Welcome! Please use the navigational links to explore our website.
PartsASAP LogoCompany Logo Auction Link (800) 853-2651

Shop Now

   Allis Chalmers Case Farmall IH Ford 8N,9N,2N Ford
   Ferguson John Deere Massey Ferguson Minn. Moline Oliver

Tractor Talk Discussion Forum

ATF vs hydraulic fluid

Welcome Guest, Log in or Register
Author 
Bruce

02-14-2004 09:46:35




Report to Moderator

My bobcat manual has a typo in it and calls for using 10w30 motor oil in the hydraulic system, then concludes the directions by saying to add two quarts of ATF if the filter was changed to top off the system. I have been told that ATF is a very refined hydraulic fluid, yet the viscositity (sp) of the ATF seems so much less than the regular hydraulic oil, does anyone have an opinion one way or the other regarding replacing hydraulic oil with ATF???Will ATF still provide lubrication to the drive system, as my drive system is bathed in the same oil used for the hydraulic system??

Thanks, My search on this subject did not answer my concerns.....

[Log in to Reply]   [No Email]
Jim in N.D.

02-14-2004 19:13:35




Report to Moderator
 Re: ATF vs hydraulic fluid in reply to Bruce, 02-14-2004 09:46:35  
Bruce, what model Bobcat are you talking about? I don't know of any model that uses anything but Bobcat Black Gold ( 10w-30 is an acceptable sub.)Also what is currently in the system? Jim in N.D.



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
bruce

02-15-2004 06:12:10




Report to Moderator
 Re: Re: ATF vs hydraulic fluid in reply to Jim in N.D., 02-14-2004 19:13:35  
it is a model 600. Is not hyd. drive, uses wet clutchs and pulls the oil from the drive system into the hyd system. Had hyd oil in it, but I know of at least two other 600s running ATF. Factory says ATF now too..... .I put 20 gals in last night, hyd are still shaking, must be air in the system yet.

side note, system calls for 20 gals, I drained 7 out, the last owner of this machine must not have believed in checking fluid levels!!

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Jim Z in N.D.

02-15-2004 07:18:05




Report to Moderator
 Re: Re: Re: ATF vs hydraulic fluid in reply to bruce, 02-15-2004 06:12:10  
Bruce, I would go with what the man. says(ATF, like you have done) the 20 gal, is that system capacity or reservoir capacity? I am not up to speed on the older skidsteers, but the newer ones have two diferent capacitys,reservoir which is lower than system. System includes pumps, cylinders ,ect. It does sound like air in the system,one thing to check,again I'm not that familiar with the 600 series, is the location of the pump. If it is higher than the res. it has to pull oil up, and if the inlet hose is not tight, it'll also pull air into the system.I know a couple of guys that chased this problem around for a couple of days!If its just air in the system ,(no leaks)it'll work itself out in short order.
Jim in N.D.

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
bruce

02-15-2004 07:37:26




Report to Moderator
 Re: Re: Re: Re: ATF vs hydraulic fluid in reply to Jim Z in N.D., 02-15-2004 07:18:05  
Thanks for the comments Jim. I do have a small leak on the outgoing pressure side of the pump, I think an o-ring is leaking, try to fix that today. Since it is on the pressure side and not the intake side, do you think it could cause the shaking?? I would not think so, but I don't know too much about this system.

The 20 gal all went into the sides of the bobcat, the two sides are interconnected and the oil helps to lube the drive chains, the clutches and then is pulled into the hyd system. Seems weird to me, but it must work since the machine is more than 30 years old and still going.....How long do think it should take to get the air out of the system. I only ran it for about five minutes last night, at which time I ran the bucket and loader through full cycle about 10 times. Thought if I let it sit overnight some of the air might find its way out....

Any thoughts..

Thanks again

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Jim

02-15-2004 18:13:39




Report to Moderator
 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: ATF vs hydraulic fluid in reply to bruce, 02-15-2004 07:37:26  
Bruce, I don't think the air will bleed off without running the machine through all of the functions several times. It sounds like you did that allready, so it may take a couple of more cycles. The leak on the output(pressure) side should'nt be causing the problem,but I would fix it asap. It doesn't take long to pump out 20 gal. if the o-ring/fitting or hose lets go.I will have to look at the shop tomorrow to see if there is a service manual on that old of a machine kicking around, kind of see what the system is, also check for that error in fluid type!Good luck and let me know how it works out.
Jim in N.D.

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
paul

02-14-2004 13:18:07




Report to Moderator
 Re: ATF vs hydraulic fluid in reply to Bruce, 02-14-2004 09:46:35  
I would follow the manufaturer directions. Well, in your case I would call the nearest dealer & find out exactly what the manufaturer directions are! :) And write it down on the page in your manual.

My combines run on ATF, and work real well. My 3 differet colored tractors work on various grades of hyd or trans/hydraulic oil. Each works well.

I'd be replacing a whole lot of very expensive parts if I substituted in either direction.

Both ATF & tran/hyd oil work well when used for the systems that are designed to use them. However, bad things happen if you decide to use the wrong oil for the wrong system. This is one place to trust the manufaturer & not make up your own rules.

