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Brand loyalty

J

JohnV2000

Member
Last weekend I biked past a farm in northeastern Ohio that had several Minneapolis Moline tractors. There was one that was probably from the 40s or 50s, then several more that looked progressively newer.

It got me thinking about how much brand loyalty farmers had and have. I always see farms that have the same brand of tractor all over, be it JD, IH, Ford, etc. This got me wondering about how often farmers would branch out and own different brands.

I know that there were often benefits to owning to the same brand, such as a trusted dealer, similar parts and tools, and known reliability. However, I know that in the 30s and 40s, tractor technology often moved very quickly.

If someone was a JD guy and IH came out with a new, extremely helpful technology, would farmers have been willing to switch to IH or would they stick with the older technology JD (just as a example, I do not mean to pick on JD) and wait until their brand caught up with the new technology.

I guess I am just a little curious on this cold morning.

John
 
If dealerships were available I think many jumped ship if they felt their brand was lagging. I know IH lost a lot of customers when JD got past their 2 cylinder engines and IH was having troubles with rear end
bearings. IH also lost customers when they basically upgraded the H and M instead of coming out with new models during most of the 50's as they had stretched the H and M too far. I don't know what happened
with other manufacturers. I'm sure there are guys here that can elaborate a lot more.
 
Early on my family was all JD. There were many dealers around, and one was family! But then in 1950 my grandfather and father bought a new AC WD. I believe the two cylinder design which had served JD so well was getting old to them. The WD with mounted plow and hydraulic depth control/traction booster was handy. My experience was that the WD was easier and safer for a youth to operate than the JD 50. It's not that JD was supplanted. JD implements have always prevailed here, and both green and orange tractors worked side by side, each having their own benefits. AC has long since died, but the WD is still in the family!
 
When we wanted a new compact utility we bought a JD because there was a good dealer nearby that my dad had done business with for 60 years, and the JD has a
Yanmar engine. I think in the long run JD will have the best resale value in the future, except for Kubota. As far as old tractors I like Farmall, but they had
some problems in the past. JD should of phased out the 2-cylinders sooner, and kept up with the rest of the industry.
 
I've found brand loyalty is
regional in many cases. Where
I'm at it's because farming
is harder than say southern
MN and IA and farmers buy
what's cheap. It's not
uncommon to see several older
tractors from different
brands on one farm here.

In places like southern MN
where the ground and weather
is good you see mostly one
brand on a farm. Having
driven in all 48 states at
first I found it odd that in
places like Indiana
especially, it was common to
see different brands of new
machinery working the same
field. Not something you see
much in southern MN and Iowa.
Don't know why that is as
both are good farming areas.
 
40s & 50s would be mostly my Grandpas era and the begining of my Dads era. In the 50s, we had lots of local dealers, Ford, MM, JI Case, JD, IH. Grandpa went from horses to tractors. I can?t remember which brand he had that tipped over with him and his 2 boys (1 was my dad) but I do know that In the 50s he bought a new Ford 8N with multiple attachments. Plow & packer, mower, cultivator, pelt pulley, PTO adapter, rear mount dirt scoop are the ones that I can think of. The 3pt was a big jump in tractor technology. Most at the cultivators we?re front mount at the time. Of course Grandpas new cultivator was rear mount. The neighbors laughed at Grandpa because they wondered how he was going to drive forward and look backwards at the cultivator at the same time. Then it rained. Grandpa took his rear mount cultivator out to cultivate a day or two earlier than usual after that rain. The neighbors not to be out done took their front mount tricycle JD, IH, AC. MM, etc out and got the front end stuck. They came over to watch Grandpa cultivate with this new tractor with all the weight on the back tires.

As for Dad he started out with a Ford Major, Grandpas Ford 8N, JI Case SC, Ford 800, JI Case VAC, Ford ?? With a mounted corn picker (only 1 year & it was gone) IH Super WD9, then after that it was almost exclusively MM tractors.

My brother & I are mostly JD with a few other older tractors of various brands. And a Bobcat that replaced most of the close quarters work the Fords did. Dads Fords & the MMs are retired as parade tractors now

As for machinery all 3 generations had/have multiple colors including rust.
 
