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Tractor Talk Discussion Forum

Agricultural engineering - pay

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Ben UK

04-08-2004 00:58:11




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Hi all

im 15, taking my GCSE's this year. Next year I am probably going to go to sixth-form, but i am considering going to Sparsholt college after sixth-form, to study agricultural engineering.

I really enjoy all aspects of engineering, and live on a Farm, so thought this to be an appropriate route.

The one thing that I am wondering about is the pay, I can imagine it being a bit "minimalistic!" Anyone got any idea about what the pay is?

I have experience with repairing equipment already, so hopefully i shouldnt be too useless at this!

I realise that money is not everything, but it would be nice!

Thanks

Ben

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txblu

04-10-2004 07:59:32




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 Re: Agricultural engineering - pay in reply to Ben UK, 04-08-2004 00:58:11  
Ok Folks, lighten up on each other.

No-no's to talk about:

Religion
Politics
White collar vs blue vs gray
What is the best..... .
Oil
Mother in law..... ..... er ah oops!
What did I miss?



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Paul in Mich

04-09-2004 14:13:54




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 Re: Agricultural engineering - pay in reply to Ben UK, 04-08-2004 00:58:11  
Ben, Whatever you do, whether its becomming an Ag engineer or anything else, do it because you have the passion for it, and not because of a few pieces of paper displaying the Queen's picture. I can guarantee you that if money is your motivator, you will never be content or satisfied. If you do something with passion, the money will follow, but will not be a distraction. Your last statement says a lot.

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Neil

04-10-2004 00:14:20




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 Re: Re: Agricultural engineering - pay in reply to Paul in Mich, 04-09-2004 14:13:54  
"If you do something with passion, the money will follow . . . ."

Sorry, but I gotta say I'm not so sure about that one.



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Paul in Mich

04-10-2004 06:11:44




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 Re: Re: Re: Agricultural engineering - pay in reply to Neil, 04-10-2004 00:14:20  
Neil, Are you then suggesting that the money will come ahead of the passion? Thats how artists work...they get a grant from the govt., then produce their product.



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Neil

04-10-2004 10:11:09




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Agricultural engineering - pay in reply to Paul in Mich, 04-10-2004 06:11:44  
Paul,

Unfortunately, that's not what I'm suggesting. I'm suggesting that, while some might be fortunate enough to make money doing something they're passionate about, many will not. Many on this board probably know that all too well, as many probably are or know someone that had a passion for farming, but do something else to pay the bills. When I was a teenager I tried my hand at very small time farming and figured out pretty quick that it might be better to get an education in something that I could tolerate and would put food on the table. I've seen more than one person come to the same realization after being stubborn about it a while. Sorry to be a wet blanket.

The upside is that who you work with is probably just as important as what you do. And I can vouch that it's possible to find great people to work with.

Neil

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Nebraska Cowman

04-08-2004 10:46:20




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 Re: Agricultural engineering - pay in reply to Ben UK, 04-08-2004 00:58:11  
anything that takes work will make you money but if you're like me you will get sick of fixing stuff for other people to break and decide to break it yourself. But you know what? i have been on my own for most of my life, run older equipment and keep it serviced, and my stuff don't break.



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EngineerJoyce

04-09-2004 07:11:27




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 Re: Re: Agricultural engineering - pay in reply to Nebraska Cowman, 04-08-2004 10:46:20  
Cowman, what you are describing is an Ag Mechanic, not an Engineer - BIG difference. Engineer = design it, Mechanic = work on it.

And I do agree with Harley in that an Engineer should work with what he designs. That's why my brother, a former John Deere Design Engineer, was encouraged to take demo's home on the weekends and work with them, to check on any improvements or bugs before they got to the consumer.

Ben, you need to really check into what you want to do. If you like "working on stuff" and "fixing stuff" then you are in the realm of Mechanic. If you like to create something from nothing (dream it in your head, then create it) then you are in the realm of Engineering. Know the difference.

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EngineerJoyce

04-08-2004 07:56:23




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 Re: Agricultural engineering - pay in reply to Ben UK, 04-08-2004 00:58:11  
Hi guys. Yep, I'm a 'girl' AND an ag engineer! I'm in the US and work for the federal government, graduated in 1995. Starting pay here now is about $35K straight from college - but the benefits bring it up to well over $45K.
I'm in the "soil and water" side of things.
My little brother got the same degree- with a machinery/mechanics emphasis. Worked for John Deere for about 3 years, now for Murray lawn mower Co. all doing new product design. I think he started at $40K.
Now my little sister just graduated (yep, ag enginering!) and works for a private engineering firm that is classified as "civil engineering" but does environmental cleanup and stream re-builds. Started somewhere between $30-$40K this spring.
Agricultural Engineering provides a diverse education with real practical knowledge. But beware: some places won't even look at you if they don't see the right degree (mechanical or civil, etc. instead of agricultural). Even though yow will be (IMHO) more roundly educated, lots of places just don't know that Ag engineers get the same physics, chemistry, dynamics, thermo, calculus, etc. that the rest do, we just know how it will affect the environment too!

