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M pistons still stuck, what next besides a chisel

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Skk

11-19-2006 19:29:01




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I power washed out the crude (both sides), soaked, stared fires in the cyls, beat on the pistons with a B?H & 2X4, left soak for two more weeks - but those pistons are more stubborn than I am.

They were nearly new aluminum high compressions. The guy overhauled the tractor, then had the crank break in two(yes the crank) about 10 hours latter. Some fool left the head off in the barn for years, fine, but then they pulled it outside and left it sit over winter before telling us to come pick it up.

Anyone ever tried making a head plate that you could hook up to a porta-power and try pressing them down and out? I really want to try and save these liners and pistons. But fear if they are this rusted in that the corrosion grove at each pistons ring grove will be too severve.

Any other ideas.

Thx skk - Go Big Red!

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steelfronts

11-20-2006 19:06:56




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 Re: M pistons still stuck, what next besides a chi in reply to Skk, 11-19-2006 19:29:01  
Aluminum pistons stuck in iron sleeves it has been suggested to use dry ice on the top of piston. The piston will cool and shrink faster than the sleeve and may break the bond letting what ever snake oil solventyou prefer to penetrate.I have never had any luck with any of the methods of soaking and waiting havent tried the dry ice thing .I always end up completly disassembling in other words force

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viktor

11-20-2006 11:09:58




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 Re: M pistons still stuck, what next besides a chi in reply to Skk, 11-19-2006 19:29:01  
Do what Jake said to get the pistons loose and out of the sleeve. I had to do the same but I only wanted to save the rods. I replaced all the pistons and sleeves.



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Dave Sherburne NY

11-20-2006 09:07:09




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 Re: M pistons still stuck, what next besides a chi in reply to Skk, 11-19-2006 19:29:01  
third party image

This is what I used to get the sleeves and Pistons out of my Buda diesel with wet sleeves Worked very well. I dont know if your engine has wet or dry. and the sleeves have to stick down below the bottom of the cylinder bore for this to work. Click on the link for more details.

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JakeF

11-20-2006 07:49:57




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 Re: M pistons still stuck, what next besides a chi in reply to Skk, 11-19-2006 19:29:01  
Your sleaves are junk. Press them out the top and then carefully cut down the side of it with a grinder or cutoff wheel on a die grinder almost all the way thru. Don't go thru onto the piston or it'll be junk also. After you get it almost severed put a chisel against the side of the cut and tap it. The sleave will split and you can easily pull the piston. You will probably also have to use a skinny wheel on the rings to remove them. If your real steady and get the rings removed without making contact look the piston over real good and it's probably usable. Took me about 4 hrs and a set of tired eyes when done. Good luck

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Janicholson

11-20-2006 06:58:24




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 Re: M pistons still stuck, what next besides a chi in reply to Skk, 11-19-2006 19:29:01  
I guarantee the pistons in there are no good. I would cover the crank with a piece of tin, then use a cutting torch (not the oxygen jet, just the preheat flame) to melt one side of the piston top (90 degrees fron the pin) about 5/8" from the wall. Melt in 5 minute stages, first a hole, then the edge of the hole toward the wall, then the edge of that. As soon as a glob melts out, I would stop for Five min. then do it again. When the rings are seen from the back side, I would touch the oxy lever just a burst to blow them out the bottom 1/2 second at most. once this has been taken to the bottom ov the compression rings, the piston should be easy to pop loose. JimN

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JT

11-20-2006 06:38:13




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 Re: M pistons still stuck, what next besides a chi in reply to Skk, 11-19-2006 19:29:01  
On my M, that had a stuck piston, I took a jack and a chain, pressed the cylinder and piston out of the block, from the bottom, then after the cylinder was out, it relieved enough pressure that the piston was easy to get out. This was really stuck, been sitting out for over 20 years, no muffler. Good luck
Jim



