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Uh-Ohhhh, anti-freeze in the oil, 54 Super C?

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tractorsam

01-24-2007 13:52:54




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Well I finally got around to doing an oil change on my new to me '54 Super C and the first cup or so to come out was brilliant green. I didn't feel like waiting for it to fix itself and so I'm busily tearing it down. It's had a motor job not long back and it has nearly new ally step head pistons with an overbore to ~3.225" (Just a guess, it's a few hairs shy of a full 3 1/4). I'm pretty sure that the head gasket was the cause of the leak. However one of the sleeves (#1) is moving side to side at the top. Only a few thou but it is moving. Does anyone have any dimensions on what the hole it the block should be (top and bottom) and what the o.d. of the sleeve should be? Hopefully I'll get it back together again soon as it's my snow plow tractor. Many thanks, tractorsam

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gene bender

01-25-2007 03:58:25




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 Re: Uh-Ohhhh, anti-freeze in the oil, 54 Super C? in reply to tractorsam, 01-24-2007 13:52:54  
To have a sleeve move a little at the top is not uncommon the head gasket and head will secure it when done. I have seen it several times on these engines never had any problems after the o-haul was finished. When the o-rings are suspect i will drop pan and let it set for a few days to see if any green drops appear at the bottom of the sleeve. Have one down rite now appears the headgasket leaking near the rear.

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Patrick in Illinois

01-24-2007 19:35:11




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 Re: Uh-Ohhhh, anti-freeze in the oil, 54 Super C? in reply to tractorsam, 01-24-2007 13:52:54  
A 2x2 piece of oak wood and a dead blow hammer from the bottom; hit until the sleeve is even with the block and you should be able to lift them out by hand. They are a wet sleeve, so it is relatively easy. Worked well on my Super C. Patrick



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Janichoson

01-24-2007 14:22:47




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 Re: Uh-Ohhhh, anti-freeze in the oil, 54 Super C? in reply to tractorsam, 01-24-2007 13:52:54  
The "O" rings at the bottom of the sleeves are more commonly the problem. They need to be lubed with dish soap on the way in. some are not, and get nicked. Loose at the top is also a problem. They should be so snug that they just don't move, not a driven fit. If the maker of the sleeves is unknown, and not able to be held accountable, Or if the block was bored for the oversized sleeves, then fixing it may be the only recourse. I would put a thin film of petroleum jelly on the sleeve rim, coating it well on under surface, and sides, Then use JB weld in the groove such that it smashes out and up creating a seal at the top that will hold the sleeve in place. Both ends need to be sealed to prevent leakage. Normally the top is sealed by the sleeve rim, but on that one cylinder, it may be loose enough to become leaky. These are what I would do JimN

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tractorsam

01-24-2007 14:28:22




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 Re: Uh-Ohhhh, anti-freeze in the oil, 54 Super C? in reply to Janichoson, 01-24-2007 14:22:47  
Many thanks, this is sort of what I was thinking. I just wanted to know what size they're supposed to be so I can tell if I have an undersized sleeve or an oversized hole. Many thanks, tractorsam



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riverbend

01-24-2007 15:15:13




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 Re: Uh-Ohhhh, anti-freeze in the oil, 54 Super C? in reply to tractorsam, 01-24-2007 14:28:22  
I just bought a new set of IH pistons and sleeves for my '53 SC. The diameter of the top flange is 3.838". The IH sleeves are marked with the IH pn, 3325A (no idea what that means), and USA!

Greg



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tractorsam

01-24-2007 16:50:22




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 Re: Uh-Ohhhh, anti-freeze in the oil, 54 Super C? in reply to riverbend, 01-24-2007 15:15:13  
Excellent, I now have the pistons out and hopefully tomorrow will see the sleeves out. I've got at least 0.005 of room at the top because I can get a feeler gauge that thick in. Need to haul those sleeves and find out what I'm up against. How far will I have to pull the sleeves before I can fish them out by hand, Many thanks, tractorsam



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Janicholson

01-25-2007 06:11:46




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 Re: Uh-Ohhhh, anti-freeze in the oil, 54 Super C? in reply to tractorsam, 01-24-2007 16:50:22  
Sam, Do not measure pistopns "at the top" The ring area of a piston is not clearanced at all. Only the skirt. Sampling there will not have meaning. Specifications for piston fit require sophisticated measurement. Use of long feelergauges can be done if the spec clearance is .002" or less. Thicker feeler strips (in my opinion) are so thick they do not give good feel in a curved surface, they remain flat and do not measure accurately. JimN

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tractorsam

01-25-2007 15:48:17




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 Re: Uh-Ohhhh, anti-freeze in the oil, 54 Super C? in reply to Janicholson, 01-25-2007 06:11:46  
My apologies, I rather fed you the wrong end of the stick there. What I meant was that I have (more than) 0.005 of movement between the sleeve and the block. Pistons and sleeves are nearly new (seems to be only just about run in). Many thanks, tractorsam



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Janicholson

01-25-2007 17:06:56




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 Re: Uh-Ohhhh, anti-freeze in the oil, 54 Super C? in reply to tractorsam, 01-25-2007 15:48:17  
No grief, .005" seem like a very large amount. If the measurements are wrong in the block, and the sleeves seem OK, I would get a .0025" shim stock and cut a strip to center the sleeve in the block. I would use permatex #2 non hardening to seal it into place as it is inserted with shim, and go on with life. JimN



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tractorsam

01-26-2007 03:06:49




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 Re: Uh-Ohhhh, anti-freeze in the oil, 54 Super C? in reply to Janicholson, 01-25-2007 17:06:56  
Many thanks for the advice. All 4 sleeves are loose to some extent but this is probably the worst one. I was toying with the idea of JB Weld but didn't really like the thought of trying to get it apart again if I ever need to. I like your idea so now I'll have to pull it the rest of the way apart, clean it up and give it a whirl. tractorsam



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Janicholson

01-26-2007 16:36:47




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 Re: Uh-Ohhhh, anti-freeze in the oil, 54 Super C? in reply to tractorsam, 01-26-2007 03:06:49  
Let us know how it turns out in an update (new post) when running. The sleeves needed to be resealed at the bottom anyway. Good luck, JimN



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