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PTO Generators

T

Traditional Farmer

Well-known Member
Location
Virginia
Looking at buying a 25KW or larger PTO generator.Good brands and anything to stay away from? My idea which may or may not work is to run it with one of my David Brown 990 tractors with 1000 and 540 PTO.Using the 1000 PTO I could run the generator at about 1/2 throttle.The 990 has plenty of low end torque so hope it would work.
 
Katolight is a reputable brand. Have a very reliable 50 kw PTO unit we've had since 1976. I'm told to stay clear of generac.
 
PTO generators need 2hp (pto hp) per KW. I have an old Winco (1967) and it is still operating great. It probably puts out dirty power but I have never messed up any of my electronics or appliances. Winco are still good generators from what I hear. There is a gentleman on here that knows everything about generators and maybe he'll chime in. You didn't say what you're going to do with this or what you're going to run with it. Just make sure you get the proper transfer switch hooked up.
 
Sorry Traditional Farmer I should of looked who posted this. I know you know who Billy is the generator guy. And I'm sure you know it takes two horsepower per kilowatt. I should have looked closer.
 
Didn't know about the HP to KW and any information is good.I'm going to hook it up to the house do plan on getting a transfer switch so I can run the whole house off the one generator,tired of dealing with the cords and starting small generators.Always will have a tractor that will fire up.Hope Billy and others that have experience with these will give their opinions and ideas.
 
In electrical 1 hp=746 watts, to make 25 000 watts itll take bare minimum 33.5 hp inside the generator plus youll loose a bit to your gear box internals of your tractor ect.
 
Yes at least 2hp per kw. You always want a little more than you need. There is no half throttle. The PTO unit runs at 540-1000 rpm. Depending on the gear box drive. To get the 1800 needed for voltage. Onan,Winco,Winpower,Katolight. All make very good units. Plain simple to use. Although I am not sure if Onan still does. Since Cummins bought them. You should look around. You might find one not being used. I know plenty of units came from the dealer into the barn. Never used.

Now the warning label. Stay AWAY from Generac (Genajunk). I have been dealing with them since 1979. Yes they will sell you one cheap. Take you money. Then they don't know you.
1-903-536-2816 if you need to talk.
 
By half throttle I was thinking of getting a 540 generator and then use the 1000 PTO on the DB 990 at about half throttle to actually turn the generator at 540.Think it'll work? The governor on those tractors are pretty good at maintaining RPM.
 
Sorry about that. But when I see half throttle. I think of all the service calls. I have made where they set the speed at half throttle. Then complain about low or no voltage.

You are correct.
 
We had a Winco to keep the fans running on a farrowing house in the 80's. Never had any issues with it.

There is a small town near me of about 2000 people that manufactures transfer switches. Made in the USA. Their quality seems excellent on the items bearing their name.
Ronk Electrical
 
(quoted from post at 09:36:15 01/09/22) Looking at buying a 25KW or larger PTO generator.Good brands and anything to stay away from? My idea which may or may not work is to run it with one of my David Brown 990 tractors with 1000 and 540 PTO.Using the 1000 PTO I could run the generator at about 1/2 throttle.The 990 has plenty of low end torque so hope it would work.
Click to expand...

I do exactly that with my DB990 and 25Kw alternator. Mine is a brand long out of production, but there are others here with opinion on the currently produced brands.

FWIW- When I run the PTO alternator, I have to throw the breaker for my wifes electric double oven. The power signal isn't clean enough for it and it messes it up, makes it go wonky. So I leave it off. There are probably ways to rectify this issue, but "lekticity" is all magic to me, so I get by this way.
 
As openly negative as you are about Generac, to the point of making unprovoked negative comments about the company, I can't help but think the feeling must be mutual on the part of Generac for reasons you're not stating.

I have a 10KW Generac generator that's always been flawless and done what I wanted it to. The worst thing I can say about it is I had to replace the battery this year, after six years.
 
You don't run a pto generator at half or full throttle. You run it at 60 hz or all your appliances will act funny. Be sure there's a gauge on the generator showing hz. My 25 kw has two plugs, one is 13 kw and looks like a standard 220 v. plug. The 25 kw plug is unique to the generator and has three welding cables coming off or it, one for each lug.
 
