20:25:36

Dont forget when you have purchased the tractor you will need to buy the machinery to make the hay with,mower,tedder and baler etc. May be worth considering selling the standing crop or getting a local farmer or contractor to do the work for you, but then of course you wont get the enjoyment or satisfaction of doing it yourselves.

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Kelly C

07-26-2006 04:08:35

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Re: Which tractor to buy? 4020? in reply to Lidya, 07-25-2006 20:25:36

The very best buy for a haying tractor right now would be a Farmall 300 or a 400.
I would recomend the Farmall 400 with a fast hitch. It has 50 hp, Live hydrolics, Live pto and a TA. Can be purchased for a song in the $2000 range. In my opinion it is the best small bale haying tractor value you can buy. But then again I am biased :-)

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NcNE

07-25-2006 21:59:01

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Re: Which tractor to buy? 4020? in reply to Lidya, 07-25-2006 20:25:36

Lidya
I 4020 is a very good tractor and still remains popular, however they still hover in value around the $7-10,000 range which is obviously way more than you want to spend. As some of the others have stated, it is a rather big tractor for 15 acres of hay and such. A smaller tractor would probably be more than enough to use as a haying tractor. An Allis Chalmers WD45 or the D-series (D14,15,etc.)would be adequate. Olivers can also be had for a reasonable price, I just browsed the photo ads and there were a few decent sized tractors, 1650,1800 and similar for somewhere close to $3000. A farmall 300,400,along with the 50 series or the 460, 560 would be a good haying tractor too. I noticed a few 806s in your price range. The 806 farmall was one of the 4020's biggest competitors. In any case you will want to look for a tractor with live hydraulics and pto. 3 point hitch would also be a great thing to have due to the many implements you can equip your tractor with such as rear blades, bale movers and etc. Good luck in your quest and if you have any other questions post on the board as there are many knowlegable people in this and the other forums that would be glad to help.

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Bill(Wis)

07-25-2006 21:11:46

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Re: Which tractor to buy? 4020? in reply to Lidya, 07-25-2006 20:25:36

Oliver, Allis Chalmers (WD, WD45, D14, D15, etc.), Ford Jubilee, Ford 600, Farmall 300, John Deere 50, 520, Massey Ferguson 135, etc., Try to get something with live or independent PTO and hydraulics. Are you in an area where there are farm auctions? I don't know what the hay market is where you're at. Hay requires something to cut it, rake it, bale it and haul it. At least five pieces of machinery in addition to the tractor the way I count it. Add to that fuel, oil, grease, twine, parts and time. Can you do it? I don't know.

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Fern(Mi)

07-25-2006 20:52:33

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Re: Which tractor to buy? 4020? in reply to Lidya, 07-25-2006 20:25:36

May I suggest an Oliver 1850 desiel. Sleepers easily purchased for lower prices, extremely easy to work on and good parts availability. We've three 1850 Ollies, a 4010 & 4020 JD. Will never buy another JD.
Oliver spoiled
Fernan

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want_GOOD_tractor

07-25-2006 20:31:29

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Re: Which tractor to buy? 4020? in reply to Lidya, 07-25-2006 20:25:36

A 4020 would be WAY WAY!!Over kill for 15 acres...Also No way in the WORLD to get a 4020 for under 5000 even if it were a gas burner...
I would look at the Ford 8N tractor...

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Gerald J.

07-25-2006 21:02:40

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Re: Which tractor to buy? 4020? 8N???? in reply to want_GOOD_tractor, 07-25-2006 20:31:29

And 8N is a toy.

but the 4020 is out of the budget. Though it would be comfortable and even if almost worn out wouldn't wear out the rest of the way in 25 years on 15 acres.

Gerald J.

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davpal

07-26-2006 00:13:19

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Re: Which tractor to buy? 4020? 8N???? in reply to Gerald J., 07-25-2006 21:02:40

That 8n toy sure wouldn't have any problem baling 15 acres of hay either. My dad used to bale a couple hunderd acres every summer with a farmall H. A $1500 dollar H or a $2000 dollar 9n or 8n would work for them for years and be able to be sold for the exact same price they paid for them today. People on this board have lost their minds. 15 acres is a big yard, and a toy tractor does a pretty good job in a yard.

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John M

07-26-2006 03:29:20

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Re: Which tractor to buy? 4020? 8N???? in reply to davpal, 07-26-2006 00:13:19

My neighbor uses a Ford 741, and a another Ford that Im not sure what it is to cut, rake and bale my 15 acres.

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MN Bob

07-26-2006 06:17:38

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Re: Which tractor to buy? 4020? 8N???? in reply to John M, 07-26-2006 03:29:20

Just could not help but add my 2 pennies. I see the AC WD/WD45 etc was mentioned and that brings up hydralics for the mower. I have just learned that WD series are hi pressure, at least some of the sickle mowers wont handle that and blow the seals on the ram. Check it out and get matching equipment. A 4020 is great I have a 4010 with upgrade. An IH 560 or even the 400 would be a good match for you and less money. You should be talking to area farmers tell them what you plan. Some may have just what you need setting unused due to upgrades. Good luck, Bob

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JMS/MN

07-28-2006 22:06:49

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Re: Which tractor to buy? 4020? 8N???? in reply to MN Bob, 07-26-2006 06:17:38

The sickle mower is not the issue- you just buy the right ram for the tractor. That's a $30-50 item. But it is comical to witness the discussion of 100 hp tractors to cut and bale 15 acres, especially for those of us who grew up on farms of several hundred acres, with 2-3 tractors, none of which larger than a WD45.

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