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Farmall & IHC Tractors Discussion Forum
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More (probably stupid) 656 questions

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Dan Bear Kelley

01-27-2008 12:01:34




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(NY Bill or anyone else) With the shorter wheelbase (Wheatland or Utility) 656, how much of a project is it to replace the bushings, pins, etc. that wear with the loader work? How much do the castings wear? Can they be bushed? The reason I ask is that I don't intend to put a bunch of hours on the tractor. Landscape work is more of an excuse to buy another tractor for the collection. :-) So, if I find a tractor that needs all this work, should I be wary of it or should I buy it knowing I can do the repairs needed?

Also, it was mentioned that the 2250 was one loader available for the 656. Any others out there? Pros? Cons? I'm looking at light to moderate landscaping work: back blade (or box blade), moving sand, moving loosened dirt, drilling post holes, disking the driveway.

Yes, a 656 may be a lot of tractor for that work, but I've always gotten very capable tools for any job. It always makes things easier. I could get a Kubota or some compact tractor to do this work, but I wouldn't be proud, then, to have it in my collection. :-) The good news is that my wife has not said "No" to getting a 656 (or any other '06/'56). She does want live hydraulics, power steering and a 3-pt hitch on "Her" M first.

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cornfarmer

01-28-2008 18:17:20




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 Re: More (probably stupid) 656 questions in reply to Dan Bear Kelley, 01-27-2008 12:01:34  
DON"T be afraid of a hydro. Most horror stories are told by people who never actually owned one. They make the best loader/utility tractors. The gas 656 Hydro with a 2250 loader I bought about 8 yrs ago has proven pretty well bulletproof. I bought it from people who started to worry about the hydro quitting, simply because of age and hard use. Those have been 8 trouble-free years as a loader/planter/mower tractor and the hydro is still strong as ever. Some advice-before buying one, make sure the hydro is warmed up and put it under load to make sure it works ok. If you buy it, take it straight to a Case-IH dealer and have the oil and filters changed. I say that because you will have a lot of oil to dispose of. Use ONLY Case-IH Hytran-this would be the wrong place to save a couple of bucks using a cheaper oil. The enemy of a hydro is dirty oil. Now that you know where you stand, just follow regular service intervals(good advice for any tramsmission). A hydro is expensive to repair, but so is any transmission, especially one with a reverser.

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Lynn Davis

01-28-2008 09:45:55




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 Re: More (probably stupid) 656 questions in reply to Dan Bear Kelley, 01-27-2008 12:01:34  
Hydro definitely easier to find than shuttle, shuttle probably bought new for loader work, etc. Except for the fact that it is in a unique housing, is the same unit used today in construction equipment and most combines, maybe a size difference. Has to be one of the most trouble free transmissions ever built.



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Formerly PaMike

01-27-2008 14:32:04




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 Re: More (probably stupid) 656 questions in reply to Dan Bear Kelley, 01-27-2008 12:01:34  
We had a 656 that had a loader on it most of its life. The thing wasnt maintained well, and it showed. Going down the road it would wonder all over the place.It had the short wheelbase(utility). We got rid of that and bought another 656 utility. We put the IH 2000 loader off the old 656 and on the new one. The steering is nice and tight. No problems. They make for a decent loader tractor. If you want to spend a little more money get a tractor with a shuttle trans. I have never used one but I hear they are much nice for forward/reverse loader work.

