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John Deere Tractors Discussion Forum
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4020 Running ? ( Gas )

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Rodd

08-16-2006 15:48:03




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I have a 4020 John Deere when I start the tractor run it for 10 min. it starts to pop run ruff and pop some more and die's , I wait about 30 min. and it will start and run again for 10 min. is this a vapor lock or is it over heating or running to hot ? has any body had this trouble , it has electronic ignition , Thanks for any help




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parrothead

08-18-2006 15:17:07




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 Re: 4020 Running ? ( Gas ) in reply to Rodd, 08-16-2006 15:48:03  
Have you tried running it with the air cleaner pipe removed from the carb? Sounds like a blockage to me. We have a 4020 gas and a 4000 gas. Both have MS carbs and not a problem with either one.



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buickanddeere

08-18-2006 08:44:12




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 Re: 4020 Running ? ( Gas ) in reply to Rodd, 08-16-2006 15:48:03  
6V or 12V V coil and is there still a ballast resistor in the circuit? When converted to electronic somebody may have overlooked something.



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Glen in TX

08-17-2006 09:26:38




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 Re: 4020 Running ? ( Gas ) in reply to Rodd, 08-16-2006 15:48:03  
Disconnect the air intake at carb and see if you can get it to smooth out and run better. Lots of these old tractors are getting 40 to almost 50 years old and the air cleaner cannisters and stacks can get full of grease, dirt, gunk and crud including mud daubers nests to plug them up. If no air stack thru hood check the cap on top of air cleaner under hood making sure it isn't plugged or smashed down too. Several have been having troubles lately with some of the electronic ignition modules cracking too or going bad and if you see cracks take it back to the dealer for warranty and try another one or like Mike said just go back stock and try the points in it till you get it running better. Look at your spark plugs and try a new set also. Are they wet fuel fouled or black carboned? If so suspect rich carb, not enough air, timing off or plug heat range too cold.

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Mike M

08-17-2006 04:49:17




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 Re: 4020 Running ? ( Gas ) in reply to Rodd, 08-16-2006 15:48:03  
The best advice I can give is to go through and put everything back STOCK and set everything by the book up to specs.

I did this right after we bought our 4020 GAS around 1993 and it has been pretty much trouble free. Only modification I can reccommend is to make sure you have a Zenith carb.



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Rodd

08-17-2006 16:23:06




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 Re: 4020 Running ? ( Gas ) in reply to Mike M, 08-17-2006 04:49:17  
It still has the Mavel carb on it , I hear the zenith carb is better , ? what model zenith carb
do you use ?on the 4020 >>. going to try the electric pump too. couldn't hurt . You Guys are alot of help Thanks Rodd



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Mike M

08-18-2006 06:31:11




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 Re: 4020 Running ? ( Gas ) in reply to Rodd, 08-17-2006 16:23:06  
I see no reason a properly functioning original style mechanical pump won't out perform/outlast an electric one ? These are cheap from JD. $40.00 ? maybe.

I have rebuild many, many carbs. over the years and the only one that ever gave me the most fits and I finally gave up on was the one MS on our 4020. I finally took the advice from others about getting a Zenith. I didn't want to spend big money on an experiment so I lucked out and found one cheap that came off a 3010 or 3020 ? same bore and stroke just 4 cyl. instead of 6 so I figured it couldn't be too far off. I rebuilt it and stuck it on the 4020 and that made the single biggest differance across the throttle range of anything else. I wouldn't hesitate to spend alot of money on a good carb. now !

Firts off run a compression test,adjust your valves and check for little things like cleaning all the wire connections and check for worn dist. parts. I'm talking about a complete and thorough tune up is all. If something isn't within specs. it never will work right.

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Gerald J.

08-18-2006 09:11:33




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 Re: 4020 Running ? ( Gas ) in reply to Mike M, 08-18-2006 06:31:11  
The mechanical pump on my 4020 wasn't pumping (except maybe to the crankcase). It was worn out. The Deere price for a replacement was over $60 and it looked like it would fall apart at the connections and does not come with a filter screen or visible bowl. It looked like it was (and it probably was) made in backwoods Cambodia.

