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B414 Diesel Smokes, No Power - HELP!

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Dan Caldwell

02-17-2005 17:00:36

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I am working on a B414 Diesel that was passed onto me because the previous handyman got frustrated with it - so I said I'd give it a try...

Symptoms are that it will start, but will not speed up to more than an idle and smokes dark smoke like crazy.

I checked the injectors and found 2 bad, replaced the tips on those thinking problem solved - nope - still does same thing.

I thought maybe a fuel problem ie: blockage or air - so I bled all the lines again by loosening off right at the injectors until fuel came out, then tightened back up again - still same problem.

One thing I did notice is that when I loosened off #1 injector line the tractor stalled, did not change when loosening all the others.

Hmm. Any thoughts? This tractor I am told had a recent head/valve job and ran fine for a month or so after that then developed this problem. I haven't checked compression yet - maybe that is the next step.

Any and all hints and clues would be appreciated!

Dan Caldwell
Chatsworth, Ontario

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Opa A

02-18-2005 10:56:37

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Re: B414 Diesel Smokes, No Power - HELP! in reply to Dan Caldwell, 02-17-2005 17:00:36

I believe you have a CAV pump on that unit. Check the return line and all the fittings from the pump back to the tank. If there is a restriction pressure will build up in the fuel pump housing and not let the pump plungers fully return to the cam ring, thus not let the pump deliver enough fuel to the injectors to run above idle. You can just disconnect the return line at the pump and see how she runs, fuel should be flowing freely from the return fitting on the pump. If that doesn't do it take the return fitting out of the pump itself and see if you can blow through it, they have a ball check valve that sometimes stick and cause a restriction also. Not a very common problem but does happen and will give the symptoms you describe and can be an easy fix w/o removing the pump.
Please let us know what you find. Good luck.

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02-18-2005 07:44:17

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Re: B414 Diesel Smokes, No Power - HELP! in reply to Dan Caldwell, 02-17-2005 17:00:36

Did you pressure test the injecters when they were out? Is your spray pattern, even, or is kind of slobbery? If it starts and runs on its own, then your compression should be OK. As others have said, it could be a pump. I know this is not the answer you wanted to hear, but if I was having these problems, I would probably take the injectors and pump and have both checked. More than likely it is one of the two and if you are going to keep the tractor, it is a sound and good investment to have this done.

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captaink

02-18-2005 06:18:54

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Re: B414 Diesel Smokes, No Power - HELP! in reply to Dan Caldwell, 02-17-2005 17:00:36

While you are checking the valve adjustment, crank the engine over and notice the rocker arm movement on ALL the valves. Black smoke is the result of incomplete combustion which is caused by either lack of air, or excess (or poorly vaporized) fuel. I�m concerned about possibly having a bad camshaft or something came loose in the head that is causing the valves to not open properly.

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Michael Soldan

02-18-2005 05:13:13

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Re: B414 Diesel Smokes, No Power - HELP! in reply to Dan Caldwell, 02-17-2005 17:00:36

Dan, there's a place just south of Clinton, Huron Fuel Injection, that has a good reputation if your pump needs work. I'm sure there are places closer to Chatsworth but thought I would throw that in...Mike in Exeter Ontario

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Hugh MacKay

02-18-2005 00:35:57

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Re: B414 Diesel Smokes, No Power - HELP! in reply to Dan Caldwell, 02-17-2005 17:00:36

Dan: I'm with KB on this, check out the easy ones first. If that smoke is black, first place I'd look would be air intake, make sure it is clean and clean all the way.

From there you just have to look at injection pump. Your remark about no.1 injector suggests to me no.1 is probably the only one working well, since the others don't seem to make any difference. Check for leaks, loose adjustments, timing, etc. That failing, take it to an injection specialist, pump and injectors.

You can do a compression test if you wish, but unless the smoke is white or blue, don't think that will tell you a lot. I've seen diesels with compression so bad you had to tow them cold, in gear with clutch out, until engine warmed enough to increase compression. Once warmed up they worked quite well, no great power, but they ran well, and ran smooth, and saw you thruogh to the end of haying, seeding, etc.

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Dave Wilguess

02-17-2005 22:06:34

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Re: B414 Diesel Smokes, No Power - HELP! in reply to Dan Caldwell, 02-17-2005 17:00:36

Check your valve adjustment first then check the spray out of the lines for the injectors they must have a good spray if not then pull the pump and have it tested the pump on the 414 is a easy pump to pull and you can have one rebuilt for $250.00 to $450.00 depends on where you are I just checked to have one rebuilt and they wanted $250.00 but I found a parts tractor.

Florida Mud Bog

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Dan Caldwell

02-18-2005 04:24:24

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Re: B414 Diesel Smokes, No Power - HELP! in reply to Dave Wilguess, 02-17-2005 22:06:34

I'll check everything that was suggested here and get back - thanks to everyone who has offered help - this is great!

Dan

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George 2

02-17-2005 18:50:32

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Re: B414 Diesel Smokes, No Power - HELP! in reply to Dan Caldwell, 02-17-2005 17:00:36

Dan: Take it to the boys at Stoltz Case IH in Mildmay. They have one or two old time mechanics that have a lot of experience on the B414, 434, 444, 384 tractors. They will be able to sort out your smoke problems pretty quickly. If it is the pump the DPA pump is not that expensive to repair. Probably cheapest in the long run.

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George 2

02-17-2005 19:00:41

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Re: B414 Diesel Smokes, No Power - HELP! in reply to George 2, 02-17-2005 18:50:32

On second thought, I once had a 715 combine with the German diesel that exhibited the same symptoms. I took the rotary Bosch injection pump out to the injection pump shop. They found one fuel injection excess fuel adjustment screw became loose from vibration and allowed excessive fuel in.It would smoke real bad and only idle. As such if you know how to remove and replace pump, take it out to a pump shop that knows tthe old CAV pumps to get them to put it on a test stand to see what is wrong.

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K.B.-826

02-17-2005 18:50:30

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Re: B414 Diesel Smokes, No Power - HELP! in reply to Dan Caldwell, 02-17-2005 17:00:36

Let's start with the easy things first. Got a good flow of fuel out of the tank? Fuel filter been changed recently? Is the air cleaner clean? Inspect the entire intake system for obstuctions. Since it just had a head job, double check the valve lash adjustments. Have you checked the injection pump timing yet? If you have the correct compression adapter/guage, do a compression check just for the heck of it. If you don't get anywhere after checking these things out, it's time to send the injection pump out to be rebuilt, I'm guessing that's the problem.

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Allan in NE

02-17-2005 17:17:46

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Re: B414 Diesel Smokes, No Power - HELP! in reply to Dan Caldwell, 02-17-2005 17:00:36

Hi Dan,

Sure sounds like a bad pump to me.

Allan

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Dan Caldwell

02-17-2005 17:22:00

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Re: B414 Diesel Smokes, No Power - HELP! in reply to Allan in NE, 02-17-2005 17:17:46

Any idea how to confirm a bad pump? Pressure gauge in line?

Dan

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Allan in NE

02-17-2005 18:09:27

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Re: B414 Diesel Smokes, No Power - HELP! in reply to Dan Caldwell, 02-17-2005 17:22:00

Dan,

I'm not that smart; just recognize that classic ol' "bad pump" symptom. Won't pull worth a darn and smokes like the devil. :>(

Allan

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