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timing? 230? plug gap? electronic ign.

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t.r.y.

01-02-2007 04:14:41




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I run 12volt elect. ign. whats a good setting for the plugs? whats the recommended timing advance degree for good rpms and good lugging power? thanks happy new year




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CLIFF S

01-02-2007 07:59:32




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 Re: timing? 230? plug gap? electronic ign. in reply to t.r.y., 01-02-2007 04:14:41  
It sounds like these guys are giving you some Good Advice! Also Check out Weber's Tractors Works for tune up info! Cliff



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T.R.Y.

01-02-2007 08:06:55




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 Re: timing? 230? plug gap? electronic ign. in reply to CLIFF S, 01-02-2007 07:59:32  
HEY CLIFF DROP ME AN EMAIL SO i CAN EMAIL YOU.



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Bob M

01-02-2007 07:49:09




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 Re: timing? 230? plug gap? electronic ign. in reply to t.r.y., 01-02-2007 04:14:41  
As John T mentions below, set the plug gap per the ignition mfr's recommendation. Or if you don't have gapping info I'd recommend about 0.045 - 0.050. (Keep in mind that within the ignition's ability to fire the plug, larger gap = better)

As for optimum timing for lugging, etc. set it per the owner's manual. I'm not familiar with the 230 but it's probably 0 deg (TDC) at low idle. Then check that the spark advances per spec (probably about 35 deg BTDC) at high idle RPM.

Keep in mind IHC engineers arrived at their timing spec after extensive experimentation and analysis! Deviations from factory timing generally cause less power and increased fuel consumption.

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John T

01-02-2007 08:15:14




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 Re: timing? 230? plug gap? electronic ign. in reply to Bob M, 01-02-2007 07:49:09  
Bob, sometime you n I n maybe the other Bob need to talk about plug gaps and electronic ignitions on the side by e mail or whatever so we dont bore the others lol. I have a running argument with a theoretical physicist buddy of mine on a related subject. My theory is while its true as you widen the plugs gap it requires higher voltage to cause current to arc jump across it buttttt ttttt ttt due to conservation of energy principles and since the coils stored energy (gets expended in Volts x Amps x Time across plug gap) is a fixed obviously finite number,,,,, that higher firing voltage must be traded off with EITHER less arcing current or a shorter spark duration time. He argues the current stays the same to which I respond thennnnn n the arc current duration MUST be less cuz you cant create or destroy energy and the coil stores energy ONLY during its primary conduction cycle at which time the secondary is an open circuit and an open is an open REGARDLESS if 0.025 or 0.050 plug gap.

What say you????? ???

John T (loves tricity chat DUH lol)

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teddy52food

01-02-2007 10:17:45




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 Re: timing? 230? plug gap? electronic ign. in reply to John T, 01-02-2007 08:15:14  
It takes voltage to jump the gap, but it takes amps to light the fire.



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John T

01-02-2007 14:22:30




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 Re: timing? 230? plug gap? electronic ign. in reply to teddy52food, 01-02-2007 10:17:45  
Teddy, I would agree and Bob would also Im sure with that statement. Its the arc, the sudden release/conversion of electrical energy into heat and associated light (mostly heat) that initiates combustion so I figure the more amps the more heat n energy to better light the fire and I also figure the wider n fatter and more surface are of the arc (more energy via the electronic ignition) the beter combustion also. Yayyyyy yyy

John T

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John T

01-02-2007 06:23:58




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 Re: timing? 230? plug gap? electronic ign. in reply to t.r.y., 01-02-2007 04:14:41  
The best plug gap is a question better answered by the electronic ignition vendor dependant to some extent on the coil used and the electronic switch and compression n fuel and other stufffff fff. That being said, often when an electronic ignition switch is used and coupled up with a high energy high voltage coil a wider plug gap is uded versus the old points n condensor ignition. Generally the electronic ignition and high energy coil allows for more energy to be expended across the plug gap to better initiate the combustion and the elec. ignition and high voltagd coil is capable of arcing current across that wider plug gap.

Nowwwww w its often the case where an elec ignition might run say a 0.035 up to even 0.045 or more versus say 0.025 with the points n condensor stock ignition, so if the vendor doesnt offer plug gap recommendatiosn Id just experiment starting at around 0.035.

The timing is again, dependant on RPM and fuel used n compression etc but if all else (compression n fuel n RPM etc) is unchanged from stock, I dont see where the timing would be changed much from what was best using the points n condensor. The point gap and cam and follower wear affects timing versus the elec switch where a magnet passing by the pickup coil is what triggers the spark and it dont change like when points wear. However, when adjusting timing using a timing light n rotating the distributor till she fires at a certain BTDC at a certain RPM, you can still get her to fire the same timing as using points.

I think theres a general misconception that advancing timing is some sort of a cure all and performance gainer buttttt t its really dependant mostly on RPM and compression n fuel and too far advanced actually hurts performance and may even harm the engine. As far as HP versus RPM and timing I think the only way to tell for sure is to hook her up to a dyno under load n adjust the timing n see what happens.

BOTTOM LINE the plug gap will likely be a lil wider (try 0.035 and 0.040 and up) but the timing would still be what it was before if youre still at the same basic RPM and fuel n compression. As far as "lugging" that occurs at a lil lower RPM and the distributors centrifugal RPM sensitive timing advanse ought to still work the same as with the old points as the base plate (where pickup coil replaces points) still rotates the same.

Ol John T and all in Indiana NOT an IHC man but believe this to be true regardless, Im curious what the more expreienced IHC guys have to say????? ????

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T.R.Y.

01-02-2007 08:13:05




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 Re: timing? 230? plug gap? electronic ign. in reply to John T, 01-02-2007 06:23:58  
HEY THANKS GUYS THE BOOK CALLS FOR 30BTDC AT HIGH IDLE NO LOAD. tHATS PRETTY MUCH WHERE i HAD IT. THEN PUT THE ELEC. IGN. IN LIKE A DUMMY DIDN'T CHECK IT. AND IT TURN OUT THAT IT WAS 48BTDC. i WOULD HAVE THOUGHT THE CHANGE WOULDN'T HAVE EFFECTED THE TIMING BUT i GUESSED WRONG. i SHOULD KNOW BY NOW CHECK EVERYTHING AND DON'T TRUST AFTERMARKET PARTS. OH WELL LIVE AND LEARN THANKS AGAIN



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John T

01-02-2007 08:20:26




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 Re: timing? 230? plug gap? electronic ign. in reply to T.R.Y., 01-02-2007 08:13:05  
The reason for the timing change has to do with the old points gap and where the elec ignitions pickup coil was mounted to the distributors base plate and the exact location of the magnet on the distributor shaft i.e. lots of physical and mounting location variables so what you say dont surprise me HOWEVER you can still correctly time it same as before by rotating the disttributor,,,,, ,but with that elec ignition it ought to stay cuz its NOT dependantt on any changing point gap or cam or follower wear/.

John T

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T.R.Y.

01-02-2007 08:41:04




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 Re: timing? 230? plug gap? electronic ign. in reply to John T, 01-02-2007 08:20:26  
RIGHT, i'M MORE UPSET AT MY SELF FOR NOT DOUBLE CHECKING. i KNOW THIS STUFF, JUST DON'T KNOW WHERE MY HEAD WAS. CHALK IT UP AS LESSON LEARNED. i'LL POST BACK LATER. i'M GOING TO PLAY AROUND TONIGHT WITH IT. THANKS GOOD TALKING TO YOU ALL.



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