TRACTOR PARTS Allis Chalmers Case & David Brown Farmall & International Ferguson Ford & New Holland John Deere Massey Ferguson Massey Harris Minneapolis Moline Oliver & Cockshutt Kubota / Yanmar

TRACTOR MANUALS

Allis Chalmers	Case	Farmall IH	Ford 8N,9N,2N	Ford
Ferguson	John Deere	Massey Ferguson	Minn. Moline	Oliver

Farmall & IHC Tractors Discussion Forum

Completly stumped

Welcome Guest, Log in or Register

Author

Dixieland

03-18-2005 15:07:25

Report to Moderator

I installed my Farmall B starter and just as soon as it engages it hits a stump er something! I used my hand crank and turned the engine over several revolutions and tried the starter again. Still stuck. Removed the starter, checked everthing including the measurements to the flywheel. Put it back on and it hit a stump again. I tried 3 different starters and all three stops dead as soon as it engages the flywheel. Each time I checked it with the hand crank and have no problem turning engine over with it. I reached into the inspection hole and turned the flywheel with a pry bar and it turns easy. Why is this dadgum starter hanging up? Has anyone got any ideas what to look for? One other question. The double dots on the govenor gear matches with the double dots on the cam gears, correct?

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

El Toro

03-19-2005 09:12:57

Report to Moderator

Re: Completly stumped in reply to Dixieland, 03-18-2005 15:07:25

If that ring gear has more teeth as Haas has suggested, that flywheel may be a little wider
in the overall diameter causing the starter to jam. Hal

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

Dixieland

03-19-2005 10:19:36

Report to Moderator

Re: Completly stumped in reply to El Toro, 03-19-2005 09:12:57

My next thing to do is count the teeth on the ring gear...Thanks

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

Haas

03-19-2005 04:53:46

Report to Moderator

Re: Completly stumped in reply to Dixieland, 03-18-2005 15:07:25

I did a little research. Parts CD says that ring gear has 90 teeth on A, B, Super A, 100, 130, 140. So make a mark on the flywheel and count the teeth. The CD also says that on the C-123 power unit for balers, the ring gear has 112 teeth. Why would IH do that?? I don't know, but there must have been a reason. I can't tell from the parts CD if the flywheels for the baler (and also crawler tractors) are different or not because the flywheel is not listed as a separate part without the ring gear. But if your ring gear does not have 90 teeth, the starter off the A, or any you get that is for a B will not work.

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

Dixieland

03-19-2005 10:18:27

Report to Moderator

Re: Completly stumped in reply to Haas, 03-19-2005 04:53:46

Thanks Hass....I will count the teeth this afternoon and let you know what I find out.

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

El Toro

03-18-2005 19:14:06

Report to Moderator

Re: Completly stumped in reply to Dixieland, 03-18-2005 15:07:25

Try shorting across the solenoid with a screwdriver to see if the engine cranks. I would check that battery's cells to see what the specific gravity readings are. All cell readings should be close to one another. Corroded cable connections are a good insulator. Check the ground cable where it attaches to the tractor frame for rust or paint. Needs to be nice and shiny. Hal

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

Dixieland

03-19-2005 03:59:37

Report to Moderator

Re: Completly stumped in reply to El Toro, 03-18-2005 19:14:06

I even disconnected the battery and used the 125 amp, 6 volt start on my charger. I changed batteries, cleaned all connections, and installed a new switch. Even tried the 225 amp, 12 volt start on my charger with a good 12 volt battery. When the starter engages the flywheel it still jams up...still stumped!

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

El Toro

03-19-2005 04:25:14

Report to Moderator

Re: Completly stumped in reply to Dixieland, 03-19-2005 03:59:37

Is the positive terminal of the battery connected to ground? If it is disconnect the the ground cable and remove the starter. Reconnect battery cable to starter and reconnect cable to ground.
Short across solenoid terminals with a screwdriver
to see if the bendix drive is turning freely.
Do not hold the srewdriver on the terminals, just touch them and watch the bendix, it should fly out
like it's going to engage the flywheel. Be careful doing this. Keep fingers and clothing
away from the bendix drive while doing this. That bendix will respond to being energize in a second. If this appears ok there has to be a mismatch somewhere between the flywheel and starter pinion gear. Hal

