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Tractor Talk Discussion Forum

proper hydraulic.......follow-up

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dave-o

08-25-2004 07:29:27




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Thank you to all who responded to my post. I got great info from you guys and i feel like I have a better handle on designing a simple hydraulic circut, although I still have a lot to learn before I start adding hoses.

Here is the first thing for me to tackle, I need your help again. The attached picture is the vavle on my FEL on my 8N. The pump is on the front of the tractor. The problem I'm having is exactly one on the issues we disscused. The valve is controlling a single-acting cylinder. Power up, gravity down. When I engague the valve to let the FEL down I get engine loading. Is there an adjustment I can make to this valve to stop this? What is the screw on the valve for? Is the hose going to the cylinder connected to the wrong port? The bottom of the valve says " Char-Lynn " and the model # ,best I can tell anyway, is 1500. Thanks again. -dave

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Leroy

08-25-2004 16:58:36




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 Re: proper hydraulic.......follow-up in reply to dave-o, 08-25-2004 07:29:27  
I know Dunham used those very same water pipe fitings on their loaders from the factory. That is a double acting valve that needs to be converted to single acting, take to hydrolic shop because likely will need a different piece inside and or just buy a single acting and put in where this one is now and just move this one over next to the new one, outlet of first to in of second, out of second to return and you are set to go

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CJ

08-25-2004 10:10:33




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 Re: proper hydraulic.......follow-up in reply to dave-o, 08-25-2004 07:29:27  
Looks more like an industrial valve than mobile app.Just guessing,don't know where the char-lynn book is,you have a da valve.Take out plug (top of photo)plumb to return (tank).If it's da, that will cure the engine loading.The screw,hard to say,could be relief adj,if it has one-not all valves do-access for machining/assembly?Pretty much same problem you already ran into,I think.You can pretty much use any combination of parts (within reason),if they get hooked up right.

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CJ

08-25-2004 10:50:34




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 Re: proper hydraulic.......follow-up in reply to CJ, 08-25-2004 10:10:33  
Under the screw,a bypass adj maybe?Swap hose and plug,set bypass and it'll work sa?I'm not familiar with that one,hopefully someone here is.



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Gerald J.

08-25-2004 07:56:21




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 Re: proper hydraulic.......follow-up in reply to dave-o, 08-25-2004 07:29:27  
Eeeek! All that high pressure oil in 125 psi water pipe fittings! A split waiting to happen.

Looks suspiciously like a valve for a double acting cylinder with that pipe plug just above the cylinder hose. And when lowering that means the pump sees a blocked line and that will load the engine. You could remove that plug and pipe that to the oil return line to relieve the load. I have no idea what the screw might do. Its possible it does what you need, its possible it holds parts together.

Gerald J.

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dave-o

08-25-2004 08:40:21




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 Re: proper hydraulic.......follow-up in reply to Gerald J., 08-25-2004 07:56:21  
Thanks Gerald. The previous owner piped this himself. Which fittings should I replace. I gussing the 5 elbows that look new. The rest of the pipe is original to the ford/dearborn loader and I'm assuming that is ok? There is one metal elbow that connects the soild pipe attached to the loader to the cylinder hose from the valve. It looks original and looks quite simalar to the ones that the previous owner added. should I replace that one too?

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Gerald J.

08-25-2004 09:15:24




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 Re: Galvanized-no. Black iron-no in reply to dave-o, 08-25-2004 08:40:21  
Hydraulic fittings are never galvanized or black iron. Nor hydraulic pipe which is uncommon.

I'd replace everything that can ever have pressure in it that is not hydraulic hose or hydraulic fittings. I KNOW 8N were often plumbed with plain old water pipe. I had one plumbed that way. I have a MF loader that had 125 PSI street elbows on the cylinder ports of the valve (saved 6" on the length of each hose)

I've seen black iron elbows fail at 75 PSI water or 12 inches natural gas pressure. Probably from the forces of the tapered threads. I won't ride any where near any with 1500 or more psi hydraulic oil.

Gerald J.

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TheRealRon

08-25-2004 08:32:16




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 Re: proper hydraulic.......follow-up in reply to Gerald J., 08-25-2004 07:56:21  
Wow is right! You can use pipe for return lines but NEVER for high-pressure lines. Getting a bath in hot hydraulic fluid isn't good, getting an injection injury from a failed pipe/fitting can be fatal.

The make hydraulic hose and fittings for a reason!



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dave-o

08-25-2004 08:42:48




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 Re: proper hydraulic.......follow-up in reply to TheRealRon, 08-25-2004 08:32:16  
Thaks Ron, any comment on the engine loading problem and purpose of the screw?



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paul

08-25-2004 09:06:35




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 Re: proper hydraulic.......follow-up in reply to dave-o, 08-25-2004 08:42:48  
Take the valve, or the picture & model number, to a hydraulic shop near you & ask the questions. They will know.

What you want to do is possible.

But there are _so_ many variables. Sometimes the screw is an adjustable pressure relief under it, sometimes it is a flow valve that converts between regular & power beyond, sometimes it is just a cap for a way for them to insert parts inside the valve.....

Maybe someone reading here has experience with your valve, but an expert with a manual & parts description would really help you _know_ what you have without guessing.

Galvanized water elbows are not right for modern 2000lb pressure systems. I may have used one or 2 in my day myself, but never that close to the operator.....

--->Paul

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TheRealRon

08-25-2004 09:03:05




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 Re: proper hydraulic.......follow-up in reply to dave-o, 08-25-2004 08:42:48  
Gerald nailed the lack of a return line causing the engine to load. It's also putting a tremendous amount of heat into the fluid.

If you contact the pump maker or a vendor who sells them they likely would be able to tell you the function of the screw.

By the way, www.northerntool.com has a complete line of hydraulic fittings and hose; they even have hoses made to length. It's good stuff and you might even save a few bucks in the process.

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