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Tractor Talk Discussion Forum

Wood Post preservative treatment question

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Billy NY

07-21-2006 10:57:18




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Ok, here is a fun one, I am starting phase II of a home project that has been expedited due to free use of a late model CAT 420 backhoe for the past few weeks.

I am going to utilize some timbers that have been hanging around since the late 70's, they are 6" x 8" x 16's and were pressure treated, I think Wolmanized going back that far, which I assume is the same as the copper chromated arsenate pressure treatment used for so many years up to the current time. Not sure if they were .40 CCA or .60 CCA which is more heavily treated. They have been stored up in the air and are in excellent shape, although I dug them out of a stack of materials that I obtained from a project that went bust years ago and the material lay wasting away, carpenter ants did several of these in, but they stayed isolated in some pieces and did not even touch others, so I got em out of there in '00 I think.

I want to set them below grade and use them for posts, to create a 20' x 32' pole barn. Now realizing that these are so old, they may have retained some resistance to decay, but I would like to treat them with something to help them last as long as possible. I have found enough creosote to hand paint them 4 to 5 feet up, there are only 8 of them. I'm not going to deep as I want the ceiling height to be about 12 feet or so. I would have liked to excavate or drill the holes and encase in concrete, but this is another low budget venue, so I'll just set them and backfill and compact. I'm on a hill and the soil is well drained, not water, I just uncovered formwork at the base of my chimney footing that was still intact, amazing actually. So I'm thinking maybe the creosote is the strongest, but if anyone had any other suggestions I'd love to hear them. I wondered if creosote is still available anywhere, or just to the public utility companies for utility poles.

It's another low cost venue, even the roof trusses are free, just that they are short on the span by 6 feet, so I will have to retrofit them to make the span and tie in the upper frame work to really stiffen everything, I'll make it work no doubt and they are 2x6 top and bottom chord so I'll find a way to scab out and secure them, and strengthen to hold the load, they have good pitch, so with metal panels the snow may slide off, I won't count on it though.

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Rander

07-22-2006 08:42:07




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 Re: Wood Post preservative treatment question in reply to Billy NY, 07-21-2006 10:57:18  
I've had pretty good luck soaking the ends in Jasco Copper Brown Wood preservative < Link > for a few days before setting the posts. I found it a Lowe's locally. Most posts seem to rot worst at ground level and just below. Although it is ecologically a no-no, when back filling I'll put about a quart of old motor oil in the last 6 or 8 inches of backfill of each post. Also, I've always been told to put about 6 inches of crushed stone or gravel in the bottom of the hole before setting the post. That's suppposed to allow the bottom to drain and not have the post end setting in water. Don't know how much good it does but it doesn't hurt.

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noncompos

07-21-2006 15:11:09




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 Re: Wood Post preservative treatment question in reply to Billy NY, 07-21-2006 10:57:18  
AS IH2444 sez, drain oil was (is?) the poor mans preservative for years; only other thing I recall was once a year or so pouring a little oil on the ground around the posts...this was in southern NM and AZ, where dry has a whole new meaning. Used to work beautifully on dusty roads, too, until it became socially unacceptable...



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Midwest redneck

07-21-2006 14:48:32




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 Re: Wood Post preservative treatment question in reply to Billy NY, 07-21-2006 10:57:18  
How come you are getting material for free? sign me up for that, okay. Anyway I would coat the part of the post that is going in the ground with driveway tar or mastic may work too. Just my 2 cents.



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Billy NY

07-21-2006 15:31:17




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 Re: Wood Post preservative treatment question in reply to Midwest redneck, 07-21-2006 14:48:32  
I know, with the prices of material today we all need to sign up on the program. I keep a sharp eye out for anything that can be used, especially when it comes to an outbuilding like a polebarn or shed. On many construction sites I've worked in the past, I'll ask permission to grab anything I can use, and have neatly stored these goods for future use, without making a scrapyard out of my place. I've gotten some useful items as well, a dozen sections of regular pipe scaffold and braces, some odd sized scaffold, all kinds of lumber, useful scrap, things that are well worth grabbing, even hardware like high strength bolts, always finding hoards of those when steel goes up, and I've used them quite a bit, some are holding my tractor together, wheels and loader frame.


I have a flatbed dump to retrieve materials as well, just having a truck at the right time is a good thing in itself. Trusses I found at a farm owned by one of our employees, said they wanted to get rid of them, and I said no problem with that !

I see building materials in the local want ad as well, reasonable, buildings for sale to be re-located etc. etc., even at that with some careful craftmanship you can take a used structure, apply your labor, save a few bucks on material and still make something look nice. I think it's a fun challenge to make something from nothing, I see so much waste, it just amazes me. By all means I prefer new, but for some darn reason, it's a lot of fun and an interesting challenge to pursue alternate means for home projects.

Seems with the power company work on our land and their easement that bisects it, I was able to negotiate use of the subcontractors rented hoe and expedite the sitework I've been contemplating for a long time. One of the driving factors here is budgetary considerations and some industry experience, I'm no longer a company man, on my own now, so I've got to be cost conscious whereas before not so much, and still try and get things done.

But back to the wood preserving, again, a good one to ask here I thought, one of those things everyone has their own ideas about, I was thinking along those lines something Bituminous like you mention, mastic, tar, just wonder if that would trap moisture if it were to get in.

Nothing lasts forever, and in these soil conditions, seems like as long as I use something on the below grade part of the post, maybe extend the overhang a bit more to keep the soil drier, even with the age of these timbers it ought to last.

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IH2444

07-21-2006 11:21:44




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 Re: Wood Post preservative treatment question in reply to Billy NY, 07-21-2006 10:57:18  
I just set things like that down in buckets of used oil for a week or so and then put the oily end in the ground. I know not proper to use oil for that, but it works. I use 5 gal buckets and put how ever many posts in them as will fit. you might have to dump in some more oil after a couple of days though as it gets sucked up into the dry wood. This does not work for wet or unseasoned wood.

If you want to get proper, sit them in some type of preservative for a week or so or boiled linseed oil works well, but is not cheap. I use the boiled linseed oil technique for wooden porch posts on the bottom. They last 25 yrs without rotting at the bottom in this application. Not sure yet how long they last in the ground though, but so far just as long as new pressure treated lumber does.

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