Carbon Arc gouging rod?

Rick Kr

Well-known Member
Just got a bunch of "junk" from neighbors cleaning out their parents garage.
Pulleys, electric motors, tire spoons, drills, and on an on. One mans junk is anothers treasure.

They were going to throw everything in a dumpster. I got a lot of welding rod. Had to dig out the old NEMA/AWS color charts to ID some of it.

Anyway I found what I think is Carbon Arc rod. I have never done carbon arc or seen the rod.

It looks like a carbon center with a copper coating, maybe 5/16" in diameter. Broke one piece, its somewhat brittle. All the rods look to have been used and are pointed/burned on one end, but no marks on the other end (doesn"t look like it had been clamped.

I google it, but all I come up with is Air Carbon Arc, and it shows a little different setup for air, similar to a plasma torch.

Any one have any idea what I have.

Thanks,
Rick
 
Hi Rick,

Check the archives of the Tool Forum as I written several articles on how to weld and cut with carbon arc.

T_Bone
 
Rick,

Carbon Arc rods are used to remove welds and to back gouge into welded seams to make them 100 percent welded for x-ray testing. You can also use a gouger (this is what holds the gouging rods)to remove material from steel or to remove bolt heads, etc.The air arc gouger needs a good DC welder with lots of amps,and a good supply of compressed air.If the rods have been wet toss them.
 
Those sound like the old 35MM movie projector lamp carbons. I ran one of those projectors back in the 1940's. They were also used in serchlights during WW11 and as Navy signal light lamps.
 
Air arc rods. Used for cutting out welds and will make a lot of hot metal fly around your shop. Be very careful of starting the place on fire if you start to use the air arc. Also use ear protection, it is very loud.

Frank
 
We had a carbon arc torch for heating. Plugged into the welder. Used two carbons. When you ran current through the two, and brought them together you create a pretty good heat source.

Used this before we got a cutting torch.

Gene
 
from wikianswer
Carbon arc is an old welding method which uses relatively low voltage, high amperage electricity to heat metal when an arc is established between a carbon electrode and the work (single-carbon arc) or between two such electrodes (twin-carbon arc). The single-carbon and twin-carbon processes have gone out of fashion, at least in the United States, other processes having replaced them. Few welders today have experience with carbon arc's use in welding, brazing, or heating, although the process retains its utility for those who acquire the particular skills involved.

Carbon arc welding is often confused with the widely-used arc-air gouging process, which is used for metal removal rather than metal joining. Arc-air employs a single carbon in a special handpiece that is supplied with electrical power and compressed air, and is used for removing flawed welds, gouging out cracks for welding, beveling the edges of plates, and other spot-removal problems. An arc is struck between the carbon and the metal to be removed; when the metal reaches a liquid state, the operator triggers a jet of compressed air which blows out the liquid metal. It should be noted that this action differs in principle from gouging, beveling, and cutting of steel as done by oxygen/acetylene and oxygen/propane torches. In that process, the steel is heated with a flame, but not to the liquid state; instead an oxygen jet is triggered which makes an exothermic reaction with free ferrite in the steel, liquifying it and blowing it out of the base metal.

Single-carbon arc welding, brazing, and heating utilizes a direct-current (DC) power source, usually connected with the electrode negative ("straight polarity"). The process was thought to have particular merit in welding galvanized sheetmetal, having a relatively concentrated heat which minimized distortion of the metal. The single-carbon handpiece was designed to withstand considerably higher electrode temperatures than do common arc welding handpieces designed for coated "stick" welding electrodes, and some industrial versions were water-cooled. A significant problem with single-carbon welding was the likelihood of the weld puddle being contaminated by bits of carbon from the electrode. Carbon contamination is much less likely with twin-carbon arc.

Twin-carbon arc handpieces are unlike any other welding handpieces (often loosely referred to as "torches"). These have two arms which affix the twin electrodes, or carbons, at a range of angles to each other, and which are manipulated by the operator to vary the distance between the tips of the electrodes, or "gap," this usually being done while the work is in progress. Welding electricity usually and preferably is from an alternating-current (AC) power source. Holding the handpiece, the operator manipulates the moving arms to touch the electrode tips together momentarily to initiate current flow, then moves them apart to achieve the desired gap. The resultant electric arc across the gap serves as a heat source to bring the workpiece to a temperature at which welding or brazing filler rod can be added.

The electrodes for either carbon arc process were made of baked carbon or pure graphite in a tubular copper jacket. The electrodes, often called "carbons," are not intended to be consumed as a part of the process, although they gradually erode and must be replaced. Welding carbons were commonly 6" long and ranged in diameter from 3/16" to 1/2". The arc temperature was in the area of 5000C/9000F degrees, emitting an extremely bright light which in earlier times found use in street and stage lighting, in searchlights and lighthouses, and a little later in photo-engraving and movie theater projection equipment. The brightness of this arc calls for the protection of a welding helmet with a minimum darkness rating of #12, with #14 recommended, and protective clothing is essential to protect the skin from the intense ultra-violet radiation of the arc. Carbon electrodes for arc-air gouging are readily available, and those for old theater projectors are still manufactured, but the current availability of new welding carbons is unclear.

