First time with diesel in the winter

This is my first winter with my John Deere R, and F350 with the 6.9 idi. What do I need to know about diesels in the winter? I buy road diesel at a Marathon station, and off-road diesel at the local farm fuel station. Do I need additives? I don’t plan on using the truck or tractor when it’s below 20*F, but things come up, so I might need to use them when it’s below 20*F.
Also I have 6 5gallon cans of off-road diesel that I bought in August, do I need to do something special with that before I can use it.
Any advice is appreciated.

Where are you locate.

In Minnesota we have a biodiesel mandate, in summer up to 20% of the diesel is soybean or rendering plant blend. Works feat but doesn’t flow well in winter, after october they sell a winter version, which is I think only 2 or 5% bio blend. It is real important to get the immersions stuff run through and get a winter blend in your tank. This is all regular #2 diesel here. Do you have similar wherever you are?

At 20 degrees f the gel issue is just thinking about starting. If you have an old fuel filter it might want to think about gelling up......

Putting an amount of anti gel in the tank really helps, and makes you pretty safe down to 10 or zero. I actually can run at minus 15 f on #2 and the antigel, but that is around the yard I’d be concerned making a longer trip with that. You start learning how to make it work......

Blending in #1 diesel fuel also works well. To get down to zero you may want 40% #1 diesel blended in.

In a pinch a little kerosene works too as it is basically a really fine #1 diesel, but I’m used to older tolerant diesels, the new high pressure and def setups be careful with.

In any case, all of this blending or adding needs to be done early, or in a heated shop, and the fuel needs to mix around so it gets through the filter, pump, etc. if your diesel is sitting there with #1 and the temp drops to 5 degrees and you decide you need to use it now, good luck. The filter will clog up with wax particularly real quick and you will be clogged up. So prepare early if you think you need some help.

If you de gel up some hot water on the filter, magnetic heater on the filter, or some such and get heat into the whole engine compartment, get the fuel warmed and treated and circulated while warm and out of the wind.

My first year with a diesel tractor I didn’t pay attention and never had a problem with #2 normal diesel in a minnesota winter. That tractor had the engine tank heater right below the fuel filter, heating the engine heted the fuel filter with th warmth rising off it, and engine coolant going through the heater. The tractor fuel tank is above the engine so it too heated up enough to keep the tractor working fine.

Now I run three diesel tractors over winter. If I don’t preapare right, I can notice it works ok driving one direction, when I turn and the wind blows cold instead of warm are on the fuel filter it starts stalling in 5 minutes.... get it turned and parked o the wind blow nine heat to the filter again and it will thaw itself out. One time I drove a mile to get a round bale, tractor died when I started coming back home. Ended up backing all the way home with the bale so the engine heat kept the filter flowing.....

Me, I think I would do a half to a full treatment of the antigel additive while it is warm yet, and then you are ready if it dips down to 10 or 15 degrees and you can make a go of it. I always use Power Service, there are several other popular brands and there is a lot of debate over which is ‘best’, I won’t even get into that as there is never a winner.....

Paul

I put Howell's in mine. Put about twice as much as the jug says.

Run an anti gel additive of some kind I’ve always found it takes about twice what the bottle says when it gets really cold 15 below zero or colder .

What you buy for the truck at the pump should be good to go provided your truck hasn't been sitting around with summer fuel in it. For tractors etc. I gave up on additives long ago. I use 50% kerosene with summer off road diesel and have had no problems in winter. Do the mix when it's warm enough the diesel is clear.

I gave up on additives to until I spent a week trying to thaw everything out again might be fine where it doesn’t get much below freezing in the winter . Had 9 semis gelled up running Howe’s the guys who would dump the whole bottle in each time they filled up never had a problem

(quoted from post at 17:40:01 12/11/20) This is my first winter with my John Deere R, and F350 with the 6.9 idi. What do I need to know about diesels in the winter? I buy road diesel at a Marathon station, and off-road diesel at the local farm fuel station. Do I need additives? I don t plan on using the truck or tractor when it s below 20*F, but things come up, so I might need to use them when it s below 20*F.
Also I have 6 5gallon cans of off-road diesel that I bought in August, do I need to do something special with that before I can use it.
Any advice is appreciated.

