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Need Advice on What Tractor/brand to Purchase????

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D. MAC (St. Lou

04-28-2004 06:20:07




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Background:
I just purchased some property, and plan to install a 1/2 acre food plot. I was planning to buy a disc harrow for my ATV, but decided not to because it would create alot of stress on my ATV transmission (Yam Grizzly)? So, I decided to get a small to medium sized tractor for my hobbies. But, I want enough tractor in order to do more advanced or larger plots in the future, if I decide to purchase additional land. Things that I may do with the tractor are: dragging logs, drilling holes w/ auger, grading, discing (600 lb disc harrow) & brushhoggin. Initially I was considering a Ferguson TO-30 (30 hp, 1952), but I'd like to make sure before I buy, because I don't want to regret not having more horsepower. I'm also considering a 1964 AC D19 (70 hp), seems to be in good condition, plus my cousins really like AC's. Another would be a JD 1010? I'm not real educated on all the styles and/or model of tractors, but any suggestions would be appreciated. Generally speaking, I'd like to stay with Ferguson, Ford, JD, or AC, I know these manufacturers have a good reputation. How about Yanmar tractors, dependable?, what make/motor is generally used in their tractors? Their prices seem to be reasonable?

Thanks for the guidance,
Dennis

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Farmer Dave

05-01-2004 15:21:18




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 Re: Need Advice on What Tractor/brand to Purchase? in reply to D. MAC (St. Louis, MO), 04-28-2004 06:20:07  
Why don't you just hire a local farmer to do your discing, bush hogging etc. It will be cheaper and safer.



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bill

05-01-2004 02:19:57




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 Re: Need Advice on What Tractor/brand to Purchase? in reply to D. MAC (St. Louis, MO), 04-28-2004 06:20:07  
call this 14177332501 hes got a jd with all Eqm it is a 40 jd



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D. MAC (St. Louis, MO)

04-29-2004 11:40:26




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 Re: Need Advice on What Tractor/brand to Purchase? in reply to D. MAC (St. Louis, MO), 04-28-2004 06:20:07  
How about a D14 versus D15 or D17? Do you think that will be enough power? or, do you think I should look for a D15/D17? I know where a D14 is for sale.....but it may be a bit small for my needs, not to mention a little rough around the edges.

What about a JD 2240 1980 model? Seems to be in great shape? @ $7800?



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buickanddeere

04-29-2004 08:14:23




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 Re: Need Advice on What Tractor/brand to Purchase? in reply to D. MAC (St. Louis, MO), 04-28-2004 06:20:07  
The stripped economy version of the Deere utility tractors 5000 05 series. Assembled in the US and can be had with four wheel drive. Suprising little more expensive than used equipment and comes with warrenty. And without wear,tear & deteriation caused by age and abuse.



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Dave 2N

04-29-2004 05:54:07




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 Re: Need Advice on What Tractor/brand to Purchase? in reply to D. MAC (St. Louis, MO), 04-28-2004 06:20:07  
As you can see, this question is kind of like asking, "What type of woman should I marry?" So here goes my $.02.....

3010's, 4010's, D-19's and that size range are way more than you need. I really think that for what you have in mind, a 20-40 hp tractor with 3 pt. hitch and maybe some good remote hydraulics will do you just fine. I do agree that getting something a little bigger is better than having a tractor that doesn't have enough power.

Knowing what I know now and if I were in your situation, I would get a Farmall H or M and buy a Saginaw 3 pt. hitch kit for it. Loaders are easy to come by for these tractors and they are more than enough for what you want. Parts are reaily available and they are great machines.

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Bill in Florida

04-28-2004 22:07:51




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 Re: Need Advice on What Tractor/brand to Purchase? in reply to D. MAC (St. Louis, MO), 04-28-2004 06:20:07  
Dear D.Mac. You got some good advice in the previous post. Big thing is get something you can get service and parts for easily. I like diesel becouse it is safer to fill the tank when the engine is hot. While anything from 30 to 60 horse power will do, remember that the old 8N's were only about 24hp and they were used for years. I think you should only get a tractor with a front end loader if you really need one. They are dangerous and you have to make sure the back end is weighted and it should have 4-wheel drive. Good luck.

