O/T-Used some legal labor this week...

So, we got a federal contract at work where all of my laborers (16) had to prove their legal work status. I admit, my usual crews provide a SS# and a W-4. We withhold taxes and SS that they will never collect. They are latin. To eliminate any problems with this contract, I hired some local, 100% legal guys (blacks and whites 18-30 in age). What a sorry, mouthy, stupid, no respect for authority, lazy, worthless, unmanagable group of men (males I should say)I have ever seen in my life!! I kept my Taurus .40 in my belt the whole week (I didn't want to get caught out in the swamp by these 16 punks all toting machetes without something) What is wrong with people? The federal government says I have to pay these idiots $12.oo per hour per this contract. In this economy, you'd think people would want to work. Me and the other 3 supervisors literally had to stay on top of these guys constantly. With our normal Mexican fellas, we would have gotten ten times the work done last week, without all the bulls&*t. This is why these guys (mexicans) find so much work in the US. I don't hire them to save money, I pay them $10 - $12 an hour. I hire them because they work. Sorry for the rant. Right or wrong on my part, todays youth, or at least the ones I've tried to work, have a major problem with work ethic. Looking forward to working the derelect crew again next week..

JBM

I know what you mean. I am a plumber and you can not find help worth a darn, but those guys from down south that I had with me on a new prison construction job, They put out 10 time the amount, quality, work along as was willing to work and we gladly paid them what we would have paid any worker and I became very close with the whole crew. They would do anything for me and I would do the same for them.

Yeah, It scares me cause these people are my generation(I am 28). If they wont work now when they are young, feel good, and have energy, you think they are gunna work hard when they are 50-60. I think we are gunna be in a world of hurt when the old farmers that are in their 60's now leave the work force...

If I have heard this story once I have heard it 20 times. Everyone says the guys south of the border are the best workers by far. It really is a sad story.
Brad

My generation too. I'm 33. I guess we were just raised differently than some of these kids.

John

Be careful those are all voters and potential future presidents of the US you are bad mouthing. Thats why we're so screw&d

JBMAC, All of us employer's are having the same problem. Sad, Very Sad. We are two & three times the age of the younger generation, yet we work circles around them. They are just as you describe. Don't get me going on this subject.

I am 31. If I did not raise tobacco I would wander why they talk about the entitlemetn generation.

Sad the way the things are getting quick!

I could wright a book on the local tobacco labor I have gone trough the last 10 years. If I ever raise more I will have to learn Spanish like most of the growers around here have done.

Dave

It's not the age or the color. It's how they were raised. My oldest son is 30 and the youngest 21. They were both raised when we still put up square bales.

They helped my dad and I a lot. Being raised around an old farmer who went through WWII taught these boys a thing or two.

The oldest works full time for Deere, just bought a row crop farm and is putting the crops in himself, two year old and another on the way, and is a year into his MBA studies.

Youngest is in the Navy.

Not bragging but I am proud of both of them. I dont take all the credit. Being around my dad helped them greatly.

Gene

Yea its a b*tch when you have to treat the help like humans instead of like slaves which you can do with illegals that can't complain to anyone.

Believe it is the same everywhere. Piedmont NC. Was out riding yesterday and in the northern end of our county, farming is still very active. Southern end is now a bedroom for local large town in another county. If it wasn't for the latino the farming wouldn't get done. Also most of the landscapers/construction in the southern end is latino. Younger people don't want to work in the heat/hard work now.

If you don't treat illegals right they won't complain, they just leave out in the middle of the night. I know of several tobacco farmers who have had this happen. Get a little mean with the guys one afternoon, leave'n four or five acres of baccer on the ground. Get up the next morning can't find a one of'm.

Legal and illegal, you should treat them all the same.

Dave

I think that a different situation happened with you.
Like, These (males) didnt know you, they were punks that dont give a rip about you, the work or the money they were paid. (If I got paid $12/hour to work then I would work for it and keep my mouth shut) Blacks are super lazy----that is true with about 90% of them, so no big shock there--to be expected. The only way to get blacks to move quickly is to throw them a basketball.
The white guys can be major A$$holes to deal with.

It has been my experience that to a get a days work out of some punk white guys you have to know them, or there parents, tell them it will be cash at the end of the day, subs and or pizza at lunch.

I also have seen that in manual labor if the homeowner (or business owner) is right there working the laborers put more effort into it.

I know your frustrations, in the past few years my neighbor and I have hired White/black/Mexican guys all in there 20's to do tree work, just chipping up branches on our wooded lots.
The white guys are on their cell phones too much, the black guys only work with one arm because the other hand is used to hold their pants up and the mexican(s) actually work, but they have to have a smoke every hour so you only get 50 minutes out of every hour with one of these.

I WILL be making my son do some hard work when he gets to be a teenager, he is 8 now. My land is only 1/2 cleaned up (I own heavily wooded land) all hardwoods, branches all over on the back half, dead trees to drop.

You raised them right. You should be proud.

in my mind you're a criminal for hiring illegals. I realize you won;t like that, but that's the truth. As for the sorry bunch of "Americans" you hired, what do you expect from a nation where 99% of the people have had everything handed to them.

BTW- Did you try firing any of them as an example of what happens to the lazy, mouthy ones?