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X2 what has been posted previously. I only use about a tankful of fuel per season in my snow plow tractor and along about Thanksgiving I let it get down to a half tank and fill it with kerosene (the #2 in the tank has already been treated). The years that I drove a diesel car in the winter I learned the hard way that at -30 even a double dose of additive isn't enough so I would double dose the #2 then mix in 30% (+/-) kero.
Jim

Most diesel fuel suppliers in northern states mix 60% #2/40% kerosene in the summer and 40% #2/60% kerosene in the winter. Most loggers I know want 70% kerosene in their skidders and such during the winter. When it gets below 10 degrees it would be smart to add another 5 gallons of kerosene to the tractor or truck's fuel tank. I've had questionable results with fuel additives of various brands. The one given is if it doesn't run right, add kerosene to the fuel tank until it does run right. Always start cold weather with fresh fuel filters. If I were going to use those cans of summer fuel in the winter, I would mix 5 gals. of kerosene with every ten gals of the fuel. (or whatever it took to get the tractor to run right).

If it has a block heater. You should keep it plugged in. Less strain on the system when trying to start.

If you buy fuel from a reputable supplier and use winter blend fuel in the winter you should have no problem without all the patent medicine and snake oils. We run diesels all winter in Mid MI with no problems and no snake oils or patent medicines. Always start and run even at -20F When I ran over the road I never snake oiled my fuel and never had problems unless I didn't change the fuel filter in the fall before winter. Only changed them twice a year spring and fall. I used to change them with every oil change then looked at a few of them cut open with nothing in them so quit doing it. I even shut the truck off one night at the old ranchand truckstop in Montpelier ID. This was about midnight woke up about 8:am started right up fine was -28F the gal inside told me it got down to that night. Old Cat never let me down.

I’m in Michigan. I’m still new to diesel, so I don’t know about all the blends and so on.
Thanks for the information!

Thanks for all the information guys!

Coolant heater and kerosene .

I haven't had any trouble with fuel gelling in my diesel pickup, but it always has fresh fuel in the tank. But I've had problems with heating oil gelling in an outdoor tank at a vacant house we own. Old fuel left over from the previous spring will gel up when it gets much below zero, but if I add a quart of Power Service around November I won't have any trouble.

I would suggest treating your 30 gallons of diesel as well as whatever is in the tractor. I'd use up the diesel you have in jugs as soon as practical.

If you read the fine print on the Howes bottle it says just that. For real cold it is enough for 160 gal.

Keep a spare set of fuel filters, and keep the fuel tank full. I don’t know what kind of tractor you have, but it is always easier to bleed a tractor that has a full tank of fuel ,rather a near empty tank. And if you haven’t ever changed a fuel filter on a diesel tractor, go get a set, and do a practice run now while it is still warm. I have seen winters when it can be very cold, -30F and colder, and never had any trouble. And then the next year have fuel issues every time it got cold. Having the filter on hand on a cold day if it quits, you can swap them out and restart the tractor before it cools down. Particularly if you are a long ways from a electric outlet. The a portable generator will run the block heater. My bet is, you will have no trouble at all

On those old IDI's, (if it still works) there is a fast idle solenoid and cold timing advance on the injector pump to help cold starts. With key on waiting for glow plugs, tap and release the throttle before starting. The solenoid can't open the throttle but it can hold it, that's the only reason why you tap the throttle. The high idle is only a few hundred RPM or around 1000 RPM, and it will shut off and return to regular idle automatically around 112*F coolant temp.

Most people never knew about this feature, and the solenoid can get sticky from never being used. If it doesn't work, sometimes you can spray a little wd40 on it and move the plunger in/out a few times. These features are not required for cold starts, but they do help starting and maintaining a smooth idle when cold.

Don't have a diesel truck, but I'd make sure the battery connectors are all clean, tight and up to snuff and that my charging system was 100%. A block heater is a great idea.

On tractors, same thing applies and I often use a heat gun into the air intake in my non-glow plug diesel. Makes an enormous difference in ease of starting and the heat gun offers continuous hit air, not just a cylinder full.