Before you go after any degree, research the possible job opportunities available to you. Whether you plan to move, etc. Best of luck to you. GO AG E's!!!!

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Paul in Mich

04-09-2004 14:02:12




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 Re: Re: Agricultural engineering - pay in reply to EngineerJoyce, 04-08-2004 07:56:23  
Engineer Joyce, Not to burst your balloon, but I have a friend who makes at least your engineer's pay being a welder for "White Castle". For those of you who arent familiar with "White Castle", think "Sliders".



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EngineerJoyce

04-09-2004 17:57:06




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 Re: Re: Re: Agricultural engineering - pay in reply to Paul in Mich, 04-09-2004 14:02:12  
I think you misunderstood. I said that was the STARTING pay. As most manual labor jobs top out just above that, I've nearly doubled that in less than 10 years.

Go ahead and weld. I'll stay inside on inclement weather days and tell you where to weld it!



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Paul in Mich

04-10-2004 06:23:51




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Agricultural engineering - pay in reply to EngineerJoyce, 04-09-2004 17:57:06  
Joyce, I didn't expect you to find the wit in my statement, as most engineeers wouldn't, but carrying this debate to its logical conclusion, you will find that while you may have had a STARTING wagge, you will also find an ENDING wage in your profession. If money is the motivator, then why bother with the degree, as most self made millionaires and billionaires are NOT college educated. Those folks have no end in sight for earnings, but a vision and passion far surpassing anything you can learn in our (sorry to say) indoctrination mills we call Universities. A degree is still nice tho, it makes a person all warm and fuzzy when hanging it on the wall.

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Lewis

04-11-2004 08:05:46




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Agricultural engineering - pay in reply to Paul in Mich, 04-10-2004 06:23:51  
Paul,
I tried to stay out of all the non-constructive arguments, but just can't make it after reading several of your posts. Do you like to "down-grade" others just for the fun of it, or are you just having a bad day. From the earlier remarks where the guy asked for information on tractor roll-over to this post about engineering pay scales, you have not offered "one" and I mean "one" constructive bit of information. Folks are right, we don't have to read the posts, but when we see a topic that is interesting, then we have to sort through all the "Paul comments" just to get to the ones that try to answer or discuss the original poster's questions. My Mother always said "if you don't have anything good to say, don't say anything". Maybe you and I both should heed that good advice. Anyway, give folks a break; there may be some of us who still need to actually learn something, instead of being born "knowing it all".

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Paul in Mich

04-11-2004 21:00:03




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Agricultural engineering - in reply to Lewis, 04-11-2004 08:05:46  
Lewis, I got a response out or you, didn't I? If you read my comments, you'll find that whether I agree or disagree, I usually give someone something to think about. While I may not respond to the original question, I may at times respond to a respondant. Nobody including you has to agree with me, but if I got your goat to the point that you respond, then I got your attention. I really don't rail on anyone, not even Joyce. By the way, I bet Joyce can stand up for herself. My point was and still is that while a degree is great and I applaud anyone for accomplishing that, it is by no means a guarantee to success, only a tool. And while I didnt say it, I will now and that is that while there are people who have gotten a degree, there are many more who have gotten an education. My father worked for the U.S.D.A., and while he had a 9th grade education, and he was in no way irreplaceable, his job was divided among 3 college degreed personel upon his retirement. Two of whom didnt cut the mustard so to speak. He was even ordered to tear out a heating system he had installed in a series of greenhouses by a so called engineer, and replace it with an engineered designed system. He did install the new system, but failed to tell anyone that he left his old system intact because he knew the new system wouldnt be adequate. Good thing, because with the first frost, the new system failed and many millions of dollars worth of experimental plants were saved only because some dumb 9th grade moron's system was better designed than the college educated engineers. Now do you want to hear about my un-degreed cousin who set up the first computer system for Dow Chemical Co? I didn't think so. As to the tractor roll over, if you have to ask how far you can tilt a tractor on a slant before it rolls over, you shouldnt get on it to begin with. Its like asking how close to the ditch can you drive without going over the edge. The logical thing is to drive as far away from the ditch as possible, not see how close you can get to it without falling into it. If you had read all the posts, you would have seen that I qualified the engineering data by stating that it is only relative if nothing else goes awry such as droping a wheel into a groundhog hole, which by the way happens quite frequently. In that case, I would hope that you didnt take the tractor to the engineered limits, because you are going to have a major disasater. Thanks, Lewis for responding to my post, as it gave me the opportunity to clarify my point.

