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H engine broke in Have oil question

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JRB IN MAINE

10-11-2004 18:42:17




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Broke in My 42 H with castroil GTX 10w 30 motor oil . checked it yesterday and seams too thin . Do you think it will be ok to change to
ND 30wt now that the engine got a good cleaning pump wise .getting 45lbs preasure at gauge with 10w 30. what do you think?




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Dr.Evil

10-12-2004 08:42:33




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 Re: H engine broke in Have oil question in reply to JRB IN MAINE , 10-11-2004 18:42:17  
I hope the "ND" You typed doesn't mean non-detergent..... Why on EARTH would You want to use non-detergent oil in a freshly rebuilt engine? Yes I know what Your 62 year old Owner's Manual says..... but why wouldn't You want to take advantage of the last 60+ yrs of technological improvements in oil refining? I agree that there's nothing wrong with Castrol 10W-30....if Your getting 45 psi at hot idle.... This non-detergent oil myth needs to be stopped.... Most farmers stopped using non-detergent oil in the 1950's!

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captaink

10-12-2004 07:32:10




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 Re: H engine broke in Have oil question in reply to JRB IN MAINE , 10-11-2004 18:42:17  
My 2 cents worth. Put 10W-30 back in unless you live where you expect the temps year around to stay consistently above 50 degrees F.

To justify this, in the 1990’s car manufacturers went to recommending 5W-30 year around in the northern half of the US. I bought a 2001 van new and the recommendation is 5W-20 year around! Twenty five years ago my dad (a mechanic) told me that he had seen more engines ruined from using too heavy an oil than from using too light an oil. Seems the car manufacturers caught up with his knowledge about 25 years later!

The reason my dad gave was that almost all of the wear in an engine happens the first 15 seconds after start-up in a cold engine, or basically while waiting for oil to get to the moving parts. In colder temps, lighter oil can move in between the close tolerances of engine bearings and ring to cylinder wall areas easier and quicker than heavy oil, to lubricat those potential friction areas. To boot, 30# or better oil pressure at idle is nothing to worry about. If you live where the temps are 100+ then go with the heavy stuff. As a kicker, my uncle has an old olds with a 455 in it that has 190,000+ miles on it. The only oil he has ever put in it was 10-10W. Still doesn’t use oil and runs great!

Again, just my 2 cents worth!

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gusc

10-12-2004 21:56:40




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 Re: H engine broke in Have oil question in reply to captaink, 10-12-2004 07:32:10  
cap,

The reason auto mfg changed to 5W oil was to decrease engine resistance and increase gas mileage to help meet gov requirements.

I'm probably older than your Dad and I agree with him about lighter oils being better, especially in new engines, but I use heavier oils in older, worn engines in my warmer climate. Very cold areas are another story. I use 10W30 in winter and 10W40 in summer. My wife had a 1979 98 Olds with a 403 that we gave away at 258,000mi and I always used these weights.

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Redmud

10-11-2004 19:30:52




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 Re: H engine broke in Have oil question in reply to JRB IN MAINE , 10-11-2004 18:42:17  
JRB,
My 42 H oil pressure dropped to 40 lbs when at operation temp. it would hold 60 untill I worked it for awhile. I have always used delo 400 30 wt in all my engines year around. I changed the H to Castrol GTX 20w50 and it now idles on 50 lbs when hot. I also changed the oil in my 1954 jeep to GTX 20w50 and it also has more oil pressure now. and I really don't know why..
Redmud:



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Andy Martin

10-12-2004 05:41:03




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 Re: H engine broke in Have oil question in reply to Redmud, 10-11-2004 19:30:52  
20w50 acts like 20 wt when cold and 50 wt when hot. Why is it so hard to understand that you see a higher operating temperature oil pressure with thicher oil?

I run 20w50 in all my Farmalls.

IH recommended not running 30 wt in the winter, but that was for an inferior oil specification to today's oils. The only trouble with 30 wt in the winter is cranking speed.



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The Red

10-12-2004 12:49:12




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 Re: H engine broke in Have oil question in reply to Andy Martin, 10-12-2004 05:41:03  
Andy I will give that a try in Old Raceway M. Oil pressure drops off quite a bit after it warms up on SAE 30.



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Redmud

10-12-2004 09:33:03




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 Re: H engine broke in Have oil question in reply to Andy Martin, 10-12-2004 05:41:03  
Andy,
I don't think 20w50 means that it's 50 weight when hot, I ran a shop for years and this was a topic with lots of mechanics. we had an oil man at one time pushing his product and the subject came up, one of the things I remember was that 20w50 never dropped below 20 weight when hot and never reached 50 when hot. My answer was why use it then if it really was not what people thought, 20 when cold and 50 when hot. I never really looked into it because we didn't push oil, whatever the customer wanted was what he got. most people would use what ever their Dad used. look into it Andy.
Redmud:

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Andy Martin

10-12-2004 10:23:53




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 Re: H engine broke in Have oil question in reply to Redmud, 10-12-2004 09:33:03  
Without getting into too much detail, a 20w oil has a specified viscosity (thickness) which changes with temperature. It is described as a curve starting thick at cold temperatures and getting thinner with increasing temperature. 30w is thicker, 40w even thicker, etc. BUT hot 40w will be much less viscous (thinner) at 200 deg F than 20w is at 100 deg F. But if all three oils are at 200 deg F, 30w is thicker than 20w and is thinner than 40w.

Multiviscosity oils tend to act like the first number at low temperatures and like the second number at high temperatures. So a 20w50 does indeed act like 50w at high temperatures (operating range) but is similar to 20w at low temperatures.

For extreme duty you can stick with a single weight because after extended use a multiviscosity oil tends to break down and respond like the lower viscosity. So if you want to run 40,000 miles on conventional lubricant, stick with a single weight oil : )

I am a registered professional engineer in Oklahoma.

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Jeff_MI

10-11-2004 18:58:24




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 Re: H engine broke in Have oil question in reply to JRB IN MAINE , 10-11-2004 18:42:17  
JRB,
I have a 40 H that I plow snow with in northern Michigan. I've used it for five years with Castrol 10W 30 with no problems. The only thing I did do was change to an 8 volt battery to give it a little extra kick in the winter - it works well.



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