The Katolite is made in or near Mankato Minnesota, their a quality company,they ship them all over the world! But yrs ago when i bought, a Pincor,because that's what my Local REA was selling ! I don't own any Katolite stock, or any affiliation with the co! But most have to be used evry once in a while to active the exciters in them!
 
Half throttle depends on the load. I have an old Winpower (now Winco I believe) 25/15. 25kw short term, 15 constant. The one time I ran it all night I powered it with an AC C. The only thing using any power was the house, and that took next to nothing. This alternator will start a 10 HP centrifugal blower (which is hard starting) on a grain bin dryer. But you want a good 50-60 HP in front of it. AC WD45 won't do it. JD 2520D did. JD 4020D on 1000 RPM shaft throttled down would NOT do it.

This alternator appears to provide fairly 'clean' electricity. I've had no trouble running anything in the house with it. Neighbor was trying to charge a manlift with his single cylinder generator, and it wouldn't do it. Capacity was not the issue. I took my old Winpower up there behind a little tractor and it did just fine.
 
Goose
It is not so much the product that I have a problem with. It is more in the lack of support from them and their dealers. They had a 25kw diesel unit. That could hold its own with any of them. But try getting parts for it. Try finding parts for a Topaz unit made in India. Not a bad unit but parts came from India. The new Onan small RV units. To me and some others. Are 3600 rpm junk.

Would you by a car or truck. If you could not get parts or service. A product no matter how good it may be. Is useless without good support.

Sorry if that upsets you. But facts are facts.
1-903-536-2816
 
And something I forgot to add- even if you have the power, I don't think you're going to get the governor response at the low engine speed that you need or want to respond to a changing load. If your load is constant, no problem. And, the governor response on a diesel engine is more precise than some of these old slow running gas engines.
 
Dad has done exactly that with his and it works just have to match the 60 cycle deal. A slightly bigger tractor helps with the stability of PTO speed under load. With our 674 we run it on the 540 shaft on an 856 or so we run it on the 1000 idled back some.
 
Generac is headquartered in my county, and they have at least one factory here as well. Like you, most people I know say to stay away. I also have a 200kw Onan here, great generator, but their support has changed with the ownership. Used to be if you gave Onan your serial number, they pretty much had the complete history of your generator... almost to the point of being a bit creepy! The new ownership doesn't seem to have much of any support or knowledge for anything beyond 10 years old.
 
I will be the guy you do not want to hear from. Over the years I have seen more folks have trouble from PTO generators. They are fine for a static or continuous load but you hook your house and get ever thing set then the hot water heater or well or some load comes on. The tractor does not pick up enough to keep the voltage right then you burn out you refrigerator or tv. I have sold I do not know how many generators that experienced just what I said. To each hi own and your experience may be better. I have a 20 kw propane that is wired where it kicks on when the current goes off and sure is nice.
 
Billy and I have spoke several times on his Generac feelings but he refuses to admit that NOW or latter years they have captured the home generation bussiness and offer excellent service and warranty. I am like you Billy have a 20 KW hard wired that is over 8 years old and NO problems. Generac around here is well accepted.
 
jm that sounds exactly like someone running a PTO generator with an underpowered tractor. I have an old 1967 Winco 15kw I run with my Ford 5000 diesel. More than enough power. The longest I have had to run it was about 53 hours straight. I used everything in my house as normal. I never had an issue with anything!
 
Goose and jm.

I will say this again. It is not the product I have a problem with. It is the lack of support I have a problem with. Onan is becoming the same way. No product is good. Without proper support. Generac does have some dealers. That try very hard that are being hurt. Buy the ones that don't care.
 
It won't work well. Your hp is to small. Your governor will be to slow
Tried to run a 35 kw. With a 806D. 95 hp. On 1000 rpm shaft. Did fine on 540rpm shaft.
 
According to TractorData, The DB 990 tested at about 48 PTO HP when at the rated PTO speed speed. About 52 HP at rated engine speed.

Engine RPM:
540@1800 (Low)
540@1100 (High)
1000@2000

I doubt you will be pleased with performance if you run it on a 1000 rpm PTO at half (+/-) throttle.
 
It won't work well. Your hp is to small. Your governor will be to slow
Tried to run a 35 kw. With a 806D. 95 hp. On 1000 rpm shaft. Did fine on 540rpm shaft.
 