I can remember having just about all of the tractors Dad and I bought. Everything was IH up until 1980 or so, all
older equipment. He bought a 4020 JD, later a 3020. Then we got a 1030 Case CK. Always seemed like the bigger we
went, the less we got done. Our last years of farming, we went back to the "smaller" tractors, like the M and H IH,
and retired. We made more renting our land than farming it, and I still rent it now. The only tractor that ever
stayed in our herd was Dads 41 M Farmall, and it still sits in the barn today.
 
It is amazing what draws each of us to particular brand and why. Growing up on a small farm starting out with a Model A gitney then to a Farmall Super A plowing and haying. Our neighbors used John Deeres a 520 and 620. Always loved hearing those twins laboring while haying. Since then have owned a few Farmhalls now strictly John Deeres 60 and 70 both restored. Love them because of the colors but mostly the sound.
 

I think the dealer and $$$ have a lot to do with it. An older farmer I know tells the story of how his farm was 100% Ford for decades. Then his dealer refused to give him something like $50.00 on a trade in the dealer would make several thousand on. That whole farm went JD green within a short time.
 
The Primary driver for brand loyalty is the Dealership owner/staff...a helpful caring staff will make the difference 90% of the time,, unfortunately that part of the equation is falling behind now days....
 
This is a good topic for a friendly discussion. I believe that
when farmers started to switch from horses to tractors a local
dealer would have a lot to do with their choices. Also if a
neighbor bought a certain brand and was satisfied that might
influence them. Then often they would be brand loyal unless
they had bad luck with either a machine or the dealer and
then they would be likely to try something different. I have
heard a few stories from back then where some one had a
falling out with their dealer and then tried a different brand. In
my local area the prevailing brands were Deere Ford Farmall
and Oliver mainly due to local dealers with very little MM,
Case AC and MH/MF mostly due to no nearby dealers except
for a small Case dealer 12-15 miles away who did have a
small customer base near him. Certain tractor/ implement
brands/ models were very popular with certain types of
farming and that also was a factor. For example when there
were a lot of smaller vegetable growers ( around here they
used to be called ?truck farmers ?) Farmall Cub,A and C
tractors were very popular with them for their cultivating
abilities. Northwest and East of Syracuse NY as well as right
in part of what is now the East part of Syracuse were
mucklands and on the muck AC model G tractors and Cletrac
crawlers were popular with the vegetable growers on the
muck who grew a lot of onions potatoes and lettuce. The main
type of farming around here back then was small dairy farms
and New Holland hay and forage equipment was very popular
and a NH dealer sometimes got tractor customers by selling
them NH equipment.
 
My father in law was an IH guy and had a 10-20 at one time. He was going to buy a new H but a neighbor and close friend had a '48 E3 and told dad to get the COOP, once you try the live PTO you won't want anything else. So he bought a '50 E3 and stuck with them. He got the neighbor's E3 when he sold his farm. He later added a late JD A but never really loved it like his COOPs. The neighbor then went in with a partner on a Ford dealership. I still have them all and use them for a little haying and playing.
 
Back in the day brand loyalty was in no small part driven by the proximity of a dealer, ANY dealer. If there was a Massey dealer 10 miles away and an IH dealer 20 miles away, the Massey dealer got the business.

Tractor hauling technology of the time also struck me as pretty sketchy. Seems like very few had proper lowboy trailers and road tractors to deliver equipment with, and rollbacks didn't exist yet. If they had a truck it was an old stake body, and if they had a trailer it was one of those single axle gravity tilt deck deals.

The brand loyalty was built back in those times, and carried over across the generations.
 
During the depression of the 1930s our neighbor needed a tractor to replace his old Fordson which was worn out. He went to the
First National Bank to apply for a loan to buy a tractor. They turned him down. He went over to the John Deere dealer and explained
his plight. Dealer asked him what he needed. They decided that an A would be needed. Dealer then asked him if he needed a plow. He
did. dealer took Fordson and Oliver plow as down payment and let him figure out the payment plan. Within a few days our neighbor
had a Brand new John Deere A and a new John Deere plow. Neighbor's brother, brother-in-law and another neighbor heard about it and
all went in and bought new John Deere tractors and plows. Within just a few weeks our neighborhood was Green. All because of
financing available through John Deere dealer. That was in 1936. Neighborhood stayed pretty Green until about 1960. Dealer retired
and John Deere closed the dealership and selected a new location about 25 miles away. Eventually the green went away, too. Except
for a few diehards. I'm one of the few around with some Green in the fleet.
 
