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Farmall & IHC Tractors Discussion Forum
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140 Alternator (conv) wiring: What's wrong??

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Nawlens Gator

03-04-2007 18:56:52




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Finally mounted a Delco 10 SI on one of my 140's in place of the old generator (12 v neg grnd) and attempted the 3 wire set up per Hal. Also installed a new ignition switch (4 position--> ACC, Off, On, Start [spring]). The four connections to the key switch are labeled 1) Ignition (hooked this to the coil) 2) ACC (hooked this to the fuse then light switch) 3) Bat (hooked this to the alternator, R/1 terminal) this alternator terminal is on the left side when looking from the rear as in Hal's pic and I installed the diode in this wire with white stripe toward the alternator. 4) Start (hooked this to the magnetic relay of the starter switch).

Then I hooked the battery up and turned the switch and nothing happened. No current to the start switch when I turned the key to the crank position or 4) (spring).

I figured the battery terminal on the start switch must really mean battery after all. So I disconnected the alternator wire (with diode, from the R alt term) and connected it to the ignition position ( 1) ) on the switch along with the wire to the coil. I also jumered a wire from the battery side of the Amp Meter to the Bat terminal of the ignition switch.

No here's what's really weird. When I turned the switch to on, the starter relay kicked in and the tractor started cranking!!?? On the bench, this switch in the 'on' position had continuity between the battery switch terminal ( 3) ), ignition switch terminal ( 1) ), and ACC terminal ( 2) ). There was NO continuity to the start terminal ( 4) ) on the switch.

I am bamboozold.

Do I need a 3 position switch? What the heck is going on?

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Sam#3

03-04-2007 21:06:26




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 Re: 140 Alternator (conv) wiring: What's wrong?? in reply to Nawlens Gator, 03-04-2007 18:56:52  
I'm confused by your wiring and rewiring so let me start with a clean page. (I broke my slate fifty years ago.)
First start with the battery charge lead. Wire a lead from the alternator to the positive terminal of the ammeter. Continue from the negative of the meter to the battery terminal of your new switch. That is your battery distribution point. Run a lead from this terminal to the Positive terminal of the battery. This completes the charge lead from the alternator to the battery. Run a lead from the ignition terminal of the switch wire to the coil. This lead will supply battery to the ignition when the switch is turned ON. From the start terminal of the switch run a lead to the operate side of the starter solenoid (a small terminal not a large battery terminal.) This is will activate the starter when switch is turned to START.
The lights can be handled two ways. 1) As you have them now from the accessory terminal or 2) from the Battery terminal to the light switch. If wired to ACC term you can activate the lights without the Ignition being activated.
Hopefully this will help. I’ve attempted to do one function at a time. The charge circuit, The ignition circuit, the start circuit and the lights. Check each as you go then do the next.

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Nawlens Gator

03-04-2007 21:56:20




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 Re: 140 Alternator (conv) wiring: What's wrong?? in reply to Sam#3, 03-04-2007 21:06:26  

Pretty sure the #2 terminal (F) from the alternator is wired to the negative terminal of the ampmeter (through the terminal screw on the back of the alternator), and the pos ampmeter terminal is wired to the battery terminal of the solenoid.



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Sam#3

03-05-2007 04:30:12




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 Re: 140 Alternator (conv) wiring: What's wrong?? in reply to Nawlens Gator, 03-04-2007 21:56:20  
I think you're right. Try it and see. Swap the leads to show the correct state when you get it running.



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Sam#3

03-04-2007 21:15:35




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 Re: 140 Alternator (conv) wiring: What's wrong?? in reply to Sam#3, 03-04-2007 21:06:26  
I didn't include the feedback circuit. You can get the info off Bob M's drawing for that.



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tn terry t

03-04-2007 19:24:06




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 Re: 140 Alternator (conv) wiring: What's wrong?? in reply to Nawlens Gator, 03-04-2007 18:56:52  
you need to look here::::>Link


you>Link aint gots her right yet but getin closer



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Nawlens Gator

03-04-2007 19:51:10




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 Re: 140 Alternator (conv) wiring: What's wrong?? in reply to tn terry t, 03-04-2007 19:24:06  

That's a 3 position key switch, and I have a 4 position switch as I mentioned. My light takeoff is from the key switch ACC terminal which wires through the fuse to the light switch. I wired the key switch Bat terminal to the battery side of the ammeter, not the alternator side. Would this make any difference?



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Nat 2

03-05-2007 06:33:22




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 Re: 140 Alternator (conv) wiring: What's wrong?? in reply to Nawlens Gator, 03-04-2007 19:51:10  
Your lights will only work if you have the key in the ACC position that way.

Wire the light switch directly to the ALT side of the ammeter.



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Nawlens Gator

03-05-2007 06:49:58




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 Re: 140 Alternator (conv) wiring: What's wrong?? in reply to Nat 2, 03-05-2007 06:33:22  

Nat 2,

In the 'ACC' position, current is sent to the lights only.

In the 'On' position, current is sent to the lights AND the coil, based on continuity tests with a volt/amp/ohm meter. With my previous 3 position switch, I couldn't turn on the lights without heating up the coil. Does this make sense?



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Bob M

03-05-2007 04:43:04




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 Re: 140 Alternator (conv) wiring: What's wrong?? in reply to Nawlens Gator, 03-04-2007 19:51:10  
'Gator - Punch below for a wiring diagram that might be helpful.

If you wire the key switch BAT terminal to the battery side of the ammeter it will still work but the ammeter readings will be all messed up. Best to move the key switch feed to the other ammeter post!

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Nawlens Gator

03-05-2007 06:43:10




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 Re: 140 Alternator (conv) wiring: What's wrong?? in reply to Bob M, 03-05-2007 04:43:04  

Is it possible to substitute a diode for the warning light in the wire from alternator terminal 1 (R) to the coil side of the ignition switch? I understood you could use either since some diagrams shown on this site show a diode. Am I confused about this?



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SuperA-Tx

03-05-2007 06:46:16




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 Re: 140 Alternator (conv) wiring: What's wrong?? in reply to Nawlens Gator, 03-05-2007 06:43:10  
You can use either. I did mine last week with a diode and it worked fine.



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