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D. MAC (St. Louis, MO)

04-28-2004 15:00:51




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 Re: Need Advice on What Tractor/brand to Purchase? in reply to D. MAC (St. Louis, MO), 04-28-2004 06:20:07  
I believe I'm leaning towards these brands: Allis Chalmers, JD, Oliver & Ford. I really like the 3010's and 4020's JD, seriously they really look great! I don't have much to spend, but want something that will last, meet my needs now and in the future, as well as resale value if I choose too. In fact, I do plan to have the tractor restored, if needed! Only one problem, they seem to want an arm and leg for the JD 3010 & 4020's! I think my cousins would shoot me if they new I was even thinking about a JD. They are CASE and AC folk. My second choice would be AC D15 or D17 narrow front. I'm not convinced on the D19, it does seem a bit large for my needs. In fact, I'd like something around the 50 hp, would work fine. Man, I got educated quick on this site, this is addictive stuff, buying a tractor. I can't wait to tear some ground up! LOL. I appreciate all the insight and guidance. Another consideration, is Fords 3000 & 4000 if possible. They seem to be a reasonably good tractor. Do the JD 3010s and 4020s have power steering? How about the AC D15 and D17s? or the Ford 3000 & 4000?

Question: On most tractors JD, Oliver, etc...are the fronts interchangeable? for instance, narrow front swapped with a wide front, or vice versa? Is there kits available to do this? expensive? or not possible?


Thanks,
Dennis

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Adam B.

04-28-2004 20:21:58




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 Re: Re: Need Advice on What Tractor/brand to Purch in reply to D. MAC (St. Louis, MO), 04-28-2004 15:00:51  
The JD 3010/20 and 4010/20 tractors are very desirable for collectors and small acre or hobby farms. They generally sell for much, much more than they cost new. If you find one at a real bargain price (especially a diesel), question it's condition.

I did a search, the 3020's ranged from $5k-$12k.
Found some 4020's ranging from $7k-$12k.

At least for JD (dunno about other makes), the fronts are interchangeable. Our 4010 has a wide front that was donated from a 3020 (was originally a tricycle). They do have power steering.

If you decide to try and get one, either would be a super tractor and have more capability than you'd ever need for such a small area. Most likely you'll find them with a Synchro-Range transmission. The shift pattern takes some getting used to, but it's a nice unit. You may come across a Powershift. From what I've heard, that early Powershift was good but not great.

Good hunting. You're on the right track by asking lots of questions before buying.

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JMS/MN

04-28-2004 11:00:55




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 Re: Need Advice on What Tractor/brand to Purchase? in reply to D. MAC (St. Louis, MO), 04-28-2004 06:20:07  
You want to put in a 1/2 acre food plot, and might do more, with additional land? You certainly don't NEED a 70 hp D19 for that- along with it's cracked head problems. When I was growing up-50s, our biggest tractor was a WD45, no loader, no power steering, and we ran up to 560 acres! Along with a 1939 WC, Model C, and later the C went to a WD. Early years we had two WCs and 240 acres. If you want older tractors, there are many to choose from, Ford, Ferguson, JD, AC, etc. Some came with 3ph, others can have them added. It's comical to see how anyone that wants to buy a tractor for hobby use 'needs' power steering, live power, loader, etc. Sure, it is nice, but the people that fed this country for the last few decades could only wish for that. Now, it is considered essential. It is no wonder that foreigners think we are soft.

