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Farmall & IHC Tractors Discussion Forum
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ice dropplets on spark plugs?

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Chris

01-24-2004 17:02:45




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Has anyone ever heard or seen little ice dropplets on the spark plugs? I mean, this is happening inside the cylinders, and it is prevents my H from starting. I believe it is the results of the condensation I had in my gas tank. How do I get rid of it and how do I prevent it from happening again? I have replaced the gas with fresh gas and added some dry gas. I can start the tractor by heating the tractor with a space heater. 3 times I have done this, ran the tractor for over an hour each time. Then next morning it won't start again. Any ideas? Thanks to all who gives this a thought.

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Old Tractor Guy

01-26-2004 12:18:43




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 Re: ice dropplets on spark plugs? in reply to Chris, 01-24-2004 17:02:45  
Did you check to make sure there is no water in the oil bath for the air cleaner? A commonly overlooked source of water.



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Will Sick

01-24-2004 22:18:48




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 Re: ice dropplets on spark plugs? in reply to Chris, 01-24-2004 17:02:45  
Ono of the products of combustion is water.When you first start an engine when it is cold you can see the warer vapor in the exhaust. After the engine gets up to operating temp the water goes out as steam. There is quite often water still present in the cylinders after you shut the engine down. You may for some reason have a weaker spark which keeps the plugs from firing good enough to start the engine. Check the spark by holding a plug wire out from the plug when you turn it over.It should be blue and jump at least a quarter of an inch when cranking the motor.Running the engine at proper operating temp does make a difference as some have stated.

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Lee

01-24-2004 19:41:23




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 Re: ice dropplets on spark plugs? in reply to Chris, 01-24-2004 17:02:45  
What are your current conditions temp, humidity? All 4 plugs have ice crystals? If you just pull the plugs and clean them and dry them will it start without space heater? You've said this tractor has always started in the past so it seems something has changed. If the engine is not coming up to temp, you will not be getting a good manifold temperature, there can be icing just beyond the carb venturi. Just a guess. Any way you can tell if it is reaching operating temperature? Is there frost forming on the manifold just beyond the carb flange. There is also the possibility these ice crystals are not the problem. How much ice crystals? Try to clean and dry the plugs and see if it starts. Does it have a good battery, ignition in good shape, a hot spark, cranks fast, the right weight oil for cold conditions? It's possible what looks like a problem may not be. But I'm not there to see the ice crystals. If I were, maybe it would be obvious. So I'm just kicking a lot iof things around. Food for thought maybe.

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Chuck's Repair

01-24-2004 18:10:01




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 Re: ice dropplets on spark plugs? in reply to Chris, 01-24-2004 17:02:45  
It sounds like your engine may be running cold.If your coolant temperature is low check to see if your thermostat is stuck open or opening at too low of a temperature.You may want to cover up your radiator in the winter to bring the engine temperature.Most condensation problems occure just above freezing at high humidity



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Gary-Miss

01-24-2004 17:29:38




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 Re: ice dropplets on spark plugs? in reply to Chris, 01-24-2004 17:02:45  
We had that problem in the military on aircraft engines in Goose Bay, Labrador. We ended up by applying heat, not much, to the intake to warm up the incoming air. More recently, I have used heat from a lightbulb on the intake manifold of a little diesel tractor.



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CNKS

01-24-2004 18:48:52




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 Re: Re: ice dropplets on spark plugs? in reply to Gary-Miss, 01-24-2004 17:29:38  
I was stationed at Goose Bay in 1962 and 1963--have no desire to go back -- It's even colder there than where Hugh McKay lives! They trained me in Orlando, Florida before they sent me there--cruel and unusual punisment.



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moonlite

01-25-2004 03:00:46




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 Re: Re: Re: ice dropplets on spark plugs? in reply to CNKS, 01-24-2004 18:48:52  
Was in Goose Bay with Army Transportation Corps to unload ships in 1961. The shipping season was all the time I was there. The last snow fell on June 12 and the first was in early October. The summer was pretty but missed what was going on stateside. Gotta say something tractor? My buddy stole me a set of Blue Crown sparkplugs. They missed from the start and i had to throw them away. I do not believe the engine ever started and the size, reach and heat range was right.

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Chris

01-24-2004 17:45:59




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 Re: Re: ice dropplets on spark plugs? in reply to Gary-Miss, 01-24-2004 17:29:38  
Thanks for the response, gary. I have used a space heater in the past three weeks to heat the engine, and it starts up. I've had this tractor for ten years and it has always started in the dead of winter. Until 3 weeks ago! That's when I found the fuel bowl frozen. It's all cleaned out now. Is this the aftermath of condensation in my fuel tank?



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rebuilder

01-24-2004 17:55:16




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 Re: Re: Re: ice dropplets on spark plugs? in reply to Chris, 01-24-2004 17:45:59  
Chris;

Knowing now that you had water in you fuel system, did you drain the carburetor? Also may want to drain tank and put all new fuel in. Yes, if the tank sits mostly empty it will gather moisture and condensation which is why the sediment bowl is there.



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Chris

01-24-2004 18:04:31




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: ice dropplets on spark plugs? in reply to rebuilder, 01-24-2004 17:55:16  
rebiulder:
You know.... I know better than that. I kicked myself when I found that frozen fuel bowl. I usually keep a full tank during the winter. Anyhow, yes I dropped the carb bowl and cleaned it out. There was no ice in there. ( I was wondering if the venturi port could be hiding some moisture? Or some other little air hole in the carb. I just don't know enough about the carb.) I did drain the tank and clean the fuel screen; added fresh fuel and some dry gas.

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rebuilder

01-24-2004 17:20:14




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 Re: ice dropplets on spark plugs? in reply to Chris, 01-24-2004 17:02:45  
Chris;

Your sediment bowl & screen(if working properly) Should be removing all the contaminants from the fuel. This makes me wonder if you have a coolant leak, I.E. blown head gasket,cracked head/block. Check for low antifreeze and if it bubbles while the tractor is running then you do have problems.



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Chris

01-24-2004 17:30:53




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 Re: Re: ice dropplets on spark plugs? in reply to rebuilder, 01-24-2004 17:20:14  
Thanks for the thought, Rebuilder; I'll check that. Even if there were a leak, would the coolant freeze, though? My coolant looks good and the level is normal.



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rebuilder

01-24-2004 17:36:49




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 Re: Re: Re: ice dropplets on spark plugs? in reply to Chris, 01-24-2004 17:30:53  
Chris;

You are right, after I thought about it awhile. It just seemed the first thought in my head.



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GasDummy!!!

01-24-2004 19:27:06




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: ice dropplets on spark plugs? in reply to rebuilder, 01-24-2004 17:36:49  
Hey guys, the BEST way to remove water from your gas tank is to pour in some denatured alcohol. Drain the system and fill with fresh gas and add smoe DA. It will fix your problem, I've done it several times on different equipment. This is a no brainer;-) as my son would say!!!!



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Wayne Swenson

01-24-2004 21:00:31




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 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: ice dropplets on spark plugs? in reply to GasDummy!!!, 01-24-2004 19:27:06  
Why don't you fellows put ethanol blended fuel in your tractors??
I have used it for years and never have any moisture problems.
The ethanol absorbs any stray water molecules and allows them to be burned in the combustion chamber.
As an earlier posting mentioned, make sure the engine coolant is operating in the 190-210 degree range so the oil gets hot enough to evaporate the moisture out of it.
Try this: remove the oil drain plug carefully and just barely let some liquid out. Is it oil?? or is it water?? That will give you a clue if the engine is operating warm enough.

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