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need info about 2000 Industrial Backhoe/Loader

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Jim Cramer,SR.

06-09-2007 07:53:56




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Can any tell how difficult it is to repair a main hydraulic cylinder(the one inside the hoe frame) and what the approximate costs for materials and where to purchase them? Also does any one have either a spare operators manual or a FORD repir /servive manual for a '63 ford 2000 Industrial Backhoe/loader they would part with for a price(s) ? How many quarts of oil does this engine take when performing a change/what is the filter # (spin on) ? How does one tell when the hydraulic system is full, and not over or under filled ?

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Andy Wickiser

06-09-2007 17:12:17




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 Re: need info about 2000 Industrial Backhoe/Loader in reply to Jim Cramer,SR., 06-09-2007 07:53:56  
To supplement the information john_bud gave, Series 713 Model 19-154 is the 12 foot model. If nobody offers a service manual in response to your request you can get one from n-news, go to Link . Warning: some of the cylinders on very old hoes can still leak after repack. I pulled and rebuilt the crowd cylinder on mine, and was bummed when, after all that work, it leaked as before. The cylinder bore was out of spec. I ended up putting in a modern cylinder. The closest I could find was 4" bore instead of 3.5" so my crowd force is now on steroids!

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jim Cramer, Sr.

06-10-2007 18:59:46




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 Re: need info about 2000 Industrial Backhoe/Loader in reply to Andy Wickiser, 06-09-2007 17:12:17  
Andy: thanks for the info I'll check it out



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john_bud

06-09-2007 08:21:02




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 Re: need info about 2000 Industrial Backhoe/Loader in reply to Jim Cramer,SR., 06-09-2007 07:53:56  
What hoe is on it? What model and year?


It is not difficult to repack the cylinders. The procedure is a bit different depending on year as they are put together differently. Basically, there is a spanner wrench that is used to take the end cap off. then you slide the rod out. Undo the nut that holds the packing together and take the piston off the rod. Then slide the gland down and off.

Take the piston apart, measure the packings. Width, height of the stack, ID, OD. Some o-rings. Same measurements.

Take the packings out of the inside of the gland. May have to work them out or even add some 16 oz pursuasion to tap them out with a brass drift. Same measurements. There is probably a o-ring and back up ring on the outside. Same measurements.


You can take the packings to a hydraulic shop and have them order the parts. (Or just rebuild the cylinder). Or order from these guys.

There is a seal on the gland nut too. Measure it up.

www.hddistributors.com

Download the catalog. 10 meg. It has pictures of all the parts and seals.

The seals for one cylinder are probably around $50 from HD. Probably 75-100 from the local guy. Having it rebuilt may be $200-350 depending.

jb

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jim cramer,sr

06-09-2007 08:36:42




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 Re: need info about 2000 Industrial Backhoe/Loader in reply to john_bud, 06-09-2007 08:21:02  
John: thanks for the info to date ... how do I find out what backhoe is on my machine ? I know my tractor is a '63 / 2000 w/ 4 cyl. gas engine ! How do I remove the cylinder when I attempt to repair it ? That is to say, what is the safest way to do it , with the hoe stretched out and on the ground or is there some special way to go at this repair ?



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john_bud

06-09-2007 15:44:03




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 Re: need info about 2000 Industrial Backhoe/Loader in reply to jim cramer,sr, 06-09-2007 08:36:42  
Can you take a picture of the hoe? Post it here?

If not, there were 2 popular hoes. The Ford 713/723 hoe that came in 3 versions - 10', 12' and 14' digging depth. And the Sherman Panther.

The Ford pivot post has the boom cylinder on the bottom and the sherman has it on the top.

Pic of my 723 hoe third party image

jb

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jim cramer

06-09-2007 16:06:44




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 Re: need info about 2000 Industrial Backhoe/Loader in reply to john_bud, 06-09-2007 15:44:03  
john: Thanks for the pic -- I am not able to post one for ypu at this time , however, as luck would have it your Pic is exactly like my hoe (as far as I can tell given the differences there may be in sizes, ect. that is to say).
I found a tag on the hoe frame and it reads : Series 713-I 9-I54 w/serial# 4083. given your reply I'm assuming it is a model # 713. As far as the digging depth goes I do not know how deep ? But your pic once again mirrors mine and the ram cylinder that is leaking is the one at the bottom of the tractor that goes upward inside of the hoe frame (is this called the "boom" cylinder that you mentioned ? If so, then it is a Ford vc. Sherman application.