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Indydirtfarmer

04-28-2004 11:18:47




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 Re: Re: Need Advice on What Tractor/brand to Purch in reply to JMS/MN, 04-28-2004 11:00:55  
A few things. First. Not everyone that climbs onto a tractor, has been raised on one. Many end up in the hands of relatively inexperienced users. It's more essential to have all the "saftey features" available for that person, than someone with years of experience. Power steering is as much a "saftey feature" as a convienience. How many people do you think ended up with broken thunbs, over the years, when they hit a hidden stump while bush hogging without power steering. Same with "live PTO". It adds a saftey net when running PTO driven equipment. Secondly, why pick an old tractor WITHOUT any modern options, when there's a host of good candidates out there with "modern features". No, I wouldn't rule a tractor out, just becouse it didn't have power steering, but all things being equal, it makes for a better tractor. Lastly, when I buy something like a tractor, I'm looking at several things. Not least of which is it's "re-sale value" should I decide to turn it back onto the market. Power steering, live PTO, 3 point hitch, ect... are what makes most tractors sell. No one will dispute the hard life that old-time farmers went through. BUT....Given the chance to do it with newer, more up-to-date equipment, most would opt for the niceties of todays tractors. How many tractors do you recon are made/sold today, without power steering? JMHO John

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Mark in MO

04-28-2004 12:23:44




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 Re: Re: Re: Need Advice on What Tractor/brand to P in reply to Indydirtfarmer, 04-28-2004 11:18:47  
Yep, I'm sure that if Power Steering had been an option my Grandpa would have had it on his F20. As I've posted before, I went to a Sale a month or so ago and they sold a 801 Ford (without PS)Very good shape for $4,400. And also sold a JD 3010 Gas (with PS) also in Very good shape for $3,700. To me, that's a NO BRAINER. Just my O
Mark Hill
Dearborn,MO



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Indydirtfarmer

04-28-2004 13:56:25




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Need Advice on What Tractor/brand in reply to Mark in MO, 04-28-2004 12:23:44  
Those old Fords and Fergusons still command quite a bit of respect, and a very healthy price. They're popular with "first-timers", as well as some "old-timers". I'd take the 3010 in a heartbeat, even though it is gas. I had a 4020 gas a few years ago. I'm convinced that tractor was an Arab plot (to sell more gas). I'm halfway shopping for a good 3020 diesel now. Either that, or a 2520. John

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Mark in MO

04-28-2004 14:26:14




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Need Advice on What Tractor/br in reply to Indydirtfarmer, 04-28-2004 13:56:25  
Indy, Good choice. Although I've never owned either a 3020 or 4020 they are both good RIGS. There was a guy over in Kansas last Fall that had a 3020 Diesel that he had went completly through with 90% tires and new paint, and he wanted $7500. I didn't think that was too bad of a price, my wife was very happy that I didn't need a tractor. LOL



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Ben-UK

04-28-2004 10:20:23




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 Re: Need Advice on What Tractor/brand to Purchase? in reply to D. MAC (St. Louis, MO), 04-28-2004 06:20:07  
ID definetley be leaning towards a MF135.

They will turn on a sixpence so will be fine in half an acre, but then its still 47hp so will by fine if you expand, dpeending on what you do should be fine on up to about 20 acres.

If you do, try for the 3cyl Perkins diesel. The 4 cylinders are ok, but the 3 cylinders start much better.

Parts are easy to get hold of in most cases, and, unless you get a rubbish one, you probably wont need to work on it much, except all the usual maintenance fule filters etc.

IMHO you want to stay away from the TO unless it is very nice and cheap. They arent very powerul, probably too high geared, and dont have a live PTO. Steer clear of the John Deere as well. Ive heard bad things about that machine.

Ben

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Indydirtfarmer

04-28-2004 10:15:13




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 Re: Need Advice on What Tractor/brand to Purchase? in reply to D. MAC (St. Louis, MO), 04-28-2004 06:20:07  
For what you're wanting to do, you won't need a big tractor. Bigger USUALLY translates into EXPENSIVE when it's time for repairs. Look around your area. Notice what dealers are handy. If you have a (for example) New Holland dealer near, you might want to favor a Ford/New Holland. Parts, service, and dealer support is a very valueable thing. Unless you are really familiar with "older" tractors, stay with someting made since the mid 60's (or newer) They are a little more "user friendly" to the casual tractor user. You will want (Catagory 1) 3 point hitch. Live power, if you ever plan on using anything PTO powered. (i.e. a bush hog, tiller, ect). Power steering is at the top of the list too. Diesels are great, provided they're not worn out. They can be costly to rebuild. Gas engines are less expensive to rebuild, and they start easier in COLD weather. (usually) For what you describe, I'd recommend a few of these tractors; Massey Ferguson 135, 235, 150, 255, 250, 240, 165, 265, (older but still acceptable 35, 50, or 65). Ford 3000, 3600, 4000, 4600, 5000, 5600. Deere 1530, 2030, 2040, 2240, 2440, 2550. There's lots of other good picks, from other brands. Those I listed are the ones I'm familiar with, in the size you'll need. I'm not discounting any of the others, just picking from what I KNOW to be good small/mid-sized tractors. I'm not much of a fan of today's "compact tractors". Too many "high dollar repair" possibilities for me. When you find what you're looking for, let us know. There's always someone on here willing to speak their piece on what they know about a particular model, or brand. John

