I have a number of 2 cycle engines with various gas/oil mixture ratios from 16/1 to 50/1. I have been mixing according to the operators manuals, but I have all these different ratios sitting around. I've been told that I can safely use 50/1 in all these engines (16/1, 32/1, 40/1, etc.) if I use a good brand of 50/1 2 cycle oil. Does anyone wish to comment? Thanks
- Thread starter HWRC
- Start date
I have a number of 2 cycle engines with various gas/oil mixture ratios from 16/1 to 50/1. I have been mixing according to the operators manuals, but I have all these different ratios sitting around. I've been told that I can safely use 50/1 in all these engines (16/1, 32/1, 40/1, etc.) if I use a good brand of 50/1 2 cycle oil. Does anyone wish to comment? Thanks
If you search the archived posts on this subject, you can find any answer you want.........you know, everybody has one....an opinion, I mean.
Here is mine: I'm too tight to want to replace anything that I don't absolutely need to, so even if in some posters opinion 50:1 mix will be fine in my old Homelite saw which calls for 12 oz/gallon, or 10:1, I figure it has lived well on 10:1 for the last 50 years on that diet, so why experiment now. For everyone else, I say make your own decisions or bets. You do know they will even run for awhile on 100:0, don't you? :wink:
Here is mine: I'm too tight to want to replace anything that I don't absolutely need to, so even if in some posters opinion 50:1 mix will be fine in my old Homelite saw which calls for 12 oz/gallon, or 10:1, I figure it has lived well on 10:1 for the last 50 years on that diet, so why experiment now. For everyone else, I say make your own decisions or bets. You do know they will even run for awhile on 100:0, don't you? :wink:
less oil won't be your problem. your problem is the extra fuel flowing into your engine due to the absence of oil, this will make it run richer and the carb would need to be leaned to run correctly. Obviously this would be a bigger problem on different engines depending on the initial setup. rich condition on a two stroke will foul spark plugs.
I dont know about that older stuff, may wanna keep it at what they recomend. I have about 3 dozen 2cycle powered peiceses of equipment. Hand blowers, back pack blowers, hedge trimmers, 12 string trimmers 3 toro lawnmowers, ect,ect all from within the last 15 years I run all of them on 50:1 Stihl 2 cycle oil. Never any problems with them. Did have a Echo shred and vac sieze up one year, because the cooling holes got plug with oil/dirt and leaves so it over heated. I dident relize they were pluged.
One the biggest reasons for a move from high oil content ratios in 2-strokes has been manufacturing tolerances and the type of bearings used. Plain rod bearings were used in older equipment and they needed more oil than newer engines with roller and needle bearings.
While today's synthetic oils have better lubrication properties than the stuff my dad used to put in his lawn mower 50 years ago, the rods still have the same bearings of old. Other than smoke reduction I have never been able to understand why someone would risk their engine and reduce the mix ratio. Oil is cheap in comparision to fixing a broken rod.
While today's synthetic oils have better lubrication properties than the stuff my dad used to put in his lawn mower 50 years ago, the rods still have the same bearings of old. Other than smoke reduction I have never been able to understand why someone would risk their engine and reduce the mix ratio. Oil is cheap in comparision to fixing a broken rod.
MSJ from MN
Member
I've been using the Amsoil 100:1 in everything I own for years and have not had a single problem. I believe it is called Amsoil Saber but I can't remember for sure.
I know alot of people will not agree with this. I heat with wood and also cut wood for others with my Stihl saws. I burn several tanks through my ice auger each winter as well. I think it has been a good test of this oil.
By the way. I am not an Amsoil dealer or have any connection to anyone that is.
I know alot of people will not agree with this. I heat with wood and also cut wood for others with my Stihl saws. I burn several tanks through my ice auger each winter as well. I think it has been a good test of this oil.
By the way. I am not an Amsoil dealer or have any connection to anyone that is.