Had a slight acquaintance that farmed out in the Abilene, Tx. area, might call him a MTO...Mid Time Operator. He started out with red gassers because thas what his daddy had on the place and
got all equipped with old and new since that was all that was available in red. Next thing you know the local red dealer comes out and parks some red LP tractors and tells him how great they
are...he didn't mention green influence at the time, nor any other color so I don't know how they were represented in his area......then diesel becomes popular, and out the dealer comes with
some red diesels......he tries, likes, and trades in his LPs.

Another MTO farmed Cotton in N. Tx. in the 1960 era and was running red same reason, he picked up where dad was leaving off and that was dad's choice. Told me of green dealer from 60
miles away made daily trips to the field with equipment for operators to use and comment on satisfaction.....they stayed with red because of brand loyalty. No reps from any other color out in
the field seeing what worked and didn't, what the farmer wanted and didn't, how the farmer could purchase what he needed with his available financial resources. Wasn't representation in either
case from the other colors.

Seems red and green both had the row crop market covered with their alphabet tractors. Ford and the Ferguson 3 pt. pretty much had the smaller utility market covered. Seems different areas
of the country were partial to certain colors that had the equipment to fit the need, or they just didn't have dealer representation. AC, Case, Oliver, MM weren't popular around here for some
reason. Dealer coverage is probably a big driver in what gets bought and where. No doubt familiarity with a brand helps in preserving loyalty. Who knows!
 
I had three bachelor uncles who farmed and were such John Deere fans that they wouldn't even buy any short line equipment. If John Deere didn't make it, they didn't need it. For that reason, my dad refused to own a piece of John Deere equipment.

On the other hand, my dad and I always had a mix of whatever worked. For tractors we had Case, Oliver, Massey Harris, Allis Chalmers, etc.

When I farmed, I had an 856 Farmall, an H Farmall, and a D19 Allis for tractors, and a John Deere combine. Kind of a mix for the rest of my machinery. (Still have the D19 and the H).
 
One thing not covered yet if
your talking back in the 50a
is that most brands has
proprietary hitch systems like
case, Allis, IH, and others
and if you had equipment for
one brand changing brands
required changing most or all
of your equipment. That was
expensive and helped keep
farmers in one brand.
 
Our son that farms has 3 large JD, 1 Kubota with cab and loader, 1 Ford for smaller jobs, and a skid steer of some kind.
I currently have 1 JD, 1 Ford, 1 Kubota, and 1 Case.
Richard in NW SC
 
Likewise with front mounted implements. Nearly everyone was cultivating back then. The two, and then four row cultivator, and the old two row ones converted to bean pullers kept at least a pair of compatible JD tractors around here for a long time.
 
The people I shake my head at are the ones who are totally against a certain brand. They have closed the door to opportunity. Modern electronics has made mating one brand with another difficult in some circumstances and I dont know if this will get worse or better with time. When we ran MacDon heads on Lexion combines one electronic component in the head did not communicate with the computer in the combine well. I think it was the automatic reel speed if I remember right.
 
Spent my formative summers, ages 10-18, on my Uncles Farm. He had all John Deere tractors, baler, disk, manure spreader, and plow. Case grain drill
and New Idea side delivery rake, both on steel wheels. Brillon hay conditioner. There was a good Deere dealership about 10 miles away that was
always fair when dealing in equipment, parts, and labor. IH, Case, Allis, Oliver dealers were all 30-50 miles away. Fairness in trade and distance made
for a mostly ?green? neighborhood.
 
One thing I remember the most from back when I worked at a Deere dealer was in the spring you would get people you never seen before come in to get parts for a John Deere corn planter. The only JD thing they owned was a 7000 corn planter !
 
It may be as simple as parts or availability of them. A lot of parts are interchangeable to other tractors in the same brand so if you inadvertently buy a part that wasn't needed it can go on the shelf until
one of the other tractors needs it.
 