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

Dixieland

03-19-2005 04:51:55

Report to Moderator

Re: Completly stumped in reply to El Toro, 03-19-2005 04:25:14

Hi Toro...I did that already and the positive terminal is not hooked to the ground, the negative terminal is...I think it may be a mismatch but by sight they look like a match...How is the best way to tell for sure?...Thanks

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

El Toro

03-19-2005 05:12:29

Report to Moderator

Re: Completly stumped in reply to Dixieland, 03-19-2005 04:51:55

If that tractor has the original 6 volt system, the positive battery terminal is grounded. The
cable from negative battery terminal goes to the
starter. Hal

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

Dixieland

03-19-2005 05:17:45

Report to Moderator

Re: Completly stumped in reply to El Toro, 03-19-2005 05:12:29

Ok, if you say so...think that may be the problem? The tractor has no lights but does have a generator to keep the battery charged but it is disconnected right now...Thanks

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

El Toro

03-19-2005 05:30:42

Report to Moderator

Re: Completly stumped in reply to Dixieland, 03-19-2005 05:17:45

All those old tractors and cars in the 1930's thru
the early 1950's were 6 volt with positive ground.
My first car with negative ground was a 57 Chevy
and with 12 volts too. Hal
PS: Switch those cables around and let us know if it cranks.

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

Dixieland

03-19-2005 10:25:01

Report to Moderator

Re: Completly stumped in reply to El Toro, 03-19-2005 05:30:42

Hi Toro...I had to go to work this morning but this afternoon I will count the ring gear teeth and if it is right I will change to a positive ground and give that a try...Thanks...Keep those suggestion coming...I have tried em all and so far no luck....maybe this afternoon will shed some new light.

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

gene b

03-18-2005 19:07:49

Report to Moderator

Re: Completly stumped in reply to Dixieland, 03-18-2005 15:07:25

You forgot to say what starter was on the B when you encountered all these problems. I would say you need either new cables or battery or maybe both. Your teeth are the same on the flywheel for both the A and B. Just try a battery from one of the tractors that you used the starters from. Dont over look the sw on the top of the starter.

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

Dixieland

03-19-2005 04:07:18

Report to Moderator

Re: Completly stumped in reply to gene b, 03-18-2005 19:07:49

Hi Gene. It was the starter that came on it when I got it. The Delco numbers match the numbers on the 'A' starters. I installed a new switch. Cables and batteries are all ok and done changed starters 3 times. That doggone thing still won't go!!! As soon as the starter engages the flywheel,it comes to a dead stop and the starter says hmmmmm mmmmm m, like a dead short. All starters I tried done the same thing. Darndest thing I ever seen!

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

gene b

03-19-2005 11:49:39

Report to Moderator

Re: Completly stumped in reply to Dixieland, 03-19-2005 04:07:18

YES THE # ON THE STARTER SHOULD BE 1101021. Someone must have changed the ring gear in the flywheel. The ring gear on the flywheel of a power unit must be different as some of them with starters could be different as the starter rotation is reversed from that of a tractor. I will have to look at my u-2 power unit.

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

Dixieland

03-19-2005 14:33:39

Report to Moderator

Re: Completly stumped in reply to gene b, 03-19-2005 11:49:39

Thanks again Gene. The problem was solved by changing to a positive ground. Darndest thing I have seen.....Thanks

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

Aces

03-18-2005 18:25:12

Report to Moderator

Re: Completly stumped in reply to Dixieland, 03-18-2005 15:07:25

Dixieland The timing marks on the govenor gear don't make any difference just make sure you time the distributer number one plug wire to number one cylinder when on TDC the number one plug wire is the one at 1 o clock on the cap. You can pull the distributer drive out and turn it to line up at any point. Tis will work for all the old 4 cylinders with the drive on the right side.

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

Dixieland

03-18-2005 18:44:34

Report to Moderator

Re: Completly stumped in reply to Aces, 03-18-2005 18:25:12

Thanks Ace!!!

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

lp gas only

03-18-2005 18:06:52

Report to Moderator

Re: Completly stumped in reply to Dixieland, 03-18-2005 15:07:25

Take some cheap spray paint and coat the teeth on the starter. Let it dry and try it again. If the teeth are binding, it should show up on the paint. It might be the wrong gear on flywheel or starter. Did you count the teeth on the old one?