I agree with Jay. I use Opti2 and have around 50 pieces of 2 cycle equipment. I've beeen using this mix and an earlier version (optimol) for over a decade and probably closer to 15 years. I've had no failures and with multiple operators on each piece of equipment and there are no mistakes on which mix to use. It's cheap peace of mind to have 1 fuel mix for all 2 cycle equipment .
Russ from MN
Well-known Member
- Location
- Bemidji MN
I think I saw on here some time ago that manufacturers went to 50-1 to reduce pollution, that 40-1 is probably a better average for all engines. Just make sure that you are using oil for an air cooled engine in them and not outboard oil, as there is a big difference in operating temperatures!
greenbeanman in Kansas
Well-known Member
I took a small engine rebuilding class a number of years ago. We were taught that if you run too much oil it in the mix it will tend to carbon up the engine, often leading to failure when a piece of it breaks loose and scars the cylinder wall.
A real pain, but I follow mfg recommendations, but then again I only have a couple of 2 cycle engines.
A real pain, but I follow mfg recommendations, but then again I only have a couple of 2 cycle engines.
I have a bunch of 2 strokes here, all different brands and I buy the Stihl little 50-1 bottles, for 1 gallon mix batches, of Stihl 2-cycle oil. I use it in all my 2 strokes and It has been working for me a long time no problem. Most of the time all the other small engine parts fall off or break before I lose a piston, cylinder wall or rod bearing. Paul
I guess luckily all our equipment is 32:1 or 50:1. I just keep both kinds on hand for 50+ pieces of equipment. I color code the fuel caps to the color of the fuel can for no discrepancies. I then leave all the straight fuel mowers with the black caps and color code those cans with a black stripe. Yes, I know, sounds a little silly, but after a couple of "problems", this fixed it. Don't ask what the problems were, I don't like to talk about it!
landlord7012
Member
Amsoil/synthetic 2-stroke oil does not appeal to me therefore I choose not to use it. What does appeal to me is taking the best care of my equipment as I can and using the recommended type of oil and mixing ratio. This means keeping a few diffent mixing cans handy which I am o.k. with. I mark the pouring spout clearly.
Good mixing,
Bill
Good mixing,
Bill
Phil in Pa
Member
My Stihl chain saws, weed trimmer, and 77 Panther all get from the same jug. For quite a few years.
No problems. I run about 40:1
No problems. I run about 40:1
lots of synthetics out there.. my favorite is "all-n-1" mix.. sold at most lawnmower shops.. you buy it in a little plastic tube, cut the end off, dump it into a one gal container with gas and you have a bright green mix that is good for all 2 strokes... so the wife and kid dont have to worry about the weed eater vrs the chainsaws vrs the hedgetrimmers..
but they still will poor it in the lawn mowers!!!!
dang you cant teach em...
but they still will poor it in the lawn mowers!!!!
dang you cant teach em...
MarkB_MI
Well-known Member
- Location
- Motown USA
Just curious, but what sort of equipment uses a 16:1 mix, and how old is it? Outboard motors have been 50:1 or higher for over forty years.
As said earlier, this subject has been beat to death many times here with no resolution. Personally, I use Opti2 mixed with premium gas in all my power equipment. I just mix it according to what it says on the bottle; I have no idea what the ratio works out to be. Of course, my equipment--two Stihl saws and a Stihl brushcutter--is relatively modern. My oldest saw is a mere sixteen years old. If you've got a 50 year-old saw, you might want to stick with a rich mix.
It's important that you don't use TC-W rated oils (typically TC-W3 these days) in your air-cooled power equipment. TC-W oil is specifically made for water-cooled outboard motors. Stick with oil that carries the JASO FD or ISO-L-EGD rating. These are the most stringent ratings for air-cooled oils. FD and EGD are the same spec from different standards agencies.
As said earlier, this subject has been beat to death many times here with no resolution. Personally, I use Opti2 mixed with premium gas in all my power equipment. I just mix it according to what it says on the bottle; I have no idea what the ratio works out to be. Of course, my equipment--two Stihl saws and a Stihl brushcutter--is relatively modern. My oldest saw is a mere sixteen years old. If you've got a 50 year-old saw, you might want to stick with a rich mix.