Here?s my brand loyalty story. My Grandfather burns wood for heating
the house. So throughout the summer and winter we?re hulling wood.
He has one tractor a Ferguson TO-20 and a trailer to haul the wood.
So when I was 8 years old, I liked hauling wood and making the fire
in the furnace. But since I was only 8 I couldn?t pick up the big logs,
also it was hard for me to run the TO-20 (especially with way
oversized tires on it). So I decide I wanted my own tractor and trailer
to haul smaller wood with. Back then I knew almost nothing about
tractors, so I said to myself what brand are still making tractors? I
thought about it and remember that I have a Farmall, and John Deere
shirt. So I got on John Deere?s website first, and I saw the perfect
tractor, a X739. So I said that?s the tractor I want. Fast forward 10
years, I still don?t have the X739, but I started farming on my Grate
Grandparents farm. And all my tractors an implements are John
Deere, partly because red guys picked on me, but mainly because
John Deeres are better tractors. Also my grate Grandfather?s Ford
641, (even after my grandfather had it professionally restored)
doesn?t run right, if it even starts at all. Also there?s a JD Dealer only
20 minutes away, and they have really great people there. And every
year I become more convinced that I won?t buy any but John Deere.
 
Back around 1945-1965 dealers of all the major brands were plentiful enough locally that brand choice came down to the rapport a farmer had with a dealership and in
particular the owner. The IH dealer certainly sold product but the owners were not the type to sooth egos so many farmers branded them as bad dealers. The JD dealer
that took over in Hall around 1970 had a reputation as a talker and worked the concept of high volume low margin so he was beloved by many until he went out of
business during the early 1980's. As hinted at in this thread earlier JD and IH certainly had a leg up with many farmers with their financial divisions and therefore sold
lots of product. Ford did not have the best reputation for service as their facilities were very dated by the 1970's so getting an 8000 into a shop built for a 9N meant the
tractor was worked on out in the elements and if it was snowing out the 8000 did not get worked on. AC was just the next level down from JD and IH in a large portion of
NY followed by Case and Oliver.
 
For me, if it's an old tractor, I like it. I like using the different brand tractors and
finding out the good and bad with each. My barns are like a Christmas tree with all the
different colors. The only major name I don't have is a AC.....it's still not too late, I'd
like a WD45.
 
As mentioned here proximity of the dealer back then was a major factor due to lack
of trucks to transport tractors and equipment to and from the farm. New equipment
was delivered by Rail as close to the dealer as possible and it was up to him to
off-load it and get it home. Often driving them.
Another big factor was that
rural communities were very tight knit and made up of large families. As the family
tree grew many younger members had to branch out from the family farm. My dad for
instance was the oldest of 9 siblings. My grandfather was a horse trader and was a
dealer agent, In 1932 my dad and grandfather partnered up and became a Case dealer.
With all the siblings, cousins, and relatives by marriage farming on their own, they
had a loyal following of customers, who settled in and made up the community. Nuts
didn't roll too far from the tree back then. ------------------Loren
 
I think it boils down to close proximity to a good dealer for parts and service. In my family, my
maternal Grandpa started farming with a John Deere B. During WWII, the tractors were rationed. He
wanted a new A and got his name on the list. His name got to the top of the list and the dealer
sold the tractor to someone else. My Grandpa was furious. He was driving by the Oliver dealer and
he spotted a new 70. He traded the Deere and went to all Oliver. After the Oliver dealer closed in
1960, he bought a new Massey Super 90. Then, in 1964, my Dad went to work for the IH dealer and my
Grandpa went to all IH until he "retired." My Uncle went back to Massey. It was all about dealers
and relationships, though my Grandpa loved IH.
My paternal Grandpa had IH M's, Olivers, and a 4020 before going to all IH with a 1206.
When it came to planters...John Deere. Combines we were MM, Case, and finally Gleaner. It was about
service.
Me? I like them all.
 
Most JD dealers around here were located along a railroad line and a couple even had an address such as Railroad Avenue. Don't know if that was a mandate by corporate back in those days. One IH dealer was next to a railroad but the other brands most likely had to go to a siding some distance away to receive product. I think that all functioned pretty well regardless of distance to the railroad.
 
Have you read the, THE BREAK UP, What really happened it pretty interesting, About the IHC break up,you can buy it from 3-Point Ink.
 
Could you sum it up for us? I've heard of the book "A Corporate Tragedy" but not this one. A couple of guys my father knew were familiar with the politics at IH corporate in Chicago. They said management and stockholder groups were divided since the early 1960's on the direction of IH as a company. It was never a surprise to them that the ag division got sold off. Many people inside the company wanted to do trucks only evidently.
 