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ny bill

01-27-2008 13:38:04




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 Re: More (probably stupid) 656 questions in reply to Dan Bear Kelley, 01-27-2008 12:01:34  
if it hasn't had a loader on it before, i'd say you should be ok with putting a loader on it, bushing-wise. the bushings are fairly easy to replace IF you catch them in time. if the wear gets into the castings, they probably will be a job to machine because of the shape. i've never done mine, just semi-retired it to feeding (non loader) work. one other thing, i've replaced the spindles and hubs on 3 656s with ones from a 7/806/26/56 series, because the stock 656 spindles/hubs can't stand the constant beating from a loader. my first 656 utility had a new idea 504 loader on it. many companies made loaders with different brackets to adapt to many different makes and models. several ih (and other makes)loaders would work on the 656 with the right brackets. the 2250 is a quick attach model. if you don't need to take the loader off and on a lot, the standard models would save some money. you'll have more time into setting your wife's m to her specs than you will have in changing the 656 bushings. :)

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Dan Bear Kelley

01-27-2008 19:45:51




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 Re: More (probably stupid) 656 questions in reply to ny bill, 01-27-2008 13:38:04  
There's another thing to add to the list: shuttle trans! It will be a pain finding exactly what I want, but I'm pretty patient. I'll wait for the right one to come along. My mother-in-law's boyfriend can usually find all kinds of great stuff... whenever I don't have the money for it. :-)

Good tip on spindles. I'm writing that one down. I can pick up those parts now, while I'm waiting for the right tractor to come along. And you're right about quick attach. I won't need that. Westendorf builds stuff right in my wife's home town of Onawa, Iowa. So, likely I'll be able to pick up something at the factory, except they're kinda pricy and I don't really need new.

I'll probably have as much money into full time hydraulics, power steering and 3-point hitch on her M as I would in my whole 656. That's OK, though. Hobbies are designed to waste money and time. :-) Her M is a really sweet tractor, too. I can see us driving side-by-side in the local parades.

Good that the bushings are not super-duper hard to do. Not like beating the kingpins out of an old solid-axle truck, I suppose. Assuming that I get a decent running tractor, I think I'll look at doing the front end stuff first. I can live with a smoker, but I don't like anything wandering.

OK, so here is what I have so far. Something in the '06/'56 line, probably a 656. An IH 656 Utility would be good. An IH 656 Wheatland second and a Farmall 656 third choice, but all are good choices. Preferrably with a loader, although I'll probably get a less abused tractor without a loader. A shuttle trans would be a plus. (Can a shuttle trans be added? Is it like an auxiliary transmission? Or is it a whole different transmission?) I like gas, but the folk on the board say I should not be afraid of a diesel. The son-in-law of a friend of mine is a diesel mechanic, so... I want to stay away from turbos, because a 656 would be enough tractor for me as it is. And the turbo would just be another thing to go wrong. I think I would be afraid to mess with a hydro. ROPS is a plus. I'd sell the cab, if it came with it.

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ny bill

01-28-2008 03:31:40




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 Re: More (probably stupid) 656 questions in reply to Dan Bear Kelley, 01-27-2008 19:45:51  
a few more thoughts.. the shuttle transmission is scarce, relative to the number of gear drive and hydros around. the 656 diesel was a glow plug engine. i have glow plugs in my 560 diesel. not an issue unless you do a lot of start and shut off work. waiting a minute for the glow plugs gets to be a time annoyance. turbo no way necessary for what you want to do.
the spindle tops are different farmall (keyed) vs international (splined). splined are harder to keep tight. you will want to see which model you get before stockpiling spindles. usually, used are available from parts yards. one of my 656s has new from A&I when i couldn't locate used at the time. the A&I catalog has dimensions and descriptions and part #s so you get the comparable one, new or used.
for loader work, hydro is the way to go. i have 2 farmall hydros and 1 international high utility (38" tires and longer spindles than the utility) hydro. all gas. checking the hydro against the brakes should tell you what you need to know on condition. you should find the procedure to check hydro if you do a search on here or the red power forum.
i had the hydro on my 826 rebuilt at hoober's this winter and their bill was under $2300. i was happy with that. haven't got the rest back together, but they do so many i don't anticipate any problems with it. some guys have even rebuilt their own. i don't have time or patience to do it.
my loader is currently on one of the farmalls and if i need another 656 hydro to replace it, i'll look for another farmall, only because of the front axle issues on the utility.

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