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Farmall & IHC Tractors Discussion Forum
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Farmalls with Loader Break at Split Location

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Wayne Kittler

03-17-2005 21:01:05




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I have seen an H with loader break all bolts at the split location and held together with a chain and binder.Some one on this group said that you could re-enforce the body with angle or steel plate. How can this be accomplished?




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Mac

03-18-2005 07:12:13




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 Re: Farmalls with Loader Break at Split Location in reply to Wayne Kittler, 03-17-2005 21:01:05  
I welded 4X4X.25 rails from mid mount to to ROPS mount on axles. Does anyone think a crossmember between rails would help with torsional stress from off centered loads? Maybe I worry to much.



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Allan in NE

03-18-2005 02:22:03




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 Re: Farmalls with Loader Break at Split Location in reply to Wayne Kittler, 03-17-2005 21:01:05  
Hi Wayne,

It is not just the IH tractors that break. Talk to anyone who has raised alfalfa hay and they'll tell you that all tractors, loaded heavy enough, will break in two.

There was a fella talking here about a month ago, who said he had a 4020 John Deere split right up the middle of the engine block and the old heifer laid down on the ground. A 4020 is a fair sized tractor.

And it is not just the weight. When put into service, a loader tractor is always trying to "twist" across it's midline every time one of the wheels hits a high/low spot in the ground.

So anyway, the idea is to move the stress of this added weight and twist to a linear 'for and aft' form "under" the tractor instead of making the chassis take the heat. Kind of a "sub-frame" like Hugh says.

Something is needed that will tie the front of the tractor to the rear and eliminate the weakest link in the chain, the tractor's midsection.

Here's a picture of a tractor out of the hay fields of South Dakota.

Allan

third party image

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Hugh MacKay

03-18-2005 00:21:03




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 Re: Farmalls with Loader Break at Split Location in reply to Wayne Kittler, 03-17-2005 21:01:05  
Wayne: I have seen a number of these broken in my day. In all cases it is my opinion they broke because the bolts were loose. However some of those first IH loaders didn't support tractor strength very well. Once you get to 1960 era loaders with full length sub frame going from rear axle to front end, that in itself gave the tractor a lot of strength.



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Haas

03-18-2005 06:15:43




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 Re: Farmalls with Loader Break at Split Location in reply to Hugh MacKay, 03-18-2005 00:21:03  
Hugh, I don't want to get into details, but you are correct about the loose bolts. To carry the most load, bolts must be tight. Sounds strange, that a bolt with tension on it will carry more than one that is loose and has no tension, but it's true. A loose bolt will always break before one that is properly torqued.



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Hugh MacKay

03-18-2005 08:57:45




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 Re: Farmalls with Loader Break at Split Location in reply to Haas, 03-18-2005 06:15:43  
Paul: While I agree with you my concern was really about loose bolt holding castings of the tractor together. Two castings bolted together or any item bolted to a casting is quite tough, but let them get loose and the cast is quite vulnerable.

I remember going to a local welding shop once with broken cast portion of Farmall 300 front wheel. This was quite amusing as our local welding shop guy was an alcoholic. I had the misfortune of getting him on a 40 ounce day. He said," running with rim loose on hub, no man alive tough enough to stay on a Farmall long enough to break that hub if wheel is tight." I must admit he was right. The cast wheel was broke rght through one spoke and right into bearing journal.

That welder was drunk when I left the wheel, he was still drunk two days later when I went back for it. In fact he was sitting on the same 5 gallon pail. That would have been 45- 47 years ago and last time I saw the 300 the wheel was still going. He must have sobered up for the welding, but I'm not sure.

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Haas

03-18-2005 18:14:53




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 Re: Farmalls with Loader Break at Split Location in reply to Hugh MacKay, 03-18-2005 08:57:45  
Yes, you are correct, the casting would be vulnerable as well, maybe more so than the bolt. Same goes though, a joint tightly clamped with bolts is much stronger in the long run than one which has the bolts loose or even not tightened to specs. Bolts should always be torqued to the recommended working load(tension) for the bolt. Fortunately, most old tractors had lots of safety factor most places in the design and one or two bolts not torqued up made no difference. However, add heavy stress items like a loader and everything must be right.

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Randy in Pa

03-18-2005 06:56:23




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 Re: Farmalls with Loader Break at Split Location in reply to Haas, 03-18-2005 06:15:43  
My 230 was broken at one time. I can see all the welds and reinforcement plates around the bell housing. They did a good job on fixing it though.

I would love to have a loader on my 230. Even an old trip bucket would be lovely.

Seems to me that there are flat areas to bolt things on to all up and down the sides of the tractor. A fella could bolt a piece of 4" channel iron from the front of the tractor down along the sides running all the way to the rear wheels on both sides, and that would keep the tractor together. This would serve as a sub frame for attaching a loader.

What is wrong with that?

Randy in Pa

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steveormary

03-18-2005 10:24:23




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 Re: Farmalls with Loader Break at Split Location in reply to Randy in Pa, 03-18-2005 06:56:23  
On the M with an F-10 Farmhand loader we had turn buckles running from the loader frame that bolted under the tractor to the side rails.

In all the years(50+)we only upset one loader tractor and that was due to a bolt that broke. Nobody got hurt.

It seems the loaders do twist alot and afterwhile,for whatever reason the F-10"s seem to hang to the left.

Ya"ll be careful out there. steveandmary

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