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CH

04-28-2004 18:05:16




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 Re: Re: Need Advice on What Tractor/brand to Purch in reply to Indydirtfarmer, 04-28-2004 10:15:13  
You forgot MF 245, Mine does all that stuff.



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Dave in Mo

04-28-2004 10:02:10




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 Re: Need Advice on What Tractor/brand to Purchase? in reply to D. MAC (St. Louis, MO), 04-28-2004 06:20:07  
Mac, you didn't mention price range, but for what you need and maximum safety the N series Ford or a Fergie can't be beat. A 2-bottom 3 pt plow (used $200) and a 6 or 7 foot disc ($500 new) would be better here for you than prolly anything else.
And a box blade is an excellent tool to level roads and logout trees. Can't flip over if you chain to the box. Since we've put in 2-3 acre plots around St.Louis for several years, I'll be happy to help. Give me an E-mail.

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jls

04-29-2004 20:00:17




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 Re: Re: Need Advice on What Tractor/brand to Purch in reply to Dave in Mo, 04-28-2004 10:02:10  
Ns and fergies safe? yeh since most no longer have compression to pull or tires to transfer the power to the ground. with no fixed drawbar lots of people flipped those little beggers over backwards in their day, I love getting pushed around by the pto--buy a overrunning clutch. If you're brushhogging in real brush a tractor with a platform or at least large solid places for your feet are wonderful.

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Ben in KY

04-28-2004 08:53:44




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 Re: Need Advice on What Tractor/brand to Purchase? in reply to D. MAC (St. Louis, MO), 04-28-2004 06:20:07  
Many/most of the newer smaller John Deere's are Yanmars. They are ok. However if you buy a Yanmar be sure and get one that you can get parts for. The Grey market Yanmars can be very difficult to get parts for. As others have said get one with a 3 point hitch and a live PTO. 30 hp or more should be about right for your needs.



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Mark in MO

04-28-2004 08:53:21




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 Re: Need Advice on What Tractor/brand to Purchase? in reply to D. MAC (St. Louis, MO), 04-28-2004 06:20:07  
D.Mac Yes. stay away from the 1010 JD. The 1020's were much better. The TO Series Fergies and the N Series Fords are good tractors, but are very pricey for what you get. If your looking at AC, the D Series are very good tractors, I've used these for years and never had any problems. You may also consider 2510/3010/3020 JD or a Farmall 560. Make sure that you get one with 3PT, it makes it alot easier to buy equiptment. Keep us posted and welcome to the club.
Just my O
Mark Hill
Dearborn,MO

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kyhayman

04-28-2004 08:15:43




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 Re: Need Advice on What Tractor/brand to Purchase? in reply to D. MAC (St. Louis, MO), 04-28-2004 06:20:07  
For my money I'd look long at hard at something bigger than the TO, and diesel. My bias is toward the 5600-7710 series Fords but the gears are pretty high for what you are talking unless you finde a 12x3 creeper transmission option. Case DB's have 12 speed trans. with lots of low gears, diesel, econmical operation, and plenty of weight for the size. I'm a long way from an IH or JD expert so cant speak to those models. I know where a couple are within a 1/2 days drive of you, email is unmasked if interested.

