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TSC Valspar "Enamel Hardener" and respirator?

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DAN9-Midwest

01-13-2008 14:12:52




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I like to paint a used implement when I buy it and have been thinking of using the Valspar "Enamel Hardener" from TSC. I am not sure if it is safe or not even though I have a good paint respirator.

The ingredients listed in the can are "Aliphatic Polyisocyanate and Isophorone Diisocyanate" along with Naptha and N-Butyl Acetate.

The can mentions you MUST use a good paint respirator but also says you MAY also use a supplied-air system.

Can anyone help understanding this? I paint outside.

If it's that dangerous why would they even mention using a regular respirator?

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Me in NC

02-24-2008 07:10:54




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 Re: TSC Valspar Enamel Hardener and respirator? in reply to DAN9-Midwest, 01-13-2008 14:12:52  
Hello,
I called valspar about their restoration series enamel hardener. I asked the tech support department , and they said to use a respirator with a organic vapor cartridge. I asked if they were sure, the guy put men on hold, and came back and said that was what was needed for the hardener. You will hear stories from all over. A good, clean supplied air system, of course, is always better. YMMV.

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DAN9-Midwest

01-14-2008 01:11:06




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 Re: TSC Valspar Enamel Hardener and respirator? in reply to Ron Grother, 01-13-2008 14:12:52  
Thank you CKNS--no hardener for me.



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CNKS

01-13-2008 17:32:24




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 Re: TSC Valspar Enamel Hardener and respirator? in reply to DAN9-Midwest, 01-13-2008 14:12:52  
There was a discussion on this site about this a couple of years ago -- concerning tractor store paint and hardeners vs PPG, DuPont, etc. I think the conclusion from most of us (there will always be a few that differ) was that the the suppliers who sell to such stores do not emphasize the need for supplied air because they realize that many of the people buying their product are not professionals like those in the body shops. Those suppliers seem to get by with it, but they shouldn't. Basically ANY hardener with the term isocyanate on the can or spec sheet should REQUIRE a supplied air system, and the major paint manufacturers do require them in their spec sheets. The only way you can safely use a charcoal mask is to get the level of iso's below a certain number--I don't remember what that number is; it is not important, anyway, because it is impossible for a hobbiest to reduce that level even if he could measure it. A good downdraft paint booth in a body shop may be able to obtain it, there is nothing a hobbiest can do to safely reduce the level. Outside may or may not be better, if you can smell the paint fumes without a mask, you are getting isos through the mask. I believe iso's themselves are odorless. You can paint upwind, but the paint still swirls around you. If it is calm enough to paint, you are as bad off outside as in. Some people aren't affected, others get a reaction the first time it is used. Repeated use can cause severe permanent respiratory problems, a few people have died. A charcoal mask is not adequate unless it is brand new and fits perfectly. The charcoal begins to degrade as soon as the seal is broken, and you have no way of determining its effectiveness. The paper dust masks are even more worthless, as they do not filter out any fumes, only part of the paint dust. Do a simple Google search for Isocyanates, you will find out more than you want to know.

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Rod (NH)

01-13-2008 17:26:38




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 Re: TSC Valspar Enamel Hardener and respirator? in reply to DAN9-Midwest, 01-13-2008 14:12:52  
Use a supplied-air system or lose the hardener. NIOSH (National Institute of Occupational Safety and Health) recommends ONLY supplied air when dealing with ANY concentration of isophorone diisocyanate. See here. Then again, it's your respiratory health and your risk, so only you can make such a decision.

They mention a "good paint respirator", whatever that is, because they want to sell their product to those who generally do not have supplied-air equipment and who are usually not willing to purchase it. It's the user's risk, not the sellers.

Rod

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Dug F.

01-13-2008 16:53:20




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 Re: TSC Valspar Enamel Hardener and respirator? in reply to DAN9-Midwest, 01-13-2008 14:12:52  
I use the same hardner . Although you are painting outside you should still use a resperator. Or at least a good thick dust mask. A guy once told me, " blow you nose in a white hanky after painting. What you see is only about 1% of what goes in you lungs". Think about it! Doug



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jim wise

01-14-2008 12:07:42




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 Re: TSC Valspar Enamel Hardener and respirator? in reply to Dug F., 01-13-2008 16:53:20  
if you are painting one tractor outside, the charcoal resperator will work. true it is not great for you and i guess could kill you but the whole 70s thrue 90s we painted with those resporators including several hundred gallons of imron and thousands of gallons of centari. While we are talking about this your eyes absorb more iso than your lungs also your skin so cover up and good ventalation



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