--->Paul

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Bruce

02-14-2004 14:23:47




Report to Moderator
 Re: Re: ATF vs hydraulic fluid in reply to paul, 02-14-2004 13:18:07  
If you notice in my post, I did talk with both a dealer and the factory service people.

They don't agree....ATF it is.

Thanks for the comments.



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
paul

02-15-2004 09:23:33




Report to Moderator
 Re: Re: Re: ATF vs hydraulic fluid in reply to Bruce, 02-14-2004 14:23:47  
I read from the bottom up & did not see your reply to yourself before I posted - did shortly after tho. :)

Might have been helpful to tell us what model machine you have - all we know by now is 'old'. Someone might have an updated manual or exact experience. You left things kinda generic in your 1st message, so hard to give a specific answer.

--->Paul



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Vern-MI

02-14-2004 12:41:35




Report to Moderator
 Re: ATF vs hydraulic fluid in reply to Bruce, 02-14-2004 09:46:35  
ATF viscosity is equivalent to 10W oil. You have to be careful since some of the ATF has friction modifiers in it such as Boron and Phosphorus which may not be the best for your system. Some of the additives in ATF also attack oil seals if they are not made of the right compound especially the synthetic ATF oils. Some of the friction material adhesives which we tried were also affected by synthetic ATF.

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Bruce

02-14-2004 12:28:09




Report to Moderator
 Re: ATF vs hydraulic fluid in reply to Bruce, 02-14-2004 09:46:35  
Here is the long story. I contacted Bobcat corperate office, after three people did not know the answer, they said " someone will get back to you." Then a contractor friend of mine stopped at my office, and he said he uses hyd oil, but he gave me the number to his dealer. Dealer looked in his service manual ( which I have too) and said " the manual says use 10w30 oil, but we use hyd oil" I pointed out that the manual says "use 10w30 then later on says use ATF" it was the first time he noticed the error in the manual. Anyway, he convinced me to use hyd oil.

Now, three hours after calling Bobcat Corp, a service person calls me, and I explain the issue, he says " boy...that machine is older than I am, I think you should use hyd oil, but then again, ATF would be better for the clutches, I don't know, let me check with some other service people..." He calls me back 1/2 hour later ( I give them credit for even dealing with my old machine) And now he says...."use ATF"

I call the dealer back and say to him..."guess what?? Bobcat says to use ATF..not hyd oil" Dealer says..." No Kidding???? why? Here I am a dealer, and I don't know what I am suppose to be using!!!! I said.. "now you do..."

So, long story, but after listening to all the differant views on this, then considering the viscosity issue, I thought I would post the question here and hopefully get the view of those with more experance than I have, because, at this point, I think either oil would work, just which one is better than the other??

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Fern(Mi)

02-14-2004 10:09:17




Report to Moderator
 Re: ATF vs hydraulic fluid in reply to Bruce, 02-14-2004 09:46:35  
I can't help ya. Only confirm your suspitions. We've got equipment around here that takes some of three different Hyd fliuds: in equivelent 10w, 20w, and AFT. With the exception of the most used equipment I'm checking manuals all the time.
Somebody sure should be along soon with an answer I'm also interested in.
P.S. should all else fail, I think I would be tempted to go with the 10w hyd oil equivalency from an oil dealer. Oil dealer may even have info on required lub for your machine?
Good Luck

[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
Bob

02-14-2004 10:06:37




Report to Moderator
 Re: ATF vs hydraulic fluid in reply to Bruce, 02-14-2004 09:46:35  
Why don't you contact Bobcat through the "Contacts-questions/comments" area on their website and get the "official" word on the oil?

http://www.bobcat.com/



[Log in to Reply]  [No Email]
[Options]  [Printer Friendly]  [Posting Help]  [Return to Forum]   [Log in to Reply]

Hop to:


TRACTOR PARTS TRACTOR MANUALS
We sell tractor parts!  We have the parts you need to repair your tractor - the right parts. Our low prices and years of research make us your best choice when you need parts. Shop Online Today. [ About Us ]

Home  |  Forums


Copyright © 1997-2023 Yesterday's Tractor Co.

All Rights Reserved. Reproduction of any part of this website, including design and content, without written permission is strictly prohibited. Trade Marks and Trade Names contained and used in this Website are those of others, and are used in this Website in a descriptive sense to refer to the products of others. Use of this Web site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy

TRADEMARK DISCLAIMER: Tradenames and Trademarks referred to within Yesterday's Tractor Co. products and within the Yesterday's Tractor Co. websites are the property of their respective trademark holders. None of these trademark holders are affiliated with Yesterday's Tractor Co., our products, or our website nor are we sponsored by them. John Deere and its logos are the registered trademarks of the John Deere Corporation. Agco, Agco Allis, White, Massey Ferguson and their logos are the registered trademarks of AGCO Corporation. Case, Case-IH, Farmall, International Harvester, New Holland and their logos are registered trademarks of CNH Global N.V.

Yesterday's Tractors - Antique Tractor Headquarters

Website Accessibility Policy