Regards,
David

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Stan Jones

04-28-2004 10:24:11




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 Re: Re: Need Advice on What Tractor/brand to Purch in reply to kyhayman, 04-28-2004 08:15:43  
Welcome to the tractor world D.Mac,,one thing I would suggest is that you make sure you buy a tractor with a front end loader,,I bought a Ford 600 for my first tractor without a loader and I feel like I have a three legged horse, I cant wait to get rid of it and get one with a loader and power steering,,Im dying here without a loader(have a small horse farm)even if I didnt have horses I would still be hurtin without a loader,,if you are convinced you dont need a loader,,I have a sweet little 600 here for sale,,$3500,,GOOD LUCK

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D. MAC (St. Louis, MO)

04-28-2004 07:34:52




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 Re: Need Advice on What Tractor/brand to Purchase? in reply to D. MAC (St. Louis, MO), 04-28-2004 06:20:07  
I'm not sure what you mean by cat 1 3pt hitch? Isn't the older tractors equiped with a cat1 3pt? If I purchase, say a 1964 AC D-19, will I be able to go to a farm store and buy a 3pt that will fit? or will my AC have to be converted to a cat1 3pt? Not sure how that works.....

So, for fine mowing, and for tilling, I want a tractor that has low gears correct? What would be the correct terminology? ie..the more gears = having a very low gear (12 gears, etc...)

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Mike (WA)

04-28-2004 08:16:50




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 Re: Re: Need Advice on What Tractor/brand to Purch in reply to D. MAC (St. Louis, MO), 04-28-2004 07:34:52  
The AC D-19 may well have a hitch called a "snap coupler", which was proprietary with AC- It can be converted to 3 point, at a price, but you would not have "draft control" (ability of the tractor to "sense" when the implement is getting too deep (ie, pulling too hard) and automatically lift it. IMHO, the D-19 is also too big for what you want- they aren't especially nimble in small areas. I also have heard poor reports on the 1010 JD. The older Fergusons do not have live PTO, and I think that is a must for you. I would look at the older Fords (660 or 860, or 2000, 3000, 4000 models), JD (420, 1020, 2020), Oliver Super 55 or 550, MF 135, AC D-15 or possibly D-17.

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Dr.EVIL

04-28-2004 06:59:23




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 Re: Need Advice on What Tractor/brand to Purchase? in reply to D. MAC (St. Louis, MO), 04-28-2004 06:20:07  
Don't know why Your not interesting in IHC, They've made many models that would fit your tasks and parts & repair help abounds, but I'd stay WELL away from the 1010 deere. The D-19 would be a nice tractor with plenty of HP for everything You want to do. If your satisfied with the condition and have someone familiar with Allis I'd buy that. They had live PTO, live Hyd., good brakes, good power steering, 2-speed hand clutch, Snap Coupler was easily converted to Cat. 1 3-point and some of the later ones were equipped with 3-point from the factory. And that 262 cid-6 was Smooth, kinda thirsty but smooth.

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paul

04-28-2004 06:55:30




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 Re: Need Advice on What Tractor/brand to Purchase? in reply to D. MAC (St. Louis, MO), 04-28-2004 06:20:07  
Color is not important to me, so I won't list any particular color.

If you do tilling or snow blowing or fine mowing, you want a real slow set of gears.

For snow blowing or baling you want a live pto - this makes most any pto job more fun, but for some operations it's really important.

For a loader, power steering really helps. Look for a tractor with a beefy front axle. You need live hydraulics - can fit a front pump on the motor in many cases.

If you look at small compact diesel engine tractors, you want front wheel assist. For older heavier tractors, they work fine with rear wheel only drive. The compacts are almost all to small to bale with, and they run out of traction & weight before they run out of hp for most bigger tasks.

So many implements are 3pt these days, sure is nice to have a standard cat1 3pt hitch.

For really small plots of land, 1/2 acre, a tiller works better than a plow. For larger plots, 5 acres or more, a plow & a disk work better. Generally.

Just kinda the features that I see as importabnt for different jobs.

For your current 1/2 acre needs the small Yanmar might be a better choice than a big 70hp monster, but not sure what your future plans are, you quickly run out of capibility with the little guy if you expand or wish to do more challenging operations. Log dragging is a particularly dangerous one in your list, a small tractor will quickly flip over if the log becomes caught on something. One person's log is another person's twig, so not sure what you need for that.

--->Paul

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