I've always had good luck with POWER SERVICE keeping diesels running in cold weather. I carried a gallon jug in my semi-tractor and operated on the "GLUG-system", dumped a GLUG in the fuel tank before filling it every day. In my 7.3L PSD I used it per the label instructions, maybe a touch more. My pickup had a fuel heater in the filter canister that I sorta relied on till I found out it only pulled about 3 amps at 12V, 40 watts, Pulled the heater out and strictly used POWER SERVICE in the white bottle. If you want to use your old summer fuel, buy a quart of POWER SERVICE 911, red bottle I think, split it between the 6 cans of fuel equally.
I SINCERELY hope you don't need your R till spring, like maybe MEMORIAL DAY. They are the only Deere diesel with only a w cylinder pony motor, the pony is too gutless to spin the big diesel over more than a revolution or two before it pulls down and almost stalls. The day I discovered Dad's Deere Failure, His R in the shed about 2-3 days before Christmas 1963, We went thru 3 tanks of gasoline and never did get the diesel running. Neighbor's 730-D with V-4 pony had the big diesel motoring over and started before it was half wound up to full rpm. Also, don't use the PTO on the R any more than you have to, chronic weak gearbox, Township road commissioner bought Dad's R, knocked the PTO out 3 times in 3 years running a pto rototiller chewing up scarified oiled roads. Third time the tractor was traded of a used Oliver 770 diesel I was still running chewing up roads 10 years later with no problem. ALSO, R engines was only Deere 2 cyl diesel without a center main bearing. If lugged down in a hard pull they can break the crankshaft. My suggestion if you really want a big awkward clumbsey standard tractor, get rid of the R and get an 80 or 820/830.

Back in the day when the winters were colder and wetter, not Indian winters, we could buy #1 from the station as well as kerosene but no more. I've added kerosene and bot the additives.

I may get flamed here but I even added a gallon or two of gasoline to a hundred gallon tank to thin it out. That was cheaper and easier and nothing blew up. Done the opposite as well, added a little diesel to a car to run it a little hotter to clean it up a little but not sure if that helped.

For those drip pasture burners they had me using half diesel and half gas mix.

I installed a fuel filter heater on my 1640 Deere. The heater looks like a glow plug. The heater threads into a spare port in the bottom of the square fuel filter housing and the thermostat threads into a spare port in the top of the filter housing . Connect 12V from a switched source and good to go.

I use peak or power service anti-gel in my two 6.9 IDIs and several diesel tractors.And like was already mentioned,just dump in a healthy dose.I always plug in my block heaters if it is below 40 degrees Fahrenheit.The most important thing on IDIs is keeping the glow plug system up to snuff and making sure you don't have any possibility of air intrusion like any diesel.I wired a manual override switch for the glow plugs on both my trucks.Those factory controllers are a piece of junk and will wipe out all your glow plugs if they go bad,that is why I installed the override.


Rock

The 2 cyl. pony on the R will outlast 3 of the V4's. The old story about the R pto being a weak spot is also BS. We have had R's since the 50's (have 2 now) & 820 & 830's (1 830 now) & have put many pto hrs. w/o a failure. Auger wagons in the rice areas had pto driven augers and the R's spent many hrs. of trouble free service. Never had a 80, but the green dash 820 is basically the same tractor.

(quoted from post at 10:30:48 12/12/20)
Back in the day when the winters were colder and wetter, not Indian winters, we could buy #1 from the station as well as kerosene but no more. I've added kerosene and bot the additives.

I may get flamed here but I even added a gallon or two of gasoline to a hundred gallon tank to thin it out. That was cheaper and easier and nothing blew up. Done the opposite as well, added a little diesel to a car to run it a little hotter to clean it up a little but not sure if that helped.

For those drip pasture burners they had me using half diesel and half gas mix.

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he old VW diesel owner's manual suggests up to 20% gasoline for winter use.

Mercedes did too, many years ago, but if you do that with a modern diesel you would probably ruin the injector pump!

I use power services at 2x the rate on the bottle, it used to work with 1x, but BioDiesel is worse. I do not worry about any additives if only going down to 20F, as the normal Diesel should be fine. If really cold, cycle the glow plugs a couple times, it will start much easier. As stated, the 6.9 had real issues with glow plugs, make sure all work and controller too.

