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Ford 9N, 2N & 8N Discussion Forum
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12 volt coil

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Tim...OK

10-30-2003 06:00:34




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Hey you electical Gurus,I've got a coil question,my N has the typical homemade 12 volt conversion,mid seventies chebbie alternator,resistor running to replacement 6 volt coil,everything works like it is,but I'd like to switch it to a 12 volt coil,do i have to do anything other than replace the coil and remove the resistor?? I'm one of those electically challenged,so please type SLOWWLLLY..hahaha

Thanks,
Tim in oklyhomie

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Danny in CO

10-30-2003 07:46:41




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 Re: 12 volt coil in reply to Tim...OK, 10-30-2003 06:00:34  
Tim,

I'm a 2 finger typer so it will be slow!

Let me see if I've got thing straight;

48 8N, front mount dist., 12 volt conversion, 6 volt coil, hard to start. You say you have a resistor in-line. If you have a 6 volt coil, you should have 2 resistors in-line, the original ballast resistor (on the back of the dash), and a ~1.6 ohm resistor. If you only have 1



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Danny in CO

10-30-2003 07:52:49




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 Re: Re: 12 volt coil in reply to Danny in CO, 10-30-2003 07:46:41  
Rats! I hate when that happens!

If you only have 1 resistor and a 6 volt coil, you have probably fried the coil. If you have a 12 volt coil and a resistor, you are probably not getting enough electricity to the coil.

If you have a 6 volt coil, use a VOM and measure the voltage at the top of the coil with the points closed. You should have about 3.5 volts. If much less, the extra resistor has too much resistance. Get another resistor and replace. I took my VOM to the auto parts house and measured several resistors until I found one with 1.6 ohms resistance.

If you have a 12 volt coil, again measure the voltage at the top of the coil with the points closed. You should get about 10.5 volts. If less, again the resistor is the wrong one.

Hope this helps,
Danny

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DavidO

10-30-2003 06:34:50




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 Re: 12 volt coil in reply to Tim...OK, 10-30-2003 06:00:34  
If it is working, why are you changing it?

The answer is: It depends. All 12V coils are not created equal. Some have internal current limiting resistance and do not require external resistance to limit the current. Some require an external resistor. Yes, even on a 12V coil on a 12V system. If you can provide more information on the specific coil which you are going to use, we can provide a better answer.

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souNdguy

10-30-2003 06:26:59




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 Re: 12 volt coil in reply to Tim...OK, 10-30-2003 06:00:34  
You didn't mention side mount vs. front mount, but I'll take a stab.


If you have a side mount setup, with a properly functioning 12v charging system, and have a 12 to 6 dropping resistor, and the oem 6v roundcan coil.. then yes.. you can get an appropriate 12v coil and do away with the resistor.. I believe napa # MPEIC14SB ( IC 14-SB ) is a possibility.. I'm sure there are other performance coils out there you might use as well..

If you have a front mount oem 6v square coil, and the oem ballast resistor and a 12 to 6v resistor.. then you can remove both resistors.. get the 12v repalcement coil. Dell will usually recomend getting a 2 pack of radioshack 10watt 1 ohm resistors and twist the ends together in parallel to make a 20 watt 1/2 ohm current limiting resistor.. and add that inline with the new 12v square front coil, as a way to make its life a bit easier... Dell has a radioshack part number.. but it escapes me at the moment... I was doing good to remember the napa part number for the round can coil...

Make sure your new side mount coil is installed correct polarity... ( neg goes to the distribuitor on your sidemount coil with a neg. grnd electrical system .. )

I'm sure others will chime in if I've left something out.

Soundguy

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Tim...OK

10-30-2003 06:53:53




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 Re: Re: 12 volt coil in reply to souNdguy, 10-30-2003 06:26:59  
Sorry I forgot that part,it is 1948 front distributor. I'm thinking of changing just for hotter spark,it's hard to start,think it might help? it has a good looking spark when you ground a plug to the head and crank it,but usually if i want it to start we have to drag it,then it runs great at all speeds and loads once it's running and it will fire right back up as long as it's warm,but let it sit over night and forget it. I thought maybe spark might be weak under compression..

Thanks guys

Tim

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souNdguy

10-30-2003 07:13:26




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 Re: Re: Re: 12 volt coil in reply to Tim...OK, 10-30-2003 06:53:53  
With this new info.. sounds like spark may already be 'hot'. The oem front mount coil used a ballast resistor to drop the 6v down a bit. converting to 12v added the 12 to 6 resistor. Generally you would have both of those in line.. not just the 12 to 6v resistor.
( unless you missed the ballast resistor on the back of the dash )... etc.

My guess would be closer to low compression.. not low spark... spark won't know the difference between drag starting and starter spin starting.. except that you might get more rpms drag starting it.

-IF- you do have good spark.. fuel, etc...Try a compression check.

Have you tried choke while starting? the enriched mixture is a bit easier to fire up...

Soundguy

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Tim...OK

10-30-2003 07:25:54




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: 12 volt coil in reply to souNdguy, 10-30-2003 07:13:26  
compression is good,motor got new sleeves and pistons once that I know of,I tore it down last year cause it was smokin a little,put rings and gaskets in it and had the head surfaced. i usually end up chokin it til gas runs out the bottom of the inlet. last year to get it to start,i would pull the wire off the 12 to 6 resistor and put the full 12 to the coil,for a short time only,then once it started,i would quickly move it back before it died.

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rbell

10-30-2003 08:40:16




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 12 volt coil in reply to Tim...OK, 10-30-2003 07:25:54  
That test shows you found your problem already Tim,
The thermal resister(thats the original one) is not working correctly. Low Ohms when cold to provide extra spak, higher ohms when warm to reduce the voltage to the coil (reduce the smoke)
Replace it.



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souNdguy

10-30-2003 07:32:11




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 12 volt coil in reply to Tim...OK, 10-30-2003 07:25:54  
Well.. if the choke gives you 'excess' gas.. then I'll guess manifold vacume is good..ergo compression's good.

With that last bit of info about bypassing the resistor then it starts.. I'm leaning towards ignition like you originally brought up.

After you check to make sure points, plugs, wires, cap/rotor and ignition switch and all connections are good and clean/ tight.. check again to see if you are using the resistor under the dash.. that may be failing. if it is out of the loop. you may be suffering from a bad coil.. in that case.. might as well go to the 12v coil, and get rid of the ballast and dropping resistor... consider using that current limiter resistor idea that Dell mentions.

Good luck

Soundguy

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Tim...OK

10-30-2003 08:03:28




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 12 volt coil in reply to souNdguy, 10-30-2003 07:32:11  
Thanks
I have no idea about the resistor on the back on the dash,the wiring on her is kinda butchered as it is,but gives some places to start lookin..

Thanks again,
Tim



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