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My fascination with the Mag

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Mike CA

08-05-2007 00:00:39




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Ever since I learned about the Magneto option on tractors, I've been fascinated with the idea of one. I always assumed that if I got a tractor without one, I'd swap one in. But do I really want to do that? The distributer I've got looks pretty darn good, and all the stuff on it looks pretty new (albeit dirty).
What are the pros and cons of a Mag vs. Distributer?
Just some food for thought. I really think the price of a newly rebuild Mag will keep me away from it, especially if the distributer is working just fine.
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nebraska kirk

08-05-2007 20:23:55




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 Re: My fascination with the Mag in reply to Mike CA, 08-05-2007 00:00:39  
If you want some shutters, I have several. I will let you have one, cheap!



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glennster

08-05-2007 18:16:22




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 Re: My fascination with the Mag in reply to Mike CA, 08-05-2007 00:00:39  
mike, are them cobwebs hangin off the genny??? get busy cleanin er up. i prefer a distributor over a mag, i keep extra parts in the barn, if something goes wrong, i can toss a tune up kit in, and get her goin agin. with a mag, its time to get the other tractor and a chain, then call the magman!! something you should check is the oil in the distributor. there are two plugs, one in front of the distributor hold down bolt and one behind it with a flat screwdriver blade slot. unscrew them and see if there is oil in there. the magneto takes light machine oil in the cup, i use 30wt in my distributors. i read somewhere that they use a grease gun too. put a zerk in one hole and pump till grease comes out the other hole, then replace the caps. maybe one of the other guys here knows which lube is better for the distrbutor.

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CNKS

08-05-2007 18:03:21




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 Re: My fascination with the Mag in reply to Mike CA, 08-05-2007 00:00:39  
To me the answer is simple. If it has a mag that works, leave it alone. If it has a distributer that works, leave it alone. AND, one thing that is seldom mentioned--You can start a distributer equipped tractor with a crank when the battery does not have enough juice to turn the engine over. Note that I did not say "dead" battery. Most or much of the charge in a battery goes to turn the engine over. If it is low on charge it uses all the current to to turn over the engine, thus no spark gets to the plugs. If you crank it, the battery will often have enough charge to start the tractor.

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Janicholson

08-05-2007 06:19:48




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 Re: My fascination with the Mag in reply to Mike CA, 08-05-2007 00:00:39  
Mags are great for situations in which the operation of the tractor (or vehicle) needs to happen with or without a battery. Mags that were used on letter series (and earlier) were not able to provide one essential ingerdient, that is variable timing of the spark after startup. This factor alone would be the reason many were replaced. As the engine starts, at very slow crank speeds, the impulse coupling holds back mag rotation until TDC or a bit later. This allows the coupling a chance to windup a spring that releases causing the mags internal permanent magnet generator to make sufficient voltage to prep the mags coil for firing when the points break. The coupling is centrifugally controlled such that when the tractor starts, the impulse coupling is taken out of play, and the speed of the mag rotation is sufficient to make it spark as above. The timing is then advanced, due to the fact that the impulse coupling is not active, and is set (on these mags) at a advance useable at all (usually higher) engine speeds. Thus the mags timing is not able to adjust for Idle operations and points between. It is also not as flexible in total advance, because the ideal total high speed advance would be too great for the tractor to run well at idle. (and mag equipped tractors often do not idle well as it is) For a parade type tractor (not a trailer queen) I would keep the more satisfactory distributor setup. JimN

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City-Boy McCoy

08-05-2007 13:52:07




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 Re: My fascination with the Mag in reply to Janicholson, 08-05-2007 06:19:48  
Jim: Gerat information. Learned a lot. Thanks. mike



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Randy as in Randy-IA

08-05-2007 07:26:15




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 Re: My fascination with the Mag in reply to Janicholson, 08-05-2007 06:19:48  
Hi, Quick question - is there a chance of cross fire with the wires bundled together that way ? ...Randy

PS - Nice looking engine Mike !