It's important that you don't use TC-W rated oils (typically TC-W3 these days) in your air-cooled power equipment. TC-W oil is specifically made for water-cooled outboard motors. Stick with oil that carries the JASO FD or ISO-L-EGD rating. These are the most stringent ratings for air-cooled oils. FD and EGD are the same spec from different standards agencies.
Rod in Forfar
Member
No, you can't. My nephew used 50:1 from his grandfather's Husqvarna in my McCullough Pro-Mac 85 and the engine blew up right away. It takes 28:1 or else. The new powerhead cost as much as the saw did originally. Terrible saw, but I need the 30" bar for big elms when they die.
I should have added, use what the machine calls for and only that. I smoked a perfectly good 1951 Johnson 10 hp by using MODERN 2 cycle oil in one tank. It blew the bronze bushings right out of the pistons and then the pistons hit the cyl head. Had to row the boat back 3 miles against a stiff 20+ mph headwind in 35 deg temp. not fun! The modern 2 cycle oil is 10 wt at best. The bronze couldn't take it. Here is another factor, some 2 cycle oils are for water cooled engines and some are for air cooled engines!
How much will it cost you to replace any of these items if you run a different mix/brand than what is recommended? I have a 460 Stihl and I won't chance running anything but Stihl oil at the proper ratio and I'm the only one who mixes the fuel because I do NOT want to replace that $850 saw.
What I find interesting about this whole subject is the math. Why do mfrs specify fuel ratios at certain values? Why 50:1 and not 48.5:1?
If you calculate it, the difference in a 50:1 and 40:1 ratio in a gallon of gas (which is how most of us pre-mix our 2-cycle fuel) is .64 oz, or just under half a jigger of oil. Getting the correct ratio also assumes that you have EXACTLY 128 oz of gas in that container. (It might be 120 oz or 140 oz. unless the can was completely empty (dry) when you filled it at a gas station and put EXACTLY 1.0 gals in it.)
What I'm saying is that I doubt most of the people who use 2-cycle equipment can positively state that they are mixing fuel/oil to the exact ratio spec'ed by the mfr. The newer 2-cycle oil bottles that you squeeze to get the right amount in the top section DO make it easier to measure the oil. but how much sticks to the side when you pour it out? If you're doing it in the winter, I'm sure more than when you're doing it in the summer.
I would also bet that any 2-cycle engine mfr whose chief engineer says he wants a 48.215 fuel/oil ratio will be overruled and be told to use 50:1 in the owners manual.
That being said, I have different 1 gal containers with the fuel/oil ratio written on the side for my 50:1 and 40:1 equipment. But, if one container ran out I would not hesitate to use the other one to get me by to finish a job.
If you calculate it, the difference in a 50:1 and 40:1 ratio in a gallon of gas (which is how most of us pre-mix our 2-cycle fuel) is .64 oz, or just under half a jigger of oil. Getting the correct ratio also assumes that you have EXACTLY 128 oz of gas in that container. (It might be 120 oz or 140 oz. unless the can was completely empty (dry) when you filled it at a gas station and put EXACTLY 1.0 gals in it.)
What I'm saying is that I doubt most of the people who use 2-cycle equipment can positively state that they are mixing fuel/oil to the exact ratio spec'ed by the mfr. The newer 2-cycle oil bottles that you squeeze to get the right amount in the top section DO make it easier to measure the oil. but how much sticks to the side when you pour it out? If you're doing it in the winter, I'm sure more than when you're doing it in the summer.
I would also bet that any 2-cycle engine mfr whose chief engineer says he wants a 48.215 fuel/oil ratio will be overruled and be told to use 50:1 in the owners manual.
That being said, I have different 1 gal containers with the fuel/oil ratio written on the side for my 50:1 and 40:1 equipment. But, if one container ran out I would not hesitate to use the other one to get me by to finish a job.
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