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Tractor Talk Discussion Forum

engine noise diagnosis

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n8terry

07-17-2005 17:50:50




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I installed a Chrysler 6 cyl in my tractor. The engine came from a combine. I listened to the engine before I removed it from the combine and it sounded great.

After installing it in my tractor and it reaches operating temperature, I can hear a knocking sound.

I am expecting a loose rod at the worse, and the best I can hope for is a loose wrist pin.

How can I tell the difference between the two?

Damn, tractor restoration is sometimes a pain in the rear.

Anyone have any advice? I feel bad enough, so be easy on me.

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3rd generation ih

07-18-2005 15:28:47




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 Re: engine noise diagnosis in reply to n8terry, 07-17-2005 17:50:50  
A rod knocking noise will disappear or lesson when you take the spark plug wire off. There is no firing of the fuel mixture to force the piston down thus it won't make as loud of a knocking sound.



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Rauville

07-18-2005 08:06:02




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 Re: engine noise diagnosis in reply to n8terry, 07-17-2005 17:50:50  
Back when I would fiddle around with engines, a bad rod bearing would sound loudest when the rpms were up. Wrist pin noise while uncommon did occur at times. If it's a loose wrist pin that's slidding back and forth, the noise probably wouldn't be as consistent during operation as a bad rod (especially, when you get a double-knock).
Try the steel rod as described below, or a piece of garden hose held to your ear.
Another method is to cut the oil filter apart and spread the paper element out, and look for clues with a magnifying glass. Any bad rotating part is going to leave some metal particles behind.
Good luck!

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Thresherman

07-17-2005 19:05:55




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 Re: engine noise diagnosis in reply to n8terry, 07-17-2005 17:50:50  
Well, it sounds like a cool swap. To start with I bought a truck once with a bad knock, owner thought it was a rod, but I just thought something wasn't right. Turns out a pulley on th front of engine was loose. Could be something in the clutch maybe, A rod or wrist pin doesn't just go bad.
Fisrt determine area noise is coming from, front, back middle, high, low. If you pull a plug wire off it should help the noise lessen some, as that cyl won't be under power. Or use a steel rod pressed against the block. Put your ear to it, it works like the mechanic stethscopes.
I hope I was some help. Good Luck

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txgrn

07-17-2005 19:39:22




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 Re: engine noise diagnosis in reply to Thresherman, 07-17-2005 19:05:55  
What he didn't say and I am presuming is that he fired the engine off just long enough to say it worked and away he went with the installation.

After installation he ran it long enough for it to heat up and show it's colors. So an engine bearing could be the culprit...like when your oil pressure starts dropping and it isn't all the oil's viscosity thinning...also bearings getting hot and expanding.

But I wish him the best,
Maybe he just needs to run it for awhile. I bought a tractor recently that had a knock which disappeared after it ran for 30 minutes...and it hasn't returned in nearly a year.

Mark

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txgrn

07-17-2005 18:57:41




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 Re: engine noise diagnosis in reply to n8terry, 07-17-2005 17:50:50  
I was going to say what difference does it make but I then realized.....a lot. a wrist pin is a head removal; a rod bearing just the oil pan.

I never had a bad wrist pin. Have replaced mains and inserts however. The engine bearings take a heck of a lot more abuse and move a greater distance as compared to the wrist pin; and are much much softer.

Here I'm going to suggest you drop your pan for an investigation and I have a 4230 that I am worried about maybe some worn bearings and I won't drop my pan....Oh well, I'm human.

Read a couple of days on the site where a person said he knew what a wrist pin sounded like. I know mains go gong gong gong under load. Don't know what inserts sound like .

HTH

Mark

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