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Farmall & IHC Tractors Discussion Forum
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H distributor plate marks - possibly for Dave WV

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Dave in CT

07-08-2004 09:40:48




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The distributor shaft plate on my '47 gas-only H has the marks '8R' on it. This is the plate directly under the cam which is connected to the shaft that rotates. Based on an earlier post by Dave WV, I believe this means I have the wrong distributor - this distributor was for a gas start, deisel engine. Dave WV, if you're reading this, where did you find that information? Anyone else who has a gas-only distributor apart enough, or who remembers, what are the markings on your plate? Based on what Dave WV said earlier, they might be '22L' or '30L'. I don't know if these numbers represent distributor degrees or crankshaft degrees advance but I'd like to hear what folks see marked on their gas-only distributors.

Since a new shaft costs around $90 and since this distributor is very tight, I'm wondering if it's O.K. to just file out the hole in the plate that allows for max advance. Has anyone done this? I might be able to use the plate from a distributor with the appropriate advance as a template.

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kfox

07-12-2004 00:01:49




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 Re: H distributor plate marks - possibly for Dave in reply to Dave in CT, 07-08-2004 09:40:48  
I just finished cleaning up the distb. out of a 41 H this evening. I came back and re-read this post and now I'm really cornfused. My distb. has the marking on the bottom flange of AH4 695902
and the casting # is 353898R1. The shaft plate is marked 40 R. I can't find any of these numbers in my parts book or any of the other IH repair books that I have. If anyone has info on where to find this info, I would appreciate it. By the way, this H was converted to gasoline sometime in the past. Thanks in advance, Ken

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Dave in CT

07-12-2004 09:22:47




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 Re: Re: H distributor plate marks - possibly for D in reply to kfox, 07-12-2004 00:01:49  
Wayne Swenson E-mailed me some pages from the IH Service Manual _4 Cylinder Carbureted Engines, Form ISS-1039-1 April, 1972 (Supercededs Form ISS-1039). In Section 1, General, page 24 of that manual there is a chart that list specs on the Series 135B, model AH distributor - CC rotation, 0.020 Breaker Point Gap (inch), 0 Degrees of Spark Advance at 400 RPM, 20 degrees at 2400 RPM. The last figures are distributor degrees, not crankshaft degrees. Having said that, these figure may be addressed to the markings on your distributor flange. I think someone may have put in a different distributor shaft and plate. The reason I say that is the 'R' in your '40R' markings on the plate. I would have expected an 'L'. Since my plate has an '8R' on it and it's supposedly made for a gas-start, deisel run engine, those revolve in the reverse direction to the gas only, yet the chart shows your distributor as turning counter clockwise, like all the gas engines, for which I would have expected a 'L' marking. I think it's time for someone with more experience than I to contribute. Post the question, perhaps with the report of these specs, as a new question and see if you can get some more certain information. Thanks for contributing.

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Dave W V

07-08-2004 18:18:10




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 Re: H distributor plate marks - possibly for Dave in reply to Dave in CT, 07-08-2004 09:40:48  
Forgot to add not sure if your distributor is all diesel parts since they rotate in the opposite direction when bolted to engine than gas. Never put one on a gas engine to see if it would run.



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Dave in CT

07-08-2004 18:40:19




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 Re: Re: H distributor plate marks - possibly for D in reply to Dave W V, 07-08-2004 18:18:10  
Well, everything looks pretty close to the exploded view in the I&T manual but I suppose the cam could be backwards. I'm hoping to have a look this weekend at a local gas-only H's distributor. It sounds like filing or drilling out a slot to allow for 40 degrees max advance is a workable solution. The I&T manual says 20 dist degrees at 800 dist RPM so I'm doubling and that matches what the H Owner's manual says is max advance. Now if I can find a distributor shaft to make a template from, elongating the advance slot shouldn't be too hard. Thanks for all your input.

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Dave W V

07-08-2004 19:15:25




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 Re: Re: Re: H distributor plate marks - possibly f in reply to Dave in CT, 07-08-2004 18:40:19  
Getting mixed up myself,distributor I refered to marked N should of had 25L shaft for 25 degree max advance but it had been changed to a 22L.
From IH engines of your type had less max advace
installed as compression was raised.Getting to long winded,later.



