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Tractor Talk Discussion Forum

farmall b alternator

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jf

11-17-2003 10:29:21




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Is their a way i can test the alternator on the tractor short of purchasing a test device or taking it off. With the tractor running and I remove the positive battery cable it dies. Also how long would a battery last to drive this tractor down the road. I need to move about 12 miles Thanks JF




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Jim was in UK

11-17-2003 11:11:06




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 Re: farmall b alternator in reply to jf, 11-17-2003 10:29:21  
From your discription I would have to say that the alternator or voltage regulator is not working. Does this alternator have the one-wire to go to the batt + terminal with the built in regulator or does it have the separate regualtor? If it has a regulator on it, (not built in on the alternator) you may want to make sure that the contacts are not stuck. If it's the built in, then it's electronic and either it or the alternator are bad. As far as roading it on the power supplied by the battery...I am sure that you won't have a problem. The draw on the battery will not be that heavy and you should be able to make it without any problems for the 12 miles. I know of someone that uses a Farmall B and an M for shows and parades, and he doesn't have a charging system on the tractor. Just makes sure the batteries are good and hot. Just my .02 cents worth on the subject.

later days mate,
Jim in NM again

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Bob

11-17-2003 11:02:46




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 Re: farmall b alternator in reply to jf, 11-17-2003 10:29:21  
It is NOT a good idea to disconnect the battery cable on an alternator-equipped machine while it's running. This can fry the diodes or voltage regulator in alternator. Not always, but it can happen.

You can buy a cheap, but usable, VOM (volt-Ohm-Meter) at Harbor Freight, Wally World, or your other favorite seller of Chinese products for between $5.00 and $20.00.

Look for about 12.6 volts on a charged battery that has sat overnite, and 13.5 to 14.5 volts at the battery while your tractor is running and charging.

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CH

11-18-2003 05:04:55




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 Re: Re: farmall b alternator in reply to Bob, 11-17-2003 11:02:46  
Harbor freight has a meter on sale right nor for $3.99. It's good enough for that.



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Allan

11-17-2003 11:25:31




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 Re: Re: farmall b alternator in reply to Bob, 11-17-2003 11:02:46  
Hi Bob,

The reason they tell you not to R&R a battery is because there is a chance that someone could reinstall in a polarity-backwards fashion.

This indeed will pop a diode, the diode trio or even damage the rectifier bridge.

Also, if the battery is gasing at a high rate, there is a chance of this gas igniting by the spark of the re-connecting post(s); (not a pretty picture) and exploding. I saw this happen one time.

But, those things being observed, just the proceedure of removing and reinstalling will not hurt a thing.

Just for the record,

Allan

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Bob

11-17-2003 12:36:56




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 Re: Re: Re: farmall b alternator in reply to Allan, 11-17-2003 11:25:31  
Allen, I stand by my original post. THERE IS NO REASON TO UNHOOK A BATTERY CABLE WHILE THE ENGINE IS RUNNING, AND FURTHERMORE, IF YOU CHOOSE TO DO JUST THAT, YOU MAY DAMAGE THE ALTERNATOR.

(Sorry for shouting, I feel better know!)



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Loren

11-17-2003 20:23:53




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: farmall b alternator in reply to Bob, 11-17-2003 12:36:56  
This is true. Has nothing to do with the battery, it creates a voltage spike when the circuit is broken. The spike can blow the diodes. Don't disconnect any altenator while the vehicle is running, tractor or auto.



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Allan

11-18-2003 04:50:11




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: farmall b alternator in reply to Loren, 11-17-2003 20:23:53  
Hi Loren,

If, and I say "if" an alternator has a leaky diode to start with, this might very well happen.

However, all things being equal and with a healthy electrical system at the onset (or at the other end of the spectrum, a completely "dead" system), the hot swapping of batteries and/or alternators does not hurt a thing.

This has been going on hundreds & hundreds of times each and every day at repair facilities across this country and around the world for over forty years.

So, I think that to make a blanket statement that change outs on the fly are damaging could be interrupted wrong and is somewhat misleading.

Just my 2 cents,

Allan

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Allan

11-17-2003 13:05:01




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: farmall b alternator in reply to Bob, 11-17-2003 12:36:56  
Bob,

LOL!!

Rather than start a screamin' match with each other, let's just lay this one down and forget it.

Allan



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Bob

11-17-2003 13:08:52




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: farmall b alternator in reply to Allan, 11-17-2003 13:05:01  
Why encourage someone to do something that may cost them an alternator?

HMMM... But then again, maybe you're right. I repair alternators for a living and Christmas is coming... I need all the work I can get!



