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Tractor Talk Discussion Forum

Ring job?

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Kennyp

03-07-2004 14:21:56




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Does any one ever, or has any one, just replace rings and not sleeves. Tractor is 706D and seems to have a lot of blow by. We have yet to realy test it. It will just be used on loader and maybe bush hog. Not any great amount of field work. I used to do sleeve kits, but then they used to be 80 to 100 dollars a set. Only thing that worries me is removing ridge, don't they have to be ground on hard sleeves? Probably depends on amount of wear.

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Thanks from Kenny

03-08-2004 07:37:26




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 Re: Ring job? in reply to Kennyp, 03-07-2004 14:21:56  
Thanks to every one. There was a time when I knew all this and you refreshed my mmory. Still have micrometers some place. This is for my best friend and some thing new has come up. It ran/runs nicely at low speed, but he said last night that when he wraped it up across the yard it started a bad "knock" ???. shut it down and restared and it quit it. My first though was a cracked piston but wouldn't that be all the time? maybe a valve hanging. I did not hear it. He has a nice old mechanic across the road to work on it. I too old any more, but I can still "advise"

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jdemaris

03-08-2004 05:27:09




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 Re: Ring job? in reply to Kennyp, 03-07-2004 14:21:56  
Just as important as the bore is the groove in the pistons for the top ring. If it has subtantially more than .005" side-clearance it's going to give trouble, and a ring job is a waste of money. Years ago, it was common practice to rebuild pistons which entailed regrooving, shimming, and knurling skirts. Then, parts got cheap enough and labor high enough, that stuff just got replaced as a matter of routine. Now, new parts are getting high, and reclaiming or repairing pistons is well worth it. I recently did my John Deere 1010 engine. Previous owner had done a ring job but it had bad blowby. I pulled it apart, and checked top ring side-clearnace with a feeler gauge and it measured .012" Checked prices at the dealership, Deere wanted over $100 a piston, and there are four of them. So . . . bought four repair shims from Hastings for a total of $12, and spent $40 ($10 per piston) at a local machine shop to have the pistons regrooved. I've put 1500 hours on it since, and it runs great. I guess one catch is finding someone to cut the grooves. I started out going to a city automotive machine shop fifty miles from here. I asked about piston regrooving, and the head of the machine shop told me the process was obsolete, no longer done, and repair shims have not been available since the dark ages. Subsequently, I did a little research and found it's standard pratice on many race car engines. Researched a little more and discovered it's a common pratice in other parts of the world that don't have "throw-away" cultures yet. Checked Hastings website and they have lots of info. about the repair process. Called them up, they were great. They will sell rings and shims, one by one, if desired. Finally went down to a local machine shop in our village run by an older somewhat retired guy. He says he does a lot of them, charged me $10 a piston, and I had them back the next day.

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CRUSADER

03-07-2004 20:09:33




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 Re: Ring job? in reply to Kennyp, 03-07-2004 14:21:56  
Hello Kennyp,

It's been a few years, but I have done exactly what you are inquiring about doing. Prior to making the decision, I would do like the others that have replied and mic each of the cylinders. If the tolerance will allow, you should be able to get by with using a ridge reamer to cut the wear groove and replace the rings. The Std/.10 ring should work. Be sure to check to ensure that the valves faces and seats are good and lapped in properly. This is (if memory serves me correctly) a dry sleeved engine. At least the one I ringed was. You should be able to get the the gaskets, inserts, ring set, and most other parts you would need from your local NAPA Auto Parts Store. But I would check around to see if there is another supplier which may also have them with the same quality and better price. Good luck with your engine ring job.

Jim

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wdTom

03-07-2004 17:56:49




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 Re: Ring job? in reply to Kennyp, 03-07-2004 14:21:56  
As was said, you need to measure the bore at the top just under the ridge left where the tip ring stops. Now compare this to the measurement at the bottom where almost no wear happens. Now look in your manual and see what it says about the amount of taper allowed. If you are at it or close get sleevs, if you aren't more than half of the allowable limit you might consider not getting new sleeves. How much is the tractor to be used? How well do you want it to run? That kind of stuff. At the least the liners will need to be honed out to roughen them up so new rings will wear into them, and the ridge at the top must be removed so the new square top edge of the ring doesn't hit it and damage the newe ring or piston. When all is considered this is why most people probably go with new liners.

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Dave_Id

03-07-2004 15:14:13




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 Re: Ring job? in reply to Kennyp, 03-07-2004 14:21:56  
Take an inside mic, or bore gage and measure the wear on the bore.



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nhboyd

03-07-2004 14:40:33




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 Re: Ring job? in reply to Kennyp, 03-07-2004 14:21:56  
If you can feel a ridge you may have more wear than a standard set of rings can restore compression. If you done pull sleeves and replace orings they may start leaking antifreeze into the oil. It you are planning on keeping this tractor for awhile I would spend the money and replace the sleeves and piston. You will get a better job.



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