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Farmall & IHC Tractors Discussion Forum
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still HAVING BIG TROUBLE WITH MY IH 444 TRACTOR WA

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Rick

11-20-2003 04:48:45




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I know this is long but bear with me. I'M HAVING BIG TROUBLE WITH MY IH 444 TRACTOR WANTING TO DIE ON ME AFTER IT HEATS UP AND GETS UNDER A LOAD. IT WAS RUNNING JUST FINE AND THEN ONE DAY..... .PLAAA! I'VE REPLACED THE POINTS AND CONDENSER AND ROTOR CAP, CLEANED OUT THE CARB. NOTHING, ADDED AN INLINE FUEL FILTER, REPLACED THE COIL, THEN REGAPPED THE POINTS. BUT IT JUST KEEPS GETTING WORSE IT ALSO WANTS TO BACK FIRE WHEN I TRY TO RESTART IT BUT IT WILL NOT RESTART UNTIL IT COOLS OFF COMPLETELY. ANY SUGGESTIONS? ONE STRANGE THING IS THAT I CAN HOLD ONTO THE COIL TO DISTRIBUTOR CAP WIRE WHILE IT IS RUNNING. EVERYONE SEEMS TO THINK I SHOULDN'T BE ABLE TO DO THAT WITHOUT GETTING ZAPPED. I'VE LOOKED AT ALL THE WIRES AND CAN'T FIND ANY SHORTS OR BREAKS. I'VE ALSO RUN A WIRE STRAIGHT FROM THE BATTERY TO THE POSITIVE SIDE OF THE COIL THAT DIDN'T HELP OR CHANGE ANYTHING EITHER. I'VE CHECKED FOR MOISTURE AND CRACKS IN THE CAP. IT WILL USUALLY RUN A GOOD STEADY HOUR BEFORE IT WANTS TO DIE. I'VE BEEN MESSING WITH THIS THING FOR WEEKS AND CAN'T TROUBLE SHOOT IT. I'M PRETTY SURE THAT I HAVE GOOD FUEL PRESSURE I'VE CHECKED THAT THE NEEDLE VALVE OPENS AND CLOSES AT INSTALLED POSITION, THE NEW FUEL FILTER IS CLEAR SO I CAN SEE THAT IT MADE IT TO WITHIN 3" OF THE CARB. THE TRACTOR HAS AN ELECTRIC FUEL PUMP AND IT'S STILL PUMPING GOOD.
Follow up. 11/20/03 I have changed the coil, the points, condenser, and rotor button, I’ve tried it without the gas cap, and I’ve made sure it still has gas in the carb. after it stops running, by taking the drain plug out of the bowl. I made a new wire from the coil to the points. I’ve dried inside the cap and sprayed it with WD40, I looked at the insulator between the points and distributor itself to make sure it's not cracked. I replaced the coil wire and checked all the plug wires. The dist. cap looks fine. Twice now I’ve taken the dist. cap off and looked things over touched stuff inside and put the cap back on and it fires right up, but then it goes back to doing the same thing just when I think I’ve fixed it. When it does start it runs fine, making me think it's not gas or carb. problems, but as soon as it gets hot and I bog it down it wants to die and then will not restart, now I’m even having trouble starting it cold. The timing has never been touched since it was running fine before all this started. I’m afraid to mess with it. The exhaust is out the top. I’m lost and about to give up and hire it out to get fixed but I really hate to because I think it's got to be something simple or crazy that I could fix myself.
The strange thing I asked about before, touching the coil wire while it's running. Should that be possible without getting shocked??? Thanks for all the suggestions, but so far I can't make any of them the fix it. Still looking for that magical idea.

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Walt

11-23-2003 07:03:14




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 Re: still HAVING BIG TROUBLE WITH MY IH 444 TRACTO in reply to Rick, 11-20-2003 04:48:45  
Rick, have you adjusted the valves? Sounds like it's been a long time since the last time.



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Bluelite - Timing OK?

11-21-2003 19:21:10




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 Re: still HAVING BIG TROUBLE WITH MY IH 444 TRACTO in reply to Rick, 11-20-2003 04:48:45  



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Richard Fazio

11-21-2003 15:36:49




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 Re: still HAVING BIG TROUBLE WITH MY IH 444 TRACTO in reply to Rick, 11-20-2003 04:48:45  
Replace the coil. It's common on fords to have bad coils that stop working when hot. I don't see why it can't happen to a IH. Also you mention that it has weak looking spark when it won't start. Coils are cheap, try it. You could also check all wire connections from the battery to the coil. You want everything to be clean and tight, that is also a common cause for bad spark.