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Janicholson

08-05-2007 07:53:30




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 Re: My fascination with the Mag in reply to Randy as in Randy-IA, 08-05-2007 07:26:15  
Only if the wires are poor, and or the plugs are gapped/worn to the point of requiring excess voltage to fire. Then the excess voltage will bridge the poor wires and cross fire. (why did Dodge name a vehicle after an electrical malfunction, or an enemy being fired on from two directions (often hitting innocents) JimN



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GeneMO

08-06-2007 15:28:34




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 Re: My fascination with the Mag in reply to Janicholson, 08-05-2007 07:53:30  
If under crossfire, Stay under cover, put distance between the threat and E&E. Circle back and kill the b****rd>


Gene



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Randy as in Randy-IA

08-05-2007 10:22:53




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 Re: My fascination with the Mag in reply to Janicholson, 08-05-2007 07:53:30  
I'm not electrically inclined but I was thinking more along the lines of induced current ( not bad wires ) from close proximity to one another especially since they are solid core wires . Is this possible or is the fire power to low in this application ? I have to be careful on my old Chevy with the built engine that I use 9 mm MSD wires on so as not to get any induced voltage/current . ...Randy

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Janicholson

08-06-2007 11:31:32




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 Re: My fascination with the Mag in reply to Randy as in Randy-IA, 08-05-2007 10:22:53  
The amount is relatively low. If 10 turns of 20 gauge enameled wire are wound around a good spark plug wire (even solid core) the output of that induction is about 80 volts, (enough to light a NE2 neon lamp), but not to crossfire. Putting that fine wire on a suspected wire from a bad cap can show up the fault. JimN



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magman

08-05-2007 05:05:23




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 Re: My fascination with the Mag in reply to Mike CA, 08-05-2007 00:00:39  
Hey mike, Are you saying my prices are to high??? Or did you not check my prices?? LOL JON



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Mike CA

08-05-2007 09:42:36




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 Re: My fascination with the Mag in reply to magman, 08-05-2007 05:05:23  

magman said: (quoted from post at 05:05:23 08/05/07) Hey mike,
Are you saying my prices are to high???
Or did you not check my prices?? LOL
JON


third party image Well, no, but I was thinking that money could be put to use elsewhere.

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HENRY E NC

08-05-2007 12:25:07




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 Re: My fascination with the Mag in reply to Mike CA, 08-05-2007 09:42:36  
Mike, the cost of a rebuilt mag is not much when it comes to buying coils etc. Jons mags are worth every penny and besides you could sell the distributer and come out pretty good. Mags are much simpler in an electrical system and completely separate. You can run a mag tractor when everything else has died in your electric system.



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El Toro

08-05-2007 03:55:45




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 Re: My fascination with the Mag in reply to Mike CA, 08-05-2007 00:00:39  
That's a good picture to show how the plug wires are connected in the correct firing order. Hal



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georgeky

08-05-2007 08:55:08




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 Re: My fascination with the Mag in reply to El Toro, 08-05-2007 03:55:45  
Hal, looks to me like that distributor is sittng a little out of whack. May be off a tooth or two. Rained here all morning. The weather man was giving almost no chance of rain for a week. These imported weather men don't seem to know that in this part of the country 90+ degrees and high humidity means it can rain at anytime.



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Steven@AZ

08-05-2007 03:05:03




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 Re: My fascination with the Mag in reply to Mike CA, 08-05-2007 00:00:39  
With a magneto, you do not need a battery and can start the tractor with a crank. Also, if you have a weak battery a magneto will start better as it always has full power no matter what the battery condition is.

A magneto downfall can be if the impulse coupling quits working the tractor will start hard.

Distributor can put out a hotter spark if you swap to 12 volt and put a high performance coil on it...

I prefer magneto myself, I rebuilt the one on my H when I overhauled the engine and I haven't even adjusted the points since then and it's been about 5 years. My magneto tractors will ALWAYS start, where I end up boosting or pulling the distributor tractors in the spring when the batteries are weak.

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gene bender

08-05-2007 02:41:28




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 Re: My fascination with the Mag in reply to Mike CA, 08-05-2007 00:00:39  
Your tractor was built with a mag the dist on there now was added as dists were not avail when yours was built. Yours also had shutters as the bracket is still there.



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Mike CA

08-05-2007 09:45:40




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 Re: My fascination with the Mag in reply to gene bender, 08-05-2007 02:41:28  

gene bender said: (quoted from post at 02:41:28 08/05/07) Your tractor was built with a mag the dist on there now was added as dists were not avail when yours was built. Yours also had shutters as the bracket is still there.


No joke? I didn't know that. Well, I guess that settles that.
And yes, I need to find shutters.

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