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Allan

11-17-2003 14:09:44




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: farmall b alternator in reply to Bob, 11-17-2003 13:08:52  
Okay Bob,

Let's just let it go.

Enjoy the rest of your day off.

Allan



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Bob

11-18-2003 00:33:48




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: farmall b alternator in reply to Allan, 11-17-2003 14:09:44  
Name's Allan, huh?

Thank goodness!

For a moment there I thought I was having an argument with my wife! (ROFLMAO!)



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Allan

11-18-2003 03:52:19




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: farmall b alternat in reply to Bob, 11-18-2003 00:33:48  
Mornin' Bob,

Yeah, I know what you mean. It is hard to argue with someone who won’t argue back…what a bummer!!

But, over the years, I have come to the realization that there are certain areas that just cannot be discussed with another individual without it being a total and complete waste of time and energy.

Because, more often than not, the debate sooner or later turns into nothing more than an unintelligible fiasco; the two parties get mad at one another, personalities get involved, finger pointing starts, and before it is over, feelings get hurt. It just isn’t worth the effort.

These areas include religion, politics and one’s superstitions. I find it better to just walk away and let the other fellea think what he wants to think.

The best one I ever read was posted on another forum and backed up by a multitude of supporters and entry-level experts, which was of the opinion that current can and does flow through a capacitor. That one went on for weeks! I couldn’t have bought a $50 hardbound novel with so much enjoyment and amusement! It was priceless!

No, a man is going to believe what he is going to believe and no amount of yelling back and forth is ever going to accomplish anything; one way or the other.

However, I still can’t help finding myself wondering where in the world some of these tales originate. But, I’ll give you this: they certainly do make for some rather ‘entertaining’ reading. LOL

Have a good one and thanks for the comeback,

Allan

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Bus Driver

11-18-2003 04:38:45




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: farmall b alte in reply to Allan, 11-18-2003 03:52:19  
The caution against disconnecting battery cables on vehicles equipped with alternators while the engine is running is in the Chevrolet Service manuals issued by GM and distributed by Helm Inc. The manual explains the likelihood of damage to the diodes. That is "where in the world some of these tales originate".



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Allan

11-18-2003 06:51:41




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: farmall b in reply to Bus Driver, 11-18-2003 04:38:45  
Good Mornin' BD,

Yes, you are correct and I am well aware of the cautionary notes in the owner's manual. Further, I have most all of their service manuals committed to memory. In addition, I have the certificates for attending every electrical course GM ever put out during the years 1967 thru 1998. This was required of me during those years as I was working for them then.

Prior to going to work for GM in 1967, I was trained by our Uncle Sam and spent 5 years in the military working on the guidance systems of air-to-air guided missiles. During this time, the Raytheon Corporation of Saint Louis, who then later offered me a position with their company upon my discharge, provided me with further electrical training. But, I opted to go with GM.

Also, I am a graduate of the Devry Institute of Technology.

The upshot of all this self-congratulation is to tell you that I'll talk sparks to anyone at anytime, as I'm reasonably sure that I have a fair idea about the subject matter that I'm talking about. And quite frankly, a simple battery, an alternator and their interconnecting circuitry is just about as basic as it can get.

That warning is placed in that manual for the exact reasons that I've already quoted.

Leads can and sometimes do get mistakenly reversed by untrained service personnel. Use of jumper cables can sometimes mistakenly get the polarity reversed as well. (Read: the owner). When this happens, damage can occur just as the manual states. Manufactures try to protect owners from their own mistakes. These manuals are not a crash course on electrical theory by any means.

Some will say that hot-swapping is damaging. Sorry, you might convince others of this nonsense, but I know better. Just ‘taint so; never was and never will be.

I hate flying my own flag, I am not trying to be argumentative, I am not trying to sound like a “know-it-all, & I hate posting these type of tirades, but when I know something is a falsehood, I’m gonna say so.

This load of oats, which is currently being offered for sale, has already been run thru the horse.

Regards to you and yours,

Allan

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old

11-17-2003 10:53:34




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 Re: farmall b alternator in reply to jf, 11-17-2003 10:29:21  
From what you have said the alternator is probably bad. But with a good battery you should be able to drive it as far as you said you need to go, as long as you don't have to strat and stop the engine more then once or twice. And the bigger the battery the better off you will be. Hope this helps



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Slowpoke

11-17-2003 22:58:27




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 Re: Re: farmall b alternator in reply to old, 11-17-2003 10:53:34  
You could take an extra good battery with you to be on the safe side.



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