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Dave in CT

07-08-2004 19:50:28




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: H distributor plate marks - possib in reply to Dave W V, 07-08-2004 19:15:25  
Distributor flange number is HC5-757925
Distributor body numbers are 353989R1 and 52
perhps the 'R1' at the end of the first body number stands for the same 'R' as the 'R8' in the distributor plate meaning 'righthand' or clockwise revolution? - Though I'm not sure what the distributor body would have to do with the direction of revolution. The I&T manual says (and observed on my tractor) CC - counterclockwise - revolution.

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Dave W V

07-08-2004 18:04:02




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 Re: H distributor plate marks - possibly for Dave in reply to Dave in CT, 07-08-2004 09:40:48  
Lot of information I'm referring to is from memory.
Working on these distributors and old literature I have picked up here and there. Also parts books.From memory on gas distributors I have seen shafts marked 22L, 25L, 40L and I think 30L, can't remember shaft marking in some gas start diesels but I do know that a H symbol distributor from the factory had a maxium of 4 degrees cranshaft advance. I find a lot of distributors have had parts changed so they don't match factory original. I just looked at a couple of distributors I have and one was from a N symbol it is marked L22 maxium advance crankshaft 24 to 25 degrees and the hole size is .275. Next one is marked 40L maxium advance crankshaft 40 degrees and hole is slotted .375 long from a A symbol distributor. I either weld holes and file or grind or just grind holes to get what I want. I have one piece of literature that may interest you for fire crater power improvement packages for Farmall H. It says when using Package 374856R91 use distributor shaft with 22 degree marking.

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Stan(VA).

07-09-2004 09:20:13




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 Re: Re: H distributor plate marks - possibly for D in reply to Dave W V, 07-08-2004 18:04:02  
Dave,
this post rang a bell, so I went back and checked and found a NOS distributor update kit I bought a while back. I had to install a new shaft once to replace one that had self destructed, (probably due to a PO installing screws too long) so I bought another kit as soon as I found it just in case. It is part# 374262R91, comes with 22L shaft, new set of weights and a pin.

It has an instruction sheet that lists this number for basically all C123's (and C113's in early Super A's), C248's and C264's. Note says use shaft with 22 degree marking, but doesn't state what that is, so I assume the '22L'.

Sheet also says 374856R91 was for all the H, 4, and Super series also with a 22 degree shaft.

It lists 374889R91 for C113's in A, B and U-2 models with a 30 degree shaft.

It lists 374897R91 for C113's in the C and U-2A's (up to a SN split) with a 25 degree shaft.

On the back of the sheet, it says that each kit comes with a shaft, two factory matched distributor governor springs and the distributor gear pin. And since there is a different part number for the kit that covers the Super H and the Super C, (although each specs the 22 degree shaft) I assume that the springs are different? I always did wonder why they recommended less max advance with the higher output motors in the Super series? Allways guessed that they were correcting a mistake in the earlier motors based on later testing. Now that I think about it, higher compression would tend to make it a more volitile mix that would burn quicker. Stan(VA).

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ChadS

07-08-2004 09:53:50




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 Re: H distributor plate marks - possibly for Dave in reply to Dave in CT, 07-08-2004 09:40:48  
I have drilled the hole out a bit larger to change the amount of advance the mechanism outputs. Usually, when you have the rotor on, you should be able to turn the rotor to activate the mechanical advance, should turn maybe 1/4 to a half inch of movement on average. Is it a vertical distirbutor, or a horizontal distibutor, delco, or IH?? I have several of both apart,, all off gas models, H and M. Another way to measure the plate is to use a set of calipers to measure the hole sizes, smaller, means less advance, larger, more advance. Maybe drill the one you have to match the one you need??? ChadS

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Dave in CT

07-08-2004 12:35:53




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 Re: Re: H distributor plate marks - possibly for D in reply to ChadS, 07-08-2004 09:53:50  
Horizontal - parallel to the crankshaft - IH distributor. Yeah, I want to widen that hole to get the extra advance. What marks do you have on your IH horizontal gas-only distributor plate? Sorry, I don't have it here right now but the part number of the distributor is listed in one of my earlier posts that talks about 'advance'. Thanks for the quick reply.



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ChadS

07-08-2004 12:42:23




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 Re: Re: Re: H distributor plate marks - possibly f in reply to Dave in CT, 07-08-2004 12:35:53  
I will have a look to see what the number is, one thing I did learn when doing this, is that when you use a drill bit, not only will you pick up advance, it also retards the engine timing more as well. I dont think that that really should be messed with, as far as that is concerned, I have used a small die grinder and slotted the hole, worked alot better that time around. 2 of my pullers have IH distributors, my super has delco, so I keep alot of them around for parts. Will post it a bit later on, Chads

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