Allis Pull Start Attempt

tried her again today, and nothing much happened.

-Nice hot bluish white spark on all 4s
-It is in 3rd gear, thats as high as it goes
-If i put any more gas in the cylenders it'll probablly explode
-No, i dont know how the choke works (pics to come)
-There were sevral instinces where there was white smoke poofing out the exhaust
-There were a couple pops and some smoke or steam coming from the left side of the engine
-Water pump spins like new but leaks like no other

It just diddnt do anything too exciting. Shes got compression spark and fuel but something isnt right. Any advice????
Pull Start Attempt
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/8ig8rNnLj0g&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/8ig8rNnLj0g&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

Make sure your distributer is in the #1 position when the #1 cyl. is at top dead center,and then make sour the firing order is right on the dist cap.It sounds like its not firing on the correct cyl. Just my 2 cents.

Lanse

Can"t arue with Mike on his suggestions.

Will add a couple of my own.

It sure sounds to me like your fan is hitting the rad. without the sheetmetal some tractors the radiater has nothing to hold it from leaning back and hittting the fan. also it might be that your bad pump could be causing this.

As to ignition first make sure your order is right. beyond that make a round and then try adjusting the timing of the mag. could be that it is either late or early. if it is very late you will have a hard time starting. Also you may be flooding the cylinders. It isn"t the best thing for mags to run with the impulse clicking all the time. Impulse is just for starting.

One other thing did you replace the pilot and throwout bearings on the clutch. One of those could be your grinding noise.

good luck

HTH
jt

I did not replace any of the stupid things. Its splittin time :-(

Allright. Its an H4 mag, how would i adjust the timing on it??

Im positive i got the right wires to the right places.

Good thing ive still got the pump off the parts tractor.

Yep, i'll check it once more.

This is starting to get really old :-(

Anyone know of a car engine that'll bolt up here??? (sorry)


Another thing, what about the carb??? How do i tell if its set right??? Its off my C, but the tractor ran fine with it. My tractor, on the other hand, wont.

And the mag, i think we set it to fire at 30 degrees, not TDC. Was it supposed to be TDC??

Has the engine been apart since it last ran?

sounds like the timing's late, doesn't it john?jim

Yes

I'll second that

OK, how would i set the timing fowards??

Lanse---I have rebuilt 20- 25 Allis B's and C's. Your timing is off. The Allis C carb you put on will work on the Allis B.
Your mag should NOT be zet to fire at 30 BTDC. If you set the mag to fire at TDC, this is where it will fire when starting the engine. As soon as it fires, it automatically advances to 30 degrees BTDC.
I actually set my hand crank B's to 8 degrees BTDC with a dial indicator, and the head off. If I was closer to you, I would love to come help. But I'm in NY. I've sat on many tractors being pulled--be patient and persistent.
DC
Retired Ag Teacher and tractor enthusiast

Awesome thank you!!

Wow, BIG time enthusiast!! I can only imagine how many deeres and olivers you got

Allright. How would i set the mag right??

I agree with the others, the timing is not right. Sounds like the gas is there since you have some smoke coming out of the stack. Make sure your timing isn't off 180 degrees.

I am agreeing that the motor sounded really late but it is hard to tell in the video.(This turned out long.)

You seem to have an impulse coupling so let's use it. I am just guessing here but I suspect you are not finding top dead center (TDC). If you don't have a timing pointer (and even if you do) you need a piston stop. A good one is a gutted spark plug threaded for a bolt or a piece of all thread. On fairly horizontal plugs this might not work as good.

In any case you put the stop in so that when you carefully roll the motor over, it contacts the stop reasonably high in the cylinder. Mark the front pulley or flywheel (flywheel tougher) at the pointer. Now carefully roll the motor over in the opposite direction until it stops again. Mark it again at the pointer.

TDC is EXACTLY halfway between the two marks. This is why you want he piston to contact fairly high so the marks are not way far apart.

Now when you roll the motor in the direction of rotation the impulse should snap just as your TDC mark passes the pointer.

I just pulled a mag like that on an M and it is driven by two drive dogs in the back of a gear. I think your mag is driven the same. If your motor is as late as it sounds you cannot twist the mag far enough to bring it into time. That would mean you need to move the gear. On this M the drive dogs are roughly horizontal. But I suppose yours could be different.

I assume you have everything else right. If you have fairly proper fuel, compression and spark at the right time it should fire in the first few revolutions.

I have seen a vertex mag that seemed to have good spark when you turned it but motor would NOT run right until the mag went to a shop which I assume included recharging the magnets. I don't know much about that. I am just saying the mag could be weak (after all these years).

RT

I've seen cams installed out of time.
Sometimes the valve lash is found to to be too tight causes problems.
Tired valve springs and tight guides will also cause similar problems.

Lanse,

<<<<<-It is in 3rd gear, thats as high as it goes>>>>

You need to be in a lower gear to get the engine turning faster.

Or the tow needs to be a good bit faster.

Timing? All my tractors are hand crank, so I initially time them as follows: remove #1 plug; turn engine until screwdriver on piston crown indicates piston just past TDC; adjust mag for points just opening (impulse needs to be tripped for this); check timing by turning engine slowly until impulse trips; that should just be the right side of TDC to prevent kick back.

Your timing may be wildly off in one direction; if it was 180 out or the plugs wired for wrong rotation, it should fire, back-fire and all sorts.

Hope the oil pressure is OK while towing? The carb base settings can be wildy off, so check your plugs for wetness after trying to start and adjust as necessary, a bit at a time. If plugs are dry it will probably never start! You need that choke working to be able to richen the mixture for a second or two at a time.

Other tricks are to fill with hot water (fix that leak!) and heat the plugs on a gas ring to get them real hot before popping them in (watch out for burned fingers), and try starting straight away.

Basically you need the air flow high enough to run on the main jet (not the idle jet) and that means quite a few rpm while towing - you were not achieving that in your video. Once running at good revs you can try to balance the slow running side (get it hot first). You will then know it will at least start.

Regards, RAB

You need to pull No1 plug near the radiator and bring that piston to TDC on the compression stroke. Then look at your rotor to see where its pointing. It should at your No1 plug wire and both valves on No1 cylinder should be closed. If the rotor is off you will need to pull the mag and turn the rotor so it is aligned with No1. Your rotor probably rotates counter clockwise so your plug wires need to be in this firing order on the cap and connected to the corrsponding sparkplugs. Hal

1-3 CCW
2-4

I disagree with putting the tractor in a lower gear for starting. It should start by hand cranking, and it is tough to find a slower way than that to turn it over. It seems like there should be somebody you could ask for help that is close enough to get to where the tractor is.

Someone did it.