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

Dixieland

03-18-2005 18:47:38

Report to Moderator

Re: Completly stumped in reply to lp gas only, 03-18-2005 18:06:52

Hi LP...Count the teeth??? what is the ratio? You could be right about a mismatch because the starters were off Farmall A tractors. Heck, I thought they were the same....Thanks

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

jimbub

03-18-2005 15:35:38

Report to Moderator

Re: Completly stumped in reply to Dixieland, 03-18-2005 15:07:25

Im no pro but once I had to back starter bolts off 1/2 turn and let new starter mesh in for awhile. give it a try

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

Dixieland

03-18-2005 18:53:45

Report to Moderator

Re: Completly stumped in reply to jimbub, 03-18-2005 15:35:38

Hi Jim...I did give it a try....Jammed like a rock star....thanks

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

Dixieland

03-18-2005 17:26:24

Report to Moderator

Re: Completly stumped in reply to jimbub, 03-18-2005 15:35:38

I already tried that too. Even used a couple of washers between the starter and torq tube housing. Same thing. Dead stop!

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

JOSSETTE

03-18-2005 16:02:47

Report to Moderator

Re: Completly stumped in reply to jimbub, 03-18-2005 15:35:38

if you could hold a meter at the starter while moma turns the key--see if the voltage drops or if you have enough to keep it going. week battery or poor cables=====

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

Dixieland

03-18-2005 17:24:28

Report to Moderator

Re: Completly stumped in reply to JOSSETTE, 03-18-2005 16:02:47

I already checked all that! It stops deadern a doornail.

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

JOSSETTE

03-18-2005 18:03:13

Report to Moderator

Re: Completly stumped in reply to Dixieland, 03-18-2005 17:24:28

not enough volts ( bad cables)or
the drive is not getting in the ring gear at all.
make sure the ring gear and drives have the same gear ratio( to small of teeth)on either one..

I would not think that all 3 starters are shot.

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

Dixieland

03-18-2005 18:50:15

Report to Moderator

Re: Completly stumped in reply to JOSSETTE, 03-18-2005 18:03:13

Hi Jossette...The starters all worked fine on other tractors (A). I don't know about the ratio...I wuz jus goin by sight...shootin from the hip...Thanks

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

fredmich

03-19-2005 08:10:58

Report to Moderator

Re: Completly stumped in reply to Dixieland, 03-18-2005 18:50:15

Just curious, did or will the tractor start with the hand crank? Also did you try cranking it over with the spark plugs out? And last did you count the teeth on the flywheel like the first gentleman suggested.

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

Dixieland

03-19-2005 10:21:41

Report to Moderator

Re: Completly stumped in reply to fredmich, 03-19-2005 08:10:58

Hi Fred...Yes, I have tried it with the plugs out....Looks like iy may be a mesh problem between the starter drive and ring gear...will let you know...Thanks

[Log in to Reply] [No Email]

[Options] [Printer Friendly] [Posting Help] [Return to Forum] [Log in to Reply]

TRACTOR PARTS	TRACTOR MANUALS

We sell tractor parts! We have the parts you need to repair your tractor - the right parts. Our low prices and years of research make us your best choice when you need parts. Shop Online Today. [ About Us ]

Home | Forums

Copyright © 1997-2023 Yesterday's Tractor Co.
All Rights Reserved. Reproduction of any part of this website, including design and content, without written permission is strictly prohibited. Trade Marks and Trade Names contained and used in this Website are those of others, and are used in this Website in a descriptive sense to refer to the products of others. Use of this Web site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy

TRADEMARK DISCLAIMER: Tradenames and Trademarks referred to within Yesterday's Tractor Co. products and within the Yesterday's Tractor Co. websites are the property of their respective trademark holders. None of these trademark holders are affiliated with Yesterday's Tractor Co., our products, or our website nor are we sponsored by them. John Deere and its logos are the registered trademarks of the John Deere Corporation. Agco, Agco Allis, White, Massey Ferguson and their logos are the registered trademarks of AGCO Corporation. Case, Case-IH, Farmall, International Harvester, New Holland and their logos are registered trademarks of CNH Global N.V.

Yesterday's Tractors - Antique Tractor Headquarters

Website Accessibility Policy