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Tractor Talk Discussion Forum

OT.. souping up a truck

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Tim Shultz

08-21-2005 20:42:33




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I was thinking about runing propane ti the air cleaner on my truck. it's a 79' F-100.
going to put the tank in the bed and run a hose though the cab wall under the dash and have a on/off valve and then to the air cleaner..
would this work? what kind of HP gains could I expect? THanks! Tim Shultz
e-mails~steerboy89@hotmail.com~




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Mark - IN.

08-22-2005 18:12:49




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 Re: OT.. souping up a truck in reply to Tim Shultz, 08-21-2005 20:42:33  
Was going down the road one day in the work truck, trying to find a station on the AM radio, and found one that came in clear. Was G. Gordon Liddy doing a talk show. Anyway, told or read a story, don't know if was true, but was so hilarious at the time, I about crashed was laughing and crying so hard, maybe because he was laughing so hard, he was crying and could barely get the story out.

As best I can remember, a couple of guys, sounded like moonshiners, took a turbin out of a huey helicopter and mounted it in the back of a Chevy station wagon, and somehow got it to work. They took the wagon out onto some back road or highway, fired it up, and shot down the road gaining more and more speed. As the story went, there was a hill that they went up and were going so fast, that the wagon naturally didn't hug the road coming down the other side, they just kind of kept airborne long enough to creame the side of a much larger hill, and unfortunately, was the end of them and the worlds fastest almost stock station wagon. I don't know if the story was true, but if it was and they were killed, I'm sorry for that. But the vision of a beatup Caprice Estate wagon going so fast the painted on wood's burning off the sides with two guys trying desperately not to spill their hooch... and I was in tears.

Mark

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leland

08-22-2005 18:49:59




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 Re: OT.. souping up a truck in reply to Mark - IN., 08-22-2005 18:12:49  
Liddy also told the same story claiming a guy in the desert done the same thing with a jado rocket off a c-130 so what one of his BS storys do you belive.



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Mark - IN.

08-22-2005 22:27:57




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 Re: OT.. souping up a truck in reply to leland, 08-22-2005 18:49:59  
I don't know Leland, neither really. It's just comical to envision.

Mark



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Tim Shultz

08-22-2005 15:35:29




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 Re: OT.. souping up a truck in reply to Tim Shultz, 08-21-2005 20:42:33  
boy can you guy's shoot down a good idea... :)
just so you all know had a freind of mine that had it done to a small block chevy. but he moved away... also come to think of it it might have gone to his carb.
have another buddy that has a truck that can run off of LP or gas.. anybody know how that works?
says he gets another 60 horse off the LP..
and if you guys have never tried it don't diss the idea.. Tim Shultz

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MarkB_MI

08-22-2005 19:30:06




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 Re: OT.. souping up a truck in reply to Tim Shultz, 08-22-2005 15:35:29  
Tim,

Before the days of fuel injection, it was quite common to convert gas engines to run propane. These would be "dual fuel", you could switch back and forth between propane and gasoline. However, I never heard of anyone getting more power on propane. Propane has less energy per gallon than gasoline. The main motivation has always been to save money. Even allowing for the reduced horsepower, it can be cheaper to run propane than gasoline.

My dad converted his fleet of pickups to propane back in the 70's. They were cheaper to operate, but the propane was a lot of aggravation (he had a hard time getting propane that didn't have a lot of oil and crap in it). The converted pickups definitely put out less power on propane.

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Can't even use my name

08-22-2005 19:21:34




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 Re: OT.. souping up a truck in reply to Tim Shultz, 08-22-2005 15:35:29  
I highly doubt he was gettin an extra 60 horse off the LP. We have an old Chevy that runs on LP or gasoline and you lose just a touch of power on the LP.



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buickanddeere

08-22-2005 16:25:38




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 Re: OT.. souping up a truck in reply to Tim Shultz, 08-22-2005 15:35:29  
Good idea. Only problem is it won't work. Getting extra fuel into an engine is easy. Making that engine pump more air to burn the extra fuel is the trick. 60HP??? I assume your buddy has the printout from the dynometer to prove this? If the gasoline metering system was terribly out of whack but the LP system calibrated bang on. Or maybe the engine has such high compression it knocked on gasoline but ran fine on LP. Then sure 60 even 100+ HP is possible. You likely didn't notice the engine was a turbo diesel. Or a gasser with NO2 injection along with the LP injection. Say, you are not mixing up NO2 injection with LP injection are you? A while back we had a genius figure out he could couple the shafts of a generator and motor together. Then feed the motor from the generator. And use the surplus power to run his house. He was all set to patient the idea to power companies. There seem to be a lot of people around who didn’t take basic science and physics in high school.