The electric pump (ignoring the metal work I did) was under $20 and I like to let the electric pump fill the carburetor before cranking which saves on battery and gets me a much quicker start.

The MS carburetor gets 4 or 5 times as many pages in the 4020 shop manual as the Zenith. But there is a 70s vintage JD service bulletin that says scrap the MS and put on a Zenith, so its sure that they often couldn't tune it either. I suspect the most common problem is a break in the vacuum operated accelerator pump diaphragm but my 4020 came with a Zenith and I'm not going to change to MS for the education of the experiment.

A worn distributor top bearing could easily lead to poor running especially if the rattle off the shaft is a significant fraction of the point gap speecification. But that shouldn't show up after 20 minutes, that should be poor all the time.

With the time frame of this particular complaint, I'm more inclined to believe its fuel supply rather than coil or ignition failure. The solid state ignition probably isn't going to come back to life after failure, nor is the condenser in a normal ignition (which has many fewer parts to fail compared to a solid state ignition), though coils can develop a shorted turn when warm and work again when cool.

With this time delay, a lack of tank vent can be a problem. There's a service bulletin about that, recommending that the gas cap not quite bottom against the hood grommet because the passageways are on the bottom of the cap and being against the grommet can block them. So when it sputters, pull the choke on to see if that help. If that does, take off the gas cap to see if that helps. Then adjust the gas tank neck extension to raise the cap above the grommet.

But do the simple things first.

Gerald J.

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Mike M

08-18-2006 10:51:44




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 Re: 4020 Running ? ( Gas ) in reply to Gerald J., 08-18-2006 09:11:33  
Those pumps must of took a big jump in price (like most stuff) I just checked RE43274 $68.00 I'm sure I would of bought one aftermarket if they were this high back when I did mine.

Funny thing showed up on parts picture is a kit to add a fuel filter. Looks like some new lines and filter in the kit AR50139 for $30.99 I sure would of thought it would of been alot more ?



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Gerald J.

08-16-2006 16:14:31




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 Re: 4020 Running ? ( Gas ) in reply to Rodd, 08-16-2006 15:48:03  
It could be condenser or coil, but its most likely running the carburetor out of fuel. Check to see if choking it when it begins to sputter makes it run better. If it does, its starving for fuel.

Then check the fuel lines and any added filter for being plugged and check the fuel lift pump to see if its any good. I put an electric pump on my gas 4020 last year and it now runs all the way to the bottom of the tank instead of quitting with a third of a tank left.

The carburetor float needle valve is probably worn badly from decades of vibration and that may be letting it run rich. Replace that before you dig into the rest of the carburetor.

Gerald J.

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Corky

08-16-2006 20:47:46




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 Re: 4020 Running ? ( Gas ) in reply to Gerald J., 08-16-2006 16:14:31  
What brand of fuel pump did you get and where did you buy it?



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Gerald J.

08-17-2006 11:54:32




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 Re: 4020 Running ? ( Gas ) in reply to Corky, 08-16-2006 20:47:46  
I don't know the brand. Most look alike, but have wide ranging prices. The one I bought probably was at O'Reilly or Jocko's auto parts and was half the price of the same one (low pressure) at NAPA. This one is red. I made a plate that covered the original pump hole and then bent out to hold the electric pump at a suitable angle to fit the plumbing and I inserted a fuel filter after it that had pipe threads on one end and a hose connection on the other. Works fine. Its far easier on the battery to turn on the ignition and let the electric pump fill the carbureter than to crank the engine over doing the same job.

Gerald J.

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Rodd

08-16-2006 21:10:35




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 Re: 4020 Running ? ( Gas ) in reply to Corky, 08-16-2006 20:47:46  
I did put a new fuel pump on it , bought it at the tractor shop , said it was for a 4020 tractor last year , didn't know I had a problem till I starter useing it , This year >>>>>> Thanks For the Help Guys.



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