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john_bud

06-09-2007 16:47:02




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 Re: need info about 2000 Industrial Backhoe/Loader in reply to jim cramer, 06-09-2007 16:06:44  
spanner wrench links on ebay. You need 1 of each.

Link

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Adjustable-Hook-Spanner-Wrench-4-1-2-to-6-1-4-USA_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ43994QQihZ020QQitemZ300118572952QQrdZ1



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john_bud

06-09-2007 16:43:19




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 Re: need info about 2000 Industrial Backhoe/Loader in reply to jim cramer, 06-09-2007 16:06:44  
Yes, you have a 713 hoe. Probably a 10' or 12'.

This is a link to my album showing various cylinders being redone.

Link


Hardest part is getting the cylinder caps off. You NEED the correct tool (spanner) to engage the cap. I'll see about taking a pic of the tool. Cost of tool + packing is about 1/3 - 1/2 the cost of a pro rebuild. That's why I have the tool.

The piston nut is another tough one. Last cylinder (the no paint one) took me hanging off the ground from a 3' braker bar on my 24" pipe wrench that was on the 1 13/16 socket being backed off by my 1/2" Chicago Pneumatic impact wrench. It was a tough nut! It takes a well mounted vice to withstand the banging. But as you can see from the pictures, no real fancy setup.

To get that cylinder out, put the boom (part that attaches to the box) and the dipper stick (part that attaches to the boom and bucket) straight out. Use a cherry picker or chain fall to raise the boom up off the ground a bit. Wiggle the boom lift control to relieve pressure. Take off the hoses. Remember to run and get a pan for the 1 1/2 gal of hydraulic fluid. Tap out the boom pin, then the bottom pin on the swing cylinder. Lower the end of the cylinder and slid it under the tractor and out.

Installation involves the reverse of the steps plus some cussing as manipuating the heavy akward cylinder is a PIA. NEVER use your finger to align the cylinder to pin, unless you like to only count to 9.

Take pictures of which direction the grease fitting is on and be sure you get it back there. Or you won't be able to grease the boom pin (needed a second removal.)

The cylinder packings that go on the piston (2 sets) are 1" tall, 3/8" wide and the OD is the cylinder dimetion. Probably 3 1/2 inch or 3". The gland packing is 1/4" wide and the ID is the same as the rod OD. The gland seal is an MCU style (Metal Can urethane)5/16 tall. ID is the rod size the OD is 1/2" larger than the ID. 1/4" wide.

There are 2 o-rings in the piston. Probably PN 568-218. (1.234x.139")

The O-ring and backup ring for the outside of the gland are 1/8" wide. So, the cylinder size is the OD and 1/4" less is the ID. I like to use 2 backup rings. One on each side of the o-ring. Lube everything with hydraulic fluid when assembling.

Take care to NOT BUGGER UP the red ring in the gland. You probably need to reuse that - wear ring.

jb

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jim Cramer, Sr.

06-09-2007 17:18:05




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 Re: need info about 2000 Industrial Backhoe/Loader in reply to john_bud, 06-09-2007 16:43:19  
John: Thanks for the info; easy to follow and with humor I might add -- makes life sooooo much easier to deal with ! When you say to use a Cherry picker or falls to lift and take some pressure off from the boom I am assuming that you mean to use either/or at the tractor rear end(or boom end) (where the vertical pin is located for the boom end) while at the other end, the teeth of the bucket are in the ground per se ´ "straight out ?

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jim Cramer, Sr.

06-09-2007 17:28:27




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 Re: need info about 2000 Industrial Backhoe/Loader in reply to jim Cramer, Sr., 06-09-2007 17:18:05  
John; I tried to get your photos with the address you gave but it is a no go for some reason ?



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john_bud

06-09-2007 20:25:23




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 Re: need info about 2000 Industrial Backhoe/Loader in reply to jim Cramer, Sr., 06-09-2007 17:28:27  
Yeah, pick the boom up at the end of the boom by the dipper stick. You can probably do it at the bucket end too.


pictures.


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jim cramer, sr.

06-12-2007 17:42:26




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 Re: need info about 2000 Industrial Backhoe/Loader in reply to john_bud, 06-09-2007 20:25:23  
john: great pics



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Jim Cramer, SR.

06-12-2007 17:56:13




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 Re: need info about 2000 Industrial Backhoe/Loader in reply to jim cramer, sr., 06-12-2007 17:42:26  
john: what is the secret to posting pics on the forum ?



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