If your son is 8 he is old enough now if you wait till he is a teenager it will be too late

Bret4207
Be careful calling him a criminal.
A year or so ago a city just south of Dallas past an ordinance that required any one renting out housing must have the renter to should that they are legal in this country. A judge said that was unconstitutional and they can't do that. He said only the federal government can decide if a person is legally here.
By that, JBMac or anyone else can't decide if a person it here legal. They gave him SS# and other info. What else is he to do?

how is he a criminal?
he says in his post they supply SS# and a w-4

Bret you may think he is wrong for hiring Mexicans,I don't. He needs workers not people that lay around all day. Fire them and they will just go back on welfare. I used to do start ups on generator installations. I had one company that was all Mexican workers. If I knew they were on the job,I had nothing to worry about. They got things done. The other companies I had to work with were a joke. Had to check on them all the time. I drove three hundred miles on one job for a midnight test and change over.Found out on site that the electrical contractor was two days behind on the job.Got some Mexican workers from the site and had the genset wired up in five hours. I showed them what I needed and they did the rest. I fired the contractor. Most American workers are lazy and just looking for a check while doing as little work as possible.

I know that town. In fact there are two of them that did that. Ran all the Mexicans out of town. Now they have a lot of empty apartments and both towns are now hurting from loss of taxes.Starting to cut back on city workers. We also have a chicken plant in west Texas that INS raided. Pack up all the Mexican workers.Last I heard the plant is still shut down can't get workers. Pay is not an issue.

When I read all these responses it makes it even clearer that we need some sort of viable guest worker program and a quicker and cheaper H1b Visa process. Of course businesses (and there customers) would hate that because prices would go up a bit as the workers became legal. The reason we have the system we have is because most of us want it that way. Arresting illegal workers for working is like arresting race horses for gambeling. If you want it to stop you are going to have to put the employeers in jail and that is not going to happen.

He stated he hires people he knows are illegal. That's furthering a crime. If everyone started boycotting the hiring of illegals then they'd go home, wouldn't they? No work, no reason to stay- except for the free health care, food, housing, etc.

Looking the other way is no different to me than anything else- look the other way when the guy is selling drugs, stalking kids, beating his wife. Apapthy is killing this nation.

They can get here legally is they want. Hiring illegals is WRONG! Trying to justify it is like saying Hitler meant well.

They Are REAL Workers !For got Those LAZY AMERICANS If You NEED to GET Any thing Done! IF YOU THINK ITS A JOKE JUST LOOK AT THE AMERICAN AUTO Industry,Its Full Of Lazy Americans.I wish there Were more of Them Here To Show up thse PEOPLE WITH UNIMPLOYMENT $$$$$$$ EVERY WEEK,Who Do there Best to Do NOTHING.JUST LOOK AROUND THEY ARE EVERY WHERE .These GUYS ARE FOR REAL THEY GET THE JOBS DONE .And Dont Live On BEER and all so Watch TV DAY AND NIGHT .

Thanks guru.

Gene

I dont know where you got these people but if they wont work,fire them.Ive seen Latins that were worthless too.It depends on where you are,in a big city most help is bad.In the country its usually better,the south is better than the north.People dont like being treated like slaves no matter who or where they are.There are lots of hard working white and black people in America.You arent going to get them to help you because they already have a job.The people that dont have a job are mouthy and worthless,and thats why you found some to help you.Since things are so bad right now you might be able to find a few good workers,but most of the time the bottom of the barrel is all there is.That would also be where the illegal workers are,the bottom of the barrel,hard,dangerous,work,usually low pay,and thats why all you usually can find is mouthy worthless people or illegals to do it.Go to any big city and load up a bunch of illegals and you have nearly the same thing,you want to keep that gun,and they are not going to do much work.One thing I have noticed is that a few with a bad attitude mess up the whole bunch.Doesnt make any difference what color they are.Do illegals do better,maybe.Should you hire them,no.After they have been here a while they get just as bad as the others if not worse.For every good one working there is probably 4 worthless ones here in the hospital or on welfare or something.How is this helping?Some places I have seen around packing plants in Texas have ruined the whole town with illegals.I hope lots of Mexicans come and learn English and become citizens.The way you put it,with the super Latin workers is not the reality of what they are.They are probably way better off than in Mexico,but they are a big drain on the community where they live.You are going to fix that if you want them up here working.Yeah and its not hard to figure out why you would like a bunch of people like them to work for you.They are like in a trap and have to work hard to pay their way into America by some crook that has somebody hostage in their family.If somebody had your sister or mom or dad in Mexico,threatening to kill them if you didnt keep paying,you would work hard too.Plus lots of other ways they could hold it over you.All of us would be better off if you hire those mouthy guys and keep firing them until you get some good ones.

It's a generational thing, kids today on average don't work like we had to as kids. We didn't have computers. The hardest work some can or get to do is pick up the spatula to flip burgers. We didn't work as hard as our fathers. Our fathers didn't work as hard as our grandfathers. Life just got easier when they got indoor plumbing, cars, tractors, etc.

Don't give up on the kids yet. There are still some willing to do hard work. You just have to adapt and change the way you train them and work them. Going from flippin burgers to digging ditches or loading grain sacks or hacking weeds all day with a machete all day doesn't happen overnight. There is an adjustment period. Just have to work with them and supervise them. We didn't have OSHA around when I was a kid either. The adjustment period applies to both the boss and the worker. It's a teaching, learning, and adjustment experience for both of you. People have bellyached about work forever so you learn to deal with it. You also have to learn to deal with the dopers and alkies cause they are all over the work force. Once you learn to manage their behavior, they will work and respect you for making them work. Except the ones that just can't handle physical labor and quit. Good luck.