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Tim Shultz

08-22-2005 19:24:56




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 Re: OT.. souping up a truck in reply to buickanddeere, 08-22-2005 16:25:38  
hey there buck,
as a matter of fact it is FACTORY INSTALLED!!!!
so don't tell me it can't be done!!
and it don't run on gas and LP at the same time so I am told... one or the other...
but he has ran it on both he said....
but then the MPG goes way down for some resone. and YES HE HAD IT ON THE DINO! any more questions?
TIm Shultz



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buickanddeere

08-22-2005 19:53:34




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 Re: OT.. souping up a truck in reply to Tim Shultz, 08-22-2005 19:24:56  
Tim, you are getting some facts mixed up here. Well duh, of course the automotive factory system runs one fuel or the other except for a split second during transition. GM sold factory dual fuel gasoline/LP or gasoline natural gas pickups and autos. Ford even had a dual fuel engine that used a 2nd set of port injectors. The gasoline was isolated and liquid LP was squirted into the intake port instead of gasoline. That engine did increase a few horses but certainly not 60HP. Industrial spark ignition engines can be had with liquid LP or high pressure natural gas injectors. Then there is pilot ignition using natural gas or LP in diesel engines without using spark plugs in a true dual fuel mode. Otherwise in every other vapor feed system switching off the gasoline onto LP or natural gas reduces engine HP. When you started this thread you were talking about a tinkered up fire hazard such as a BBQ tank & regulator. Feeding gaseous LP into the air cleaner of an engine that wasn't mentioned being a turbo diesel. There has to be something wrong with that buddy’s dual fuel system. Factory computer calibration puts gasoline engine at full power into an over rich mixture that reduces peak power a few percent from ideal. The extra fuel does burn cooler and the unburned fuel does help carry away combustion chamber heat. This heat removal and rich mixture reduces the tendency of detonation. The over rich mixture also has too little oxygen to light off the cat converter with as well. Otherwise a full power sprint would melt the cat converter. Adding more fuel to such a system will only make the over rich mixture even richer. And reduce power farther. So tell us the whole story as you see it and somebody here will get you all straightened out. I have to wonder how this long gone buddy has more credibility that the various experts here.

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Tim Shultz

08-22-2005 20:13:14




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 Re: OT.. souping up a truck in reply to buickanddeere, 08-22-2005 19:53:34  
hey there again buck,
the buddy with the LP/gasser ain't long gone.. the buddy that is gone had the propane in the carb/air cleaner..
my buddy with the LP/gas live not too far away..
by the way his truck is a 77' F-350....
and he just bought it 'bout a month ago...
brought it right over to show me, never had seen one before but it was right in front of me!
I don't know how it works but it does! if any of you guys do please tell me. and stop bashing sumpin if you ain't got a clue! Tim Shultz

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buickanddeere

08-23-2005 13:55:15




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 Re: OT.. souping up a truck in reply to Tim Shultz, 08-22-2005 20:13:14  
Tim

Read through these posts and think it through logically. Tim lets see a picture of this 1977 one ton wonder. Judging by your spelling, grammar and your understanding of the laws of physics and chemistry. It's pretty clear who the who passed the highest level of education and has the best practical understanding on this topic. If you won’t believe me, read the posts from the other informed people. That old carburated engine must be running too lean and perhaps running with some detonation. A small percentage of LP vapor could richen the mixture to the ideal ratio for max HP. And the power reducing detonation would decreased by the higher octane and richer mixture. There is something out of the ordinary here that you are not telling us or you do not know about this LP assisted truck.

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buickanddeere

08-23-2005 20:41:09




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 Re: OT.. souping up a truck in reply to buickanddeere, 08-23-2005 13:55:15  
Good grief, that was ironic wasn't it.



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KIP in MX

08-23-2005 16:51:44




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 Re: OT.. souping up a truck in reply to buickanddeere, 08-23-2005 13:55:15  
You are correct about the subject, but you sure butchered your 3rd/4th sentence.