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El Toro

11-20-2006 04:01:29




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 Re: M pistons still stuck, what next besides a chi in reply to Skk, 11-19-2006 19:29:01  
Use the ATF and let them soak. Then only heat one piston at a time and then use your block of wood and hammer. If that doesn't work have them pressed out. Hal



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gene bender

11-20-2006 03:54:19




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 Re: M pistons still stuck, what next besides a chi in reply to Skk, 11-19-2006 19:29:01  
Pull the engine then you can press out the top as thats the way they come out. They are junk or they wouldnt be stuck so bad start over then you will have something. BTDT.. Sometimes all the magic stuff just doesent work. With engine out and upside down you can press sleeve and piston out together. Youre going to replace the crank anyway.



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old

11-19-2006 20:55:51




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 Re: M pistons still stuck, what next besides a chi in reply to Skk, 11-19-2006 19:29:01  
Well first off what did you soak it with?? If you used PB, or WD40 then yep they will not come out. Now if you used tranny fluid and or turpentine and they still haven't come out then your going to have to bite the bullet and pull the engine and push from the bottom and even then the sleeves will probably come out with the pistons and then you will need new sleeves and pistons to ever get it to run again. And yes I have seen more then one crank broken before, never have figured out how they brake but they do

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the Unforgiven

11-20-2006 08:44:40




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 Re: M pistons still stuck, what next besides a chi in reply to old, 11-19-2006 20:55:51  
Hey old, are you telling me that since I started using PB none of the stuff I have been working on was really stuck after all? If ANY fluid breaks one loose on it's own, it wasn't very stuck, and any one of many products would probably work as good as the next. I really like PB, so I am just in it for my 2 cents worth.



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old

11-20-2006 09:15:54




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 Re: M pistons still stuck, what next besides a chi in reply to the Unforgiven, 11-20-2006 08:44:40  
What I'm say is I have tried PB, WD40, diesel etc etc but the only 2 things I have ever found that would work again and again is tranny fluid and turpentine. None of the other stuff has ever done any thing for me but make a mess. Ya PB works ok on bolts but not in a stuck engine or at least it never has for me. Plus it costs 3 or 4 time more then the tranny fluid to boot

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John A.

11-19-2006 20:47:01




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 Re: M pistons still stuck, what next besides a chi in reply to Skk, 11-19-2006 19:29:01  
Skk, How big of a fire did you build?, fill the cylinders up to to the top with Diesel, then set the fire. If the pistons are near the top of the stroke then it will require a lot of fire! Do it numerious times you have to build enought heat to break the rust loose. Just keep trying, then will break loose, inbetween times when you have to do something else then leave ATF in the cylinders to soak.
A 4lb sledge and a 4x4 block will help to break it loose. Hope this helps.
Later,
John A.

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Nebraska Kirk

11-19-2006 20:25:53




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 Re: M pistons still stuck, what next besides a chi in reply to Skk, 11-19-2006 19:29:01  
I would be VERY apprehensive about pressing the pistons down while still in the block, you put too much pressure down on the piston and you will break the sleeve. Been there, done that :-) What you can do is to press the entire piston, rod and sleeve UP and out of the block completely. Then you can put the sleeve and piston in a press and try pressing the piston out, with the bottom of the sleeve resting on a solid surface. Before you start pressing, heat the sleeve all the way around (just that area of the sleeve where the piston is stuck) with a torch to break the rust bond, then, while mantaining heat on the sleeve, start applying pressure down on the piston. If possible, get two torches going at once to maintain heat as far around the sleeve as possible.

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the tractor vet

11-19-2006 19:58:45




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 Re: M pistons still stuck, what next besides a chi in reply to Skk, 11-19-2006 19:29:01  
Nothing that a 40-50 ton press won't fix then ya buy new and start all over and forget the were going to try and make the old work, NAH if i am going to go thru the trouble of building a motor then i am going to build a motor that will live a long time . Nowif i am building a BONZI motor the i'll go dumpster diving and make things work and when the pin falls out of the spoon and ya have all kinds of pices and parts it is back to the drawen board.

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