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M.F.

04-08-2004 06:44:49




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 Re: Agricultural engineering - pay in reply to Ben UK, 04-08-2004 00:58:11  
Ben, Congrats on the college decision, stay with it! Here in USA there may be some differences in an Ag Eng degree program. Not all schools offer a degree in AE and the ones that do have different programs. I would suggest the ones that offer a degree in Engineering versus an Ag degree. Also, in the field of AE there are several options: Water Quality, Manufacturing Processes, Power and Machinery, Waste Management, etc. Talk with your Guidance Counselor or College Admissions and get the details. If you get an Engineering degree you will spend many hours in the Engineering school; Thermodynamics, Statics and Dynamics, Heat and Mass Transfer,etc. Hope you like math and science! Pay will be what the market will bear, probably different in the UK. Again, Good Luck!

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James in NC

04-08-2004 05:15:49




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 Re: Agricultural engineering - pay in reply to Ben UK, 04-08-2004 00:58:11  
I think finding an ag. engineering job will be the tough part, in the U.S. I would expect to start in the low 40's with a good GPA. I just graduated from NC State last May in mechanical engineering and was considering Ag. Engineering very hard. I felt that mechanical would open more doors for me down the road. I am currently a manufacturing engineer, but still looking for that right Ag engineering job. I don't feel that being mechanical and not Ag. will hurt me in getting an Ag. Eng. job, but I know that I would not have the one that I have now if I had an Ag. engineering degree. Good Luck
James

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John (C-IL)

04-08-2004 06:39:41




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 Re: Re: Agricultural engineering - pay in reply to James in NC, 04-08-2004 05:15:49  
Hey James, I think Ben is wanting to know about being a mechanic. I will say that my son is an engineer for CAT in the industrial division and went the AG route at the University of IL. You are on the money with most starting wages for an Ag/Mech engineer in the mid 40s with rapid advancement if you are worth your salt.



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LesWV

04-08-2004 07:42:57




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 Re: Re: Re: Agricultural engineering - pay in reply to John (C-IL), 04-08-2004 06:39:41  
It is different here in the US.
You pay to be a farmer.
The Goverment will loan you a million dollars or so. Tell you to raise 1000 arces of corn, soy beans, etc. Promise you that they will be a great market for the crops when harvest times comes. Then back out of the deal. Leaving you a million dollars in debt with no way to pay beack the loan. Then the Goverment will seize your land and equipment. Sale it to Wal-Mart who opens a Super Center and you go to work for Wal-Mart 20 hours a week at minumim wage with nothing to look forward to except those Willy Nelson Farm Aide concerts every year. You end up dying a broken man, leaving the huge debt owed to the goverment to your kids. The cycle ends only when the 19th or 20th generation gets that million dollars paid back or the entire family dies out from the lake of aires.

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Paul in Mich

04-09-2004 14:08:13




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Agricultural engineering - pay in reply to LesWV, 04-08-2004 07:42:57  
LesWV, I guess you are more fortunate than I am, since you at least like Willie Nelson. What the heck are those of us who aren't entertained by Willie the great supposed to do, cry in our beer (home brewed of course since we cant afford a six pack)



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harley1983

04-08-2004 15:02:33




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Agricultural engineering - pay in reply to LesWV, 04-08-2004 07:42:57  
The best engineers so far have been the ones they left in trains. Let the people who run machinery design it and tell the factories what they are doing wrong. I am a diehard farmall man, but what's up with that steel pan seat for the first 60 some years? If the engineer that designed that had to sit on that thing for eight hours while craning his neck around to see what he was doing behind him, I'll bet it would have had some kind of cushion on it about 1922 or 1923, and it would have been turned a few degrees to one side or the other so you could see behind you, or at least it would have been mounted on a swivel so you could turn it and then turn it back. Hey, by golly, I think I just engineered something. I gotta go now. I'll be down in the shop building me a swivel seat with a cushion on the old M . Bye, Harley

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Shane

04-09-2004 14:57:44




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Agricultural engineering - pay in reply to harley1983, 04-08-2004 15:02:33  
I agree with the part about engineers not knowing a darned thing about the machinery they help design. Who hasn't worked on something where just one more inch and the whole thing could just pop right out, instead you have to take this off and to do that you have to hire gumby to get that special made wrench on that bolt that you can't even see. I think the problem is they are all overeducated. Let a simple man design something that a simple man is gonna use. Heard a saying once, "Give the laziest man the hardest job and he will find the easiest way to get it done".

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