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Farmall & IHC Tractors Discussion Forum
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C charging problems

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Tim Mattson

10-16-2006 12:10:19




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My 1948 Farmall C charges but not enough to keep up with the lights on. The C has a magneto and orginally had a cut-out relay. I switched to a voltage regulator but it didn't help any. With the tractor off, the battery's voltage is at 6.20, with it running at high idle its at 6.30v, and shows 5 amps on the ammeter. With the lights on dim, it drops to 6.20v and a discharge of 7 amps, and with the lights on high is goes down to 6.12 volts and a discharge of 9 amps. I've checked the grounds on the generator, regular, and instrument box and ran an extra wire back to the ground post of the battery, did the motor test on the generator, ran good, with the field grounded, then ungrounded it ran faster. I've replaced the generator brushes and adjusted the third brush to the highest setting. Any ideas? Thanks

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John T

10-16-2006 13:37:20




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 Re: C charging problems in reply to Tim Mattson, 10-16-2006 12:10:19  
Tim, it sounds like you done went n did and/or Jim suggested most things I might have recommended, this makes it harder on us guys lol

For one thing, some of the old 3 brush Delco gennys that used cutout relays n light switch field current control only put out something like 10 amps max on their best days. One thing I believe would help, although Ive never tried it on those, would be to go inside the genny n completely remove the 3rd adjustable brush and rewire the first lead field winding (one that 3rd brush was wired to) up there to the incoming ARM post just like the 2 brush gennys are wired. That should eliminate at least a part of the normal voltage drop which moving the 3rd adjustable brush was all about..... ..

Other then that, and AFTER you insure a tight belt and BOTH the genny n VR are well grounded and the genny n VR are wired correct, do like Jim mentioned to dead ground the gennys field post n see if she charges better then????? ? If so I suspect a poor VR ground or the VR is bad or misadjusted..... ..if its no better leave it dead grounded and jump by pass the VR's Cutout Relay by momentarily wiring its BAT and GEN terminals together in case the relay has some carbon resistance. Once the field is dead grounded and the relay is jumped around the VR is basically out of the equation and any poor charging must then be a genny problem if not a miswiring or a bad ground or connection somewhere.

You sure the battery is good????? ? Had it load tested ??? A weak battery may not take a good charge you know!!!!! If the gennys brushes are bad or the commutator is all gummed over it can charge but be weak also.

My complete long winded troubleshooting procedure is posted probably 100 times below regarding charging problems but I dont think it would help much for you, check the VR and genny wiring and belt n grounds n connections AND ESPECIALLY FOR A BAD BATTERY and run the VR by pass checks and if thats alllll lll okay take a look at the gennys brushes n commutator and then maybe consider rewiring it as i suggested above as a 2 brush genny

BUT LET US ALL KNOW WHAT HAPPENS

John T

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Tim Mattson

10-16-2006 14:56:39




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 Re: C charging problems in reply to John T, 10-16-2006 13:37:20  
John,
I went out and worked on the C some more. First I grounded the field post on the regulator. It acted the same as before. Then I jumped the Batt to Gen posts I got the following numbers, 6.5v at high idle, 6.4v with dim lights, 6.3 bright lights. Then I took both jumpers off and got, 6.6v with no lites, 6.46 with dim lights, and 6.30 with bright lights. Also I pulled the battery out of my other C and got a little higher numbers, but the ammeter read the same as before with discharge with the lights on. So does this point to the generator?
Thanks for your help

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Janicholson

10-16-2006 16:09:54




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 Re: C charging problems in reply to Tim Mattson, 10-16-2006 14:56:39  
I think you have a marginal generator. I would do as John T indicates and do away with the third brush, or get a newer generator without the third brush. ( a good shop can rewire it to two brush if there is one near you.) With the Battery charged, the engine at High Idle, and the regulator bypassed with the field grounded, it should for sure charge the battery a bit while the lights are on. Good luck, JimN

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Janicholson

10-16-2006 12:57:33




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 Re: C charging problems in reply to Tim Mattson, 10-16-2006 12:10:19  
John T has great charging system analysis info on many posts in the archives (No need to reproduce it) I would start by making sure that the connections to the original light switch L-H connection is not being used. I would then make sure the regulator was grounded well to bare metal, or seperate ground using 10 gauge wire, and good terminals. Next I would ful field the gen by starting the tractor and grounding the field terminal with a aligator tipped jumper. If the gauge then shows greater charge, 15-18 amps, I would adjust the voltage regulator (because I know how, or read in a good manual on the delco system you have), or replace it. The voltage should be between 6.7 and 7 volts at high idle. See johns material for more if needed. JimN

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