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Farmall & IHC Tractors Discussion Forum
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IH 454 trouble

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joe/pa

05-27-2005 16:43:32




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Well the 454 has finally broke. AS long as you hold the clutch in everything is OK. Hydrolics, brakes, steering, pto, work good. AS soon as you let out on the clutch, wether it be in gear or neutral (both gear lever and range) the tractor will bog down and stall out. The tires move free (had to pull it out of the field). Any ideas? I was thinking maybe a bearing on the input shaft? Gotta go look at the diagrams...

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Bernard le mécano

05-28-2005 09:04:07




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 Re: IH 454 trouble in reply to joe/pa, 05-27-2005 16:43:32  
Hi Joe, when you have pull the tractor, is the range lever was in neutral? If so, the range box is good and the trouble is in the speed transmission box. I have changed the output bearing, on the 4 speed, once, on a 884 and the tractor done the same thing. You can lift the speed transmission cover and check in. Bernard le mécano Québec Canada



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joe/pa

05-28-2005 13:22:20




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 Re: IH 454 trouble in reply to Bernard le mécano, 05-28-2005 09:04:07  
When I pulled the tractor I kept it running with the clutch depressed so I had my power steering. I kept the range lever in neutral. I spoke with my IH dealer this morning and they are leaning toward a bad pilot bearing.. I may be missing something but wouldn't the pilot bearing be turning all the time? From the way I looked in the manual I thought the IPTO shaft spun off the input shaft?



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JB2

05-28-2005 16:36:34




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 Re: IH 454 trouble in reply to joe/pa, 05-28-2005 13:22:20  
Hi Joe, If it was a siezed pilot bearing, the tractor would keep on going when the clutch was depressed. The IPTO shaft is hollow and it is driven from the pressure plate and always turns with the engine and in front of the speed transmission, it is then geared to another shaft that drives hydraulic pump and is input side of IPTO clutch. The transmission input shaft is connected to the clutch and runs down the center of the IPTO shaft into the speed transmission.

I would go with Bernard's diagnosis as the problem is in the speed transmission. Bernard has lots of experience on these tractors as the same transmission rear end is used in 454,484,485,495,464,574,585,595,674,684,695,784, 884,895 series tractors.

JB2

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Bernard le mécano

05-28-2005 17:24:23




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 Re: IH 454 trouble in reply to JB2, 05-28-2005 16:36:34  
Hi Joe, have you try to pull the tractor with the range in high or low when you push the clutch in? Normally the speed transmission does not bog in 2 speed. It have 2 syncro for 1-2 and 3-4, it have no neutral but you can reach one between 1-2 and 3-4 speed. The power from the engine goes to the counter-shaft, then the output shaft, by the syncro, then the low range. The high range is make by a collar( output shaft to pinion shaft) On the output shaft, next the 4 speed syncro, it have a bearing, may be this one is burn. The return line from the brake circuit, lube this bearing. It have a T fittning on the rear of the speed transmissin, the bearing is under. Bernard le mécano Québec Canada

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JB2

05-27-2005 18:11:36




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 Re: IH 454 trouble in reply to joe/pa, 05-27-2005 16:43:32  
Hi Joe, the 454 has 2 transmissions, a speed transmission and a range transmission. The speed transmission is located in the torque tube behind the clutch. It has the 4 speeds 1 thru 4 and no neutral. The range transmission is located between the speed transmission and the differential. The range transmission has HI(direct drive), Lo, Rev and Neutral. So by putting the Range transmission in Neutral you are able to tow the tractor OK.

My first suspect would be the speed transmission is in 2 gears at once, especially if the problem happen when you were changing gears. According to the I&T shop manual the main shaft bearing is lubed from within the transmission by a lube pump but the functioning of the pump cannot be checked from the outside.

Good luck
JB2

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joe/pa

05-27-2005 18:35:01




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 Re: IH 454 trouble in reply to JB2, 05-27-2005 18:11:36  
Thanks for the replys! It happened while flail mowing in 1st gear. No noise, just bogged the tractor down and stalled. I had the same problem last year, only it would squeal really loud and stop. Couldn't pull it or anything. The IH dealer couldn't find any problems... Let it cool for a while and it would go just as normal. Only this time I' m not as lucky. So the speed transmission is always turning? What about when the speed selector is inbetween gears? If it is stuck between gears what is the best way to unstick it?? Any way of doing it without splitting the tractor? I can move the speed selector and range selector with no problem. It feels like it is engaging everything (hi, lo, reverse...1,2,3,4). Need to go find my manual!

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JB2

05-27-2005 19:25:24




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 Re: IH 454 trouble in reply to joe/pa, 05-27-2005 18:35:01  
Hi Joe, the squealling is not a good noise. Squealling usually indicates a bearing lacking lubrication and about to sieze. According to the I&T shop manual, the speed transmission main shaft is always turning when the clutch is released. The speed transmission consists of 1 main shaft and a countershaft but the main shaft is split into 2 pieces, the input part at the front and the output part at the back. The rear of the input shaft fits inside the front of the output shaft.
So if range transmission is between gears and clutch is released then only the main shaft and possibly the coutershaft should be turning.

To access the top cover of the speed transmission
all the parts from the battery box, steering, dash and etc. have to be removed. To repair the tractor has to be split at clutch housing and it is not clear from the manual if it has to be split again between at range transmission.

Good luck
JB2

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Allan in NE

05-27-2005 17:02:53




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 Re: IH 454 trouble in reply to joe/pa, 05-27-2005 16:43:32  
Joe,

Sounds to me like it is stuck in two gears.

Dunno,

Allan



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