Must be diffrent there in Texas. here the dealer has three service trucks and keeps one on standby 24/7. AND we are in a rural country setting. When you get in Nashville or Memphis more than one dealer. I actually can not even find another generator dealer within 100 mile of my house. They seem to advertise service with the installation. Again I may just be in a strong area. I even got a Christmas Card fro a Generac dealer I did not know soliciting my bussiness, very completive here .
 
Cost to run over a extended time period, 24/7, is crushing my opinion if it is just for a house. I had one and sold it.

Vito
 
I have a Katolight 25K 540 pto generator, it has 3 lights, 2 red and a green. When using, speed up the tractor till you get a green light and let her go. I hooked the 1850 with 1000 rpm pto and an adapter to it when the power went out. It didn't quite get to half throttle when the green light came on. It worked good until the well kicked in and then it dropped back to a red light. I switched to the other 1850 with 540 pto and opened it up till the green light came on, wasn't near full throttle, ran great but used a lot of fuel over 2 days. I keep thinking about selling it and getting a 10,000 or 12,000 watt for LP, it would be a lot cheaper to run!!
 
When I was working we had. Nine techs at our location. When Onan was Onan. Tennessee had 3 distributors and 13 service locations. And all that means nothing without good support. If that Generac distributor has a good service department count yourself lucky.
 
Torque curve to HP is where the problem comes in at. Half throttle will probably be close to the peak torque and Pto speed willl probably be a bit past peak HP so it will tend to vary in the PTO speed with the half throttle setting as load changes. The reason I mention the larger tractor so you have both at the half throttle point. Enough HP with the Torque. The reason it may or may not work and may or may not save much on fuel if it does work.
 
We had a 18KW PTO generator when I was a kid and an IH 1066 with the smoke screw cranked down until it snapped off.

Dad figured he could run it off the 1000PTO on the 1066 and save a little fuel when we weren't doing chores. It was a train wreck. The governor couldn't keep up even with that much power and torque. Had to shut down and put it back on the 540.

It doesn't really save any appreciable amount of fuel anyway. The governor only applies as much fuel as needed to produce the HP. There is a slight overhead to running higher RPMs, but not that much.
 

I studied this very same thing about using a Ford select o speed tractor I had with 2 speed pto
It's all good theory but there's one issue
Although your David Brown and my Ford 4000 are rated nearly the same once you idle the engine down to 1100 rpm to operate that 1000 shaft at 540, you've lowered the engines hp output by nearly half or more.
So now your only getting maybe 20-25 hp output from the tractor that will get you 10-12 kw from the generator before the tractor starts choking down changing the hertz output and causing everything to go crazy.
I thing you may be able to operate the generator like you want but you'll have to limit what your operating in the house, you won't be able to operate the furnace while the water heater or cook stove is in operation

We ran our house minus the furnace on a 5500 watt generator but only by turning certain things on at a time
Lights, tv, microwave or small electric grill were ok, lights and tv only when we turned the water pump on, water pump off and then water heater on, once water was hot turn water heater off and water pump back on to run hot water. Water heater and pump off and now we can cook with grill and microwave
We had a small 1500 watt ceramic heater to knock the chill off but it also had to be turned off to heat or run water. We now have a propane gas log heater for backup heat
We have a 75KW backup genset at the poultry barns that operated for 10 days during that power outage, at 24% load it burned 360 gallons of diesel or 36 gallons per day average, it's half mile from the house so to far to run a power cord.
 
Destroked I don't know if you
ever watched Green Acres but your
explaining having to turn this
off to run that reminds me of the
electric system Oliver and Lisa
had in there house on Green acres
 
(quoted from post at 12:09:03 01/10/22) The thing about the DB 990 is I can change from 1000 to 540 if needed just by shifting the PTO lever.
Click to expand...


All I can tell you is I do it with my 990 and the 25Kw unit. Mine has a gauge to find the 60 cycles needed. I haven't seen a difference between running it at 540 or 1000 rpm except in noise from the tractor and fuel use. The fuel use isn't a real big difference with something as efficient as the 990. I'm sure there's truth to what everyone is saying, but I think you'll have to try it and see what your specific setup demands.
 
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