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Dick L

08-22-2005 14:15:22




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 If You Are Really Interested in reply to Tim Shultz, 08-21-2005 20:42:33  
Check out the link and what all you need to get the job done. Yes, just diesel.



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Eric Rylander

08-22-2005 13:55:22




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 Re: OT.. souping up a truck in reply to Tim Shultz, 08-21-2005 20:42:33  
With all due respect you need to do some reading and learn how things like propane fuel work as a power adder. Others are correct, what you are proposing is not going to gain you anything but a safety hazard.

I had a 17 year old going on and on about "Naawws" and I had him read a really good writeup on HOW IT FUNCTIONS (Nitrous Oxide) and then he had a better understanding of it, and what was needed to make it work correctly without damage to the engine.

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HotRodLincoln

08-22-2005 12:10:58




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 Re: OT.. souping up a truck in reply to Tim Shultz, 08-21-2005 20:42:33  
Years ago, back in the 1950's people use to use propane on tractors as a power booster. If done correctly you might gain 5 or 10 hp at the most. It is really to dangerous to mess with though.



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tortmort

08-22-2005 07:27:18




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 Re: OT.. souping up a truck in reply to Tim Shultz, 08-21-2005 20:42:33  
More displacement and better heads are the first steps to more power. Next nitrous and/or super or turbo charging. Propane is for diesel.



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BobMo

08-22-2005 07:16:17




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 Re: OT.. souping up a truck in reply to Tim Shultz, 08-21-2005 20:42:33  
I can't for the life of me figure out where you came up with an idea like this..... .



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Mike (WA)

08-22-2005 08:24:42




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 Re: OT.. souping up a truck in reply to BobMo, 08-22-2005 07:16:17  
Probably came to him as he drove by a propane tank in a service station that said $1.20/gallon.



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John M

08-22-2005 03:31:58




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 Re: OT.. souping up a truck in reply to Tim Shultz, 08-21-2005 20:42:33  
Unless its a diesel,you wont do much for your HP.



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MarkB_MI

08-22-2005 03:30:06




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 Re: OT.. souping up a truck in reply to Tim Shultz, 08-21-2005 20:42:33  
Would this work?
It depends on what you mean by "work".

What kind of HP gains?
Think HP loss, not gain. You would just enrichen the mixture. To get an idea, try driving with the choke wired partly closed.



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weedsabate

08-21-2005 22:53:13




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 Re: OT.. souping up a truck in reply to Tim Shultz, 08-21-2005 20:42:33  
No Propane.. check to see what water vapor can do foryou. The supercharger does work, with careful planning. As Lefty in a previous post, Propane Injection in Diesel works. I had a Daisy Injector I bought in OK. ran it in a naturally aspairated V8 Mack. knocked the smoke down and increased power some. Sorry I let that system go when I traded. I'm now setting up a VW diesel PU with a very small whiff of Propane under load. Involves micro switches,regulation, distribution, etc.
Jerry

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Blue Ear Jack Hacker

08-21-2005 21:41:59




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 Re: OT.. souping up a truck in reply to Tim Shultz, 08-21-2005 20:42:33  
Well, if you go ahead and try that, be sure and let us know which hospital burn ward you end up in.



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Lefty

08-21-2005 20:57:17




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 Re: OT.. souping up a truck in reply to Tim Shultz, 08-21-2005 20:42:33  
Not worth the effort,dangerous,and prolly illegal.LP flowing into the aircleaner"can" would reduce intake of needed oxygen,mess up proper fuel mixture and create a potential bomb in event of a backfire or such.A bad connection or leak in the cab/valve could also be deadly.And lastly free flowing LP with or without a regulator would not give any significant power boost.Propane can be"injected" into high performance turbo diesel engines for gain but is an alternate,NOT supplemental fuel for gas engines.

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cdmn

08-21-2005 20:56:31




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 Re: OT.. souping up a truck in reply to Tim Shultz, 08-21-2005 20:42:33  
I think you'll need a tank of nitrous oxide to go with it. Otherwise, you'll get a "too rich" mixture. The carb "thinks" it's still sucking in air, and meters the gasolene accordingly. Your talking about dangerous stuff.
If you are fooling around, see what water injection does for you. Or build a pressure box around the carb and install a supercharger. They sold them on 1990's Buicks and Pontiacs. Other cars such as SAABs used turbochargers.

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