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Hermit

11-20-2003 17:27:32




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 Re: still HAVING BIG TROUBLE WITH MY IH 444 TRACTO in reply to Rick, 11-20-2003 04:48:45  
You might check for a cracked intake manifold in the areas of highest temperatures.



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grg1938 f20

11-20-2003 10:42:01




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 Re: still HAVING BIG TROUBLE WITH MY IH 444 TRACTO in reply to Rick, 11-20-2003 04:48:45  
Just a suggestion do a compression check cold then when it die, may have valves sticking or binding when they get warm. I would also go along with new sparkplugs if you have not changed them yet. Ipersonly seen them go bad and do the same thing you are talking about. My 2 cents worth. good luck.



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Joe Wood

11-20-2003 08:10:33




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 Re: still HAVING BIG TROUBLE WITH MY IH 444 TRACTO in reply to Rick, 11-20-2003 04:48:45  
Right after it dies does it have electric?

For example, can you turn any lights on? Do the startup lights come on when you try to restart after it dies?



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Rick

11-20-2003 08:44:32




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 Re: Re: still HAVING BIG TROUBLE WITH MY IH 444 TR in reply to Joe Wood, 11-20-2003 08:10:33  
I believe it still has electric after it dies, i think i was working in the dark when it died once. I have noticed that the gauges do nothing when i'm trying to restart and that when it does restart the amp/volt meter is way over on 30 for awhile but i think that is because it is recharging the battery after a long stretch of cranking. Not sure if that is always that way. I've pulled the plugs and watched them and they spark but it doesn't look like very much even when mechanically grounded. I've even cranked it with the dist. cap off and watched the points and they don't seem to spark much either (but should it). When it is running the spark is very strong, strong enough to just over to the coil posts when i pull the coil wire off. How can i tell if i have carbon plug wires? just by looking at them?

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Joe Wood

11-20-2003 08:56:16




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 Re: Re: Re: still HAVING BIG TROUBLE WITH MY IH 44 in reply to Rick, 11-20-2003 08:44:32  
Rick,

I posted this in that other forum.

You might want to try hot wiring your tractor to see if it helps.

Also, the fact that it dies once warmed up may just be a coincidence. Could really be an electrical problem.

----- ----- ----- ----- ----- --

I don't know my tractor like you do, but my IH504 was doing a similar thing and I was begninning to think I had a bad regulator or generator.

Thing kept cutting out on me once it got warmed.

Turns out that the ignition switch was getting really hot due to corroded connections. I cleaned them up with some sand paper and made sure they were clamped down tight and everything was fixed.

Do you seem to lose electric when it cuts out? For example, your dash lights won't come on until it cools down.

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MD Wa.

11-20-2003 08:00:17




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 Re: still HAVING BIG TROUBLE WITH MY IH 444 TRACTO in reply to Rick, 11-20-2003 04:48:45  
Rick. Try removeing the fuel line from strainer under tank. Also ck. strainer screen. There is also a filter where fuel line goes into carb. Hold can under line and open shutoff, you want a full steam for a 15 to 20 sec. Did you recheck timeing. ie #1 TDC. To lean a mixture can make eng. backfire. Morgan



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Gary_N_WV

11-20-2003 07:09:18




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 Re: still HAVING BIG TROUBLE WITH MY IH 444 TRACTO in reply to Rick, 11-20-2003 04:48:45  
You said you can hold the coil wire while it's running ...
Sure, you should be able to hold it without getting zapped assuming your wire is in good shape.
BUT...be careful about trying that with the new "higher tension" electronic ignitions.

I'm not sure what to suggest here other than maybe trying some new plugs.
Speaking of plugs and wires....what kinda wires to you have? Are they the ones with wire instead of carbon fiber in them?
If they are carbon fiber, toss them and get a set with actual copper wire in them.

Sounds like your problem is heat related..... ..I'd probably check the intake manifold for a good seal..... ..
I'm also thinking that in an extreme case, the head could be warping and causing leakage between 2 cylinders ..... ..


Not sure this will help any....just thought I add my $0.02..... .....

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Wayne Kittler

11-20-2003 06:04:31




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 Re: still HAVING BIG TROUBLE WITH MY IH 444 TRACTO in reply to Rick, 11-20-2003 04:48:45  
Maybe your plugs can not take the beating anymore.



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