Both the single and twin-carbon arc processes were first patented in Europe and the United States at the end of the 19th century, and achieved widespread use in the first three decades of the 20th century. Advances in the shielded metal arc welding process (abbreviated SMAW and often referred to as "stick" welding) during the second world war, particularly to the coating materials on the consumable electrodes, made it a superior process for nearly every application. SMAW quickly became popularly synonymous with arc welding and remained so for many years, and completely replaced carbon arc. Today, in the United States, the UK, And Australia, carbon arc joining as an industrial process exists only in a very few highly specialized and automated applications.

The special handpieces for carbon arc welding appear to have gone out of production, at least in the United States. The few current users of such equipment tend to employ the carbon arc most often for heating metal for bending and forming, sometimes for brazing, and often for heating purposes such as thawing frozen water pipes. It could also be used for melting lead and babbit, and even the hard-surfacing of digging and earthmoving equipment, using a special hardfacing paste. The twin-carbon arc torch in particular was often offered as an accessory with small AC transformer welders sold to amateur welders and farmers, serving some of the same purposes as an oxy-acetylene gas welding outfit which would have cost these occasional users hundreds of dollars more.
 
Offandgone is right! I call them gouge rods. You can remove a lot of metal in a hurry with them. They are not just for welds though. You have to use compressed air to blow away the molten metal the gouge rods create. They are loud and they are also very hard on a welding machine due to the high amps you must run. It is best to gouge with a generator style welding machine.
 
Yep they're carbon arc rods alright. They work great if you have a welder big enough to carry the amperage and an air compressor big enough to supply the air.
 
Bill, That was a great history lesson!
Back in the 50s my Dad bought a Forney welder and it came with the "Carbon Arc Torch" which he used a lot since he didn't have acetylene torches.
I still have the welder and the "torch" and I have since picked up another "torch". I rarely use this piece of equipment but it will put out some serious heat.
You mention the use of the carbon rods in movie projectors; I picked up a whole box of these rods a few years ago from a theater that discontinued use of those type projectors. They do work fine in my "torch".
 
I first used carbon arc rods that were discarded, but had been intended for search-light purposes. These were 8" in length and and 1/2" in dia. They worked beautifully, even at 40 amps in the Lincoln AC welder. When I went to replenish the supply, I had the option of either AC or DC rods. The DC were 20+ $ per box---The AC were $100 per box. I could accept that, but the rub was that they functioned in a really crappy way---No steady flame--Needing to adjust the rod distance every couple seconds, and the flame went many directions. Someone care to comment on what was going on? I'd love to hear your comments--------
I might add that the new AC rods were 3/8ths" by 12" in length and copper coated.
 
From the Tool forum Archives:

Carbon arc is where you use DCEN for the copper clad carbon electrode. You peal back the cooper, then sharpen the carbon to a fine point then snap off the point with your thumb. You then use a silicon bronze filler rod on the metal, stick the carbon electrode on top of the filler rod until the carbon becomes cheery red, then slightly lift the carbon from filler rod and begin welding. This welding process works well for seal welding SM. About 33kpsi tensil strength.

The carbon arc process uses a piece of copper clad carbon rod in a standard SMAW electrode holder using DCEN or straight polarity.

The CU clad carbon electrode is prepared buy pealing away about 3/4" of the copper jacket then you sharpen the carbon on a bench grinder to a fine point then snap off the point "tip" of the carbon then the electrode is "stuck" on top of the filler rod then as the carbon just turns a dull red it's slightly lifted off the filler rod and the weld process begins.

Another good use of carbon arc is to soften case harden steel for drilling holes. The carbon is again stuck on the place to be drilled and after the correct heat soak time, the machine (6v battery) is disconnected from the carbon "then" the carbon electrode is removed. The hole then can be drilled very easy with any common HS drill bit as the base metal has become soft.

Here's a tip I used for making great looking welds. Clean the CU back about 3/4", sharpen the carbon to a fine point from the CU to the end, then snap off the point with your thumb, just the tip, then lay your filler rod where you want the weld then stick the carbon on top of the rod, then wait until the carbon turns red, then lift the carbon slightly until the filler rod starts to flow. Let the puddle flow to the width wanted, then move forward.

The key to a even puddle look is to keep the carbon the same distance above the filler rod. It won't make a perfect straight edge weld but close as the toe of the weld will be alittle wobbled.

As Buck stated, watch your duty cycle as it takes alot of dead short amps to start the weld process and it can ruin 20% duty cycle machine easy.

T_Bone
 
Oh, and another thing I forgot.......using the carbon stick holder, clamp a stuck nut between the two carbons and it"ll turn bright red and turn right off. That was pretty slick to watch.
 
I enjoyed what you wrote. Years ago I worked for a small town newspaper. They used old technology to make offset plates on site and the paper was printed elsewhere. The setup they had used a "copy camera" that used two large carbon arc lights as a light source. The exposures needed were a couple of minutes. In that room, the brightness was incredible and the whole building heated up very quickly. Not bad in the Winter, but awful in the Summer.

The electrodes were at least 1/2" in diameter and I think they were about a foot long when new. About every other exposure, the electrodes had to be adjusted so they were the right distance apart as they were consumed. They also smoked and sometimes popped out sparks. Probably not the safest job I ever had!

I have read about carbon arc torches in welding books I have read, but never have come across a torch for sale. I asked at a welding supply shop, but they didn't know what I was talking about. I will keep looking. Interesting post!
 

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