Should be ok. Coolant heater heater for the truck. Run the the R decompressed a little longer. I have used a tarp and a 35000 btu propane heater to start my 4020 when things got bad. Remember diesels return fuel to the tank and this fuel is warmer. But I rarely start any of my diesels without plugging in and my gas 4020 draws the daily chore duty.

Why for 10$ would you even risk it ? I have always used power service at double the rate at the first start of winter I dump one big bottle each In the tractors and truck. Whoever thinks it’s a good idea has never had to thaw a gelled up engine when it’s 30 below .

I have used gasoline as an anti gel when it’s 40 below and
don’t have anything else

(quoted from post at 16:09:59 12/11/20) If it has a block heater. You should keep it plugged in. Less strain on the system when trying to start.

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Plugging in a couple of hours before you need it is perfectly fine. Leaving it plugged in 24/7 for four months straight just runs up your electric bill and can be a fire hazard.

If you don't know when you might need the machine, get yourself a heavy duty timer and run the block heater for a couple hours in the morning and a couple in the afternoon.

On the subject of fuel treatment, you have to MAKE SURE TO GET THE RIGHT KIND!!!

There are all kinds of diesel treatments. Lubricity enhancers. Injector cleaners. Algae killers. Winterizing formulas. Emergency anti-gel.

Make sure the stuff you get is for treating the fuel for winter. NOT the emergency anti-gel. That doesn't do you any good if the fuel is not gelled. It's only for when your fuel gels up on you.

One option
Power service

Another option
Howe s

Another option
Stanadyne

I am a 5 gallon can user of diesel, so I get taxed at my local gas station/convenience store. They claim to start using additive around October. If they do its not enough. Twice in the last few years I have had jelled fuel. Now every can I buy gets a shot of Power service.

Would you consider Marathon a reputable supplier, or should I look for another station?

I didn't know about that. Do I need to take it out of the pump to spray wd40 on it?
Thanks

I think I might have a problem with air getting in on the IDI. How do I find out if I have a problem?

I appreciate the advice on the diesel treatment. Regarding the R I couldn’t disagree with you more. It was 25° the other day and I fired the pony motor up, idled it for two minutes, and then it started the big engine. It fired right up without any trouble. Also as far as the PTO, this tractor has had a PTO powered winch on it and several other PTO powered implements on it and never had a problem. The tractor has pulled hard, rolled, and had other abuse (before I got it) but it still runs perfectly and pulls really good without using hardly any fuel. Also it’s a family tractor so I wouldn’t get rid of it for anything. It’s too bad you had such a bad experience with your R because I would say it is almost the greatest tractor ever built.

It’s a risk you don’t need to take and it is waste of money not to use anti gel once it gelled then you get to replace the fuel filters and then hope you can thaw it out before spring

(quoted from post at 15:39:46 12/13/20) It s a risk you don t need to take and it is waste of money not to use anti gel once it gelled then you get to replace the fuel filters and then hope you can thaw it out before spring

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Yup!

(quoted from post at 11:09:30 12/13/20) I think I might have a problem with air getting in on the IDI. How do I find out if I have a problem?

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Air intrusion can be difficult to find, especially on the low psi or suction side of the fuel system. If you are lucky you might see signs of fuel leakage, not necessarily dripping fuel but oily residue on lines or fittings. Air molecules are smaller than diesel molecules so it's possible to have air intrusion without signs of a fuel leak.

If it still has the original fuel/water separator on the firewall beside the brake booster, those were very problematic. Most people bypassed those or replaced with an aftermarket unit. A 7.3 IDI filter head can be swapped, along with a filter that has the drain valve on the bottom.

Injector return lines (rubber lines between all injectors), return line caps/hats and o-rings. There is a "kit" you can buy that comes with rubber line, o-rings, caps/hats, and spring type hose clamps.

Fuel olives/seals. The hard fuel lines from the lift pump to the filter head, and the filter head to the Injector pump. A lot of people try to snug the line down tighter, this might help temporarily but the rubber seals on the hard lines need to be replaced.

Fuel heater fitting on top of the filter head. The single wire electrical connector goes through the top of the filter head and has an o-ring seal.

Rubber fuel line at the inlet of the lift pump, fuel switchover valve on the frame.