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Tractor Talk Discussion Forum

O/T Coasting question

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Cheap Ba*tard

09-27-2005 10:28:47




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A question for those more familiar with the way an engine works. When you are going down a hill in a low gear & the rpm's are being pushed up is the motor sucking any more fuel than if you were coasting at an idle. I realize you should use low gear(& do)when hauling a load. I'm not to worried about stoping my VW.At the cost of fuel I'm willing to try to get the extra mile/gallon.




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MarkB_MI

09-27-2005 18:47:24




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 Re: O/T Coasting question in reply to Cheap Ba*tard, 09-27-2005 10:28:47  
I remember many years ago, researchers were able to get phenomenal gas mileage (for the times) without any major changes to the vehicle. They would disconnect the accelerator pump on the carb. (Maybe the power valve, too.) They would accelerate in the highest possible gear at full throttle until they got up to 45 mph or so. Then they would coast down to 30 mph or so and repeat the process.

Now this goes against the conventional wisdom that accelerating and deccelerating is bad for gas mileage, but actually it makes perfect sense: An internal combustion engine is most efficient at wide open throttle. What kills your gas mileage when you accelerate a carbureted engine is the enrichment circuit in the carb.

Now, to answer your question. Obviously, when you go downhill in low gear, your engine is converting the energy of your vehicle into heat. You will get better gas mileage coasting, but only if you don't use your brakes, and assuming you don't crash. For safety's sake, don't coast. One risk of coasting is that the engine can die, leaving you without power steering or power brakes.

The older carbureted engines would suck quite a bit of fuel going downhill in low gear, because the idle circuit is fairly rich. Hence the backfiring going downhill if you have an open exhaust. Newer electronic fuel injected engines keep the mixture optimal at all throttle settings.

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RAB

09-27-2005 13:05:08




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 Re: O/T Coasting question in reply to Cheap Ba*tard, 09-27-2005 10:28:47  
Now, if it is a fuel injected and electronically managed engine, then it probably does not inject ANY fuel as soon as the ECM senses this situation.
If it is carburetted, matter is as Rod and Jerry posted although most modern carbs reduce the fuel ratio as the vacuum increases. So really depends on how old your car is, as to how it copes with all these running situations
An engine running at idle should only burn enough fuel just to keep it going, and more to increase the rpms so higher gear and brakes is probably the least fuel option - but what about brake wear as a cost as well as those safety issues.
Regards, RAB

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Jerry/MT

09-27-2005 11:48:08




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 Re: O/T Coasting question in reply to Cheap Ba*tard, 09-27-2005 10:28:47  
As long as the throttle plate is closed (carbureted engine), the airflow through a spark ignition engine is at a minimum and so the fuel flow is at a minimum, since the engine runs at a near constant fuel air ratio. There is a bit more air going through the idle air port in low gear (high rpms) than in high gear (low rpms) because the pressure differential across the throttle plate(and idle port) are greater so a bit more air is going through the carb. I seriously doubt you'll notice the difference in fuel milage.

If you want to really save fuel, drive like you have an egg between your foot and the gas pedal. No jackrabbit starts as the stop light turns green, and don't accelerate quickly in other non-emergency situations. Cruise your VW around 55 mph.

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Cheap Ba*tard

09-27-2005 12:26:38




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 Re: O/T Coasting question in reply to Jerry/MT, 09-27-2005 11:48:08  
I assume the same is true for a turbo diesel (TDI)????? ? I already get ~50 mpg, just trying to get the most from every drop.



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RodinNS

09-27-2005 19:04:11




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 Re: O/T Coasting question in reply to Cheap Ba*tard, 09-27-2005 12:26:38  
Yes, the TDI would be the same. As I'm sure you are already aware, the mileage on the TDI goes downhill pretty quick over 60.... I wouldn't argue the 55 limit, if economy is your only goal. Determining if the small fuel savings is worth your time is another story...

Rod



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RodinNS

09-27-2005 10:57:44




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 Re: O/T Coasting question in reply to Cheap Ba*tard, 09-27-2005 10:28:47  
I doubt that you'll save any by coasting, unless you turn the key off. I wouldn't do that. Where you will save is by watching your acceleration time. The harder and faster you accelerate, the more fuel the engine will burn. Also, the faster you drive, the more fuel the engine will burn. AS a general rule, I try to gear up, throttle back. I've found over the years that most engines' fuel economy declines fairly rapidly after the engine passes the 2000 rpm threshold. I have a buddy that will gear down and throttle up quite often, and I'm sure that his mileage suffers because of it. However, he's the sort that can't keep his hoof up a bit, and worrys about tickets in the speed zones..... . HTH.

Rod

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