You should go to you tube and watch them plowing, at the Half Century of Progress, at Rantoul Ill. That two cylinder sound carries thru and above all the rest of the other brands there!!
 
My Grandfather was farming with a wore our 1020 McCormik Deering. The landlord of the farm came out and asked why he did not have something better. He said his name was on all the dealer lists but with WW II there were not enough tractors. Landlord said would you take an Allis Chalmers? The landlord was on the board of directors at the local bank where the Allis dealer did his banking. One phone call and he had new WC and mounted corn picker. He had Allis untill he quit farming. My Dad and him did not get along real well so Dad bought John Deere's just to be spiteful. But we often had a small Allis around. With the equipment business I ran about every brand but always prefered the Deere 10 and 20 series tractors but I also have one Allis. Tom
 
The only reason I could think of so many owning them was at the time it must of been one heck of a good design ?
 
I'm kinda the odd duck here. We moved to this rural area from the suburbs on NJ when I was 16. An I liked tractors. So working for various farmers taught me a lot. Now when we moved here in 1971 we had a Ford and JD dealer very close, 6-8 miles. AC was about 15. Case, IH, MM, Oliver all at least 25-25 and MF at 50. Now both the local JD and Ford dealers left a lot to be desired. The Ford guy Stan only wanted to sell cars and trucks. Ford, because of his location made him sell AG too. Well he didn't work very hard at that end of things. The JD was just out to make sales. Carried very little in parts and told more than one person that if a farmer needed something bad enough they would buy new......so they drove 25 miles and bought IH. Most of the area here was IH. Few AC's, one or 2 Olivers and MM's. But mostly IH. IN 74 I joined the Army. I wound up in Germany and in 78 was home on leave. The JD dealer had died. New dealer and man was this guy on top of things. I couldn't believe all the new JD equipment in the area!

So the big factor here was service after the sale. And them old tight wad farmers here in the early 70's were going to save a pile on gas and time buying local.


Rick
 
In 1950 we moved to a small farm that came equipped with an old Oliver Hart-Parr 70, 2 bottom trailer
plow, pull behind 8' disc, 4 section springtooth drag and a 3 section spike tooth drag, a corn binder
and a corn shredder. Dad was working on security for Kaiser-Frazer at the former Ford bomber plant at
Willow Run, 5 miles away.
He used the Oliver until 1953 when he bought the '51 8N. I was 10, an only son (I have 3 sisters) and
quickly learned to cultivate and later plow and fit ground. At the same time, Kaiser-Frazer closed the
Willow Run plant and dad was layed off, first going to the Ford tank plant and then back to the Ford
plant he had worked at 1942 to 1945.
We started renting some land and dad purchased a Woods Bros. 1 row corn picker and then a Woods Bros.
Dearborn 6' cut combine with it's won engine. The 8N was willing but pulling it's guts out. After
having the engine rebuilt, dad bought a Farmall H. It did our heavier pulling.
I left home in 1963. Dad tried to do the work alone but working in a factory by a day and trying to
farm nights and week-ends was too much. In 1968 he died at age 53 after a second heart attack.
My mother sold the H and all of the equipment. She kept the Ford for me and it's 3 point attachments.
My memories of the H prompted me to find and buy one about 25 years ago. I really had no use for it and
all of the Fords that I had accumulated left the H outside. I sold it.
I have been slowly downsizing my Ford collection and but will keep the '51 8n until I cannot climb on
anymore. It will then go to my oldest son to reside with his NAA Jubilee. My younger son will get the
'47 2N that he helped me restore.
The only 3 point attachments that I still have are a PHD, 3 point light duty forks, and a 6' back blade.
 
Well 986, Jerry Mez, the dealer from Avoca Iowa, and the owner of Farmall Land, maybe said it best,Short on finance, the top people didn't understand business they were in and they had to much inventory, for the order they had! My comment is it seemed like they had two types of engineers, the dumb ones and the good ones, Like the tractor's and plow guys they were the good one's but the guy that built or gave the ok, for those tiny 4 bolt hubs, and those tiny bearging's on the 18 1/2 foot vibrashank, i would of fired him the next day, they made their share of stupid stuff like i just mentioned.But on the other hand the 60/70 plow had 6 bolt wheels and a heavier axle, i have had 60 and 70 plows all me life never ruined one. But i did have one 30 foot Vibrashank, with the walking tandems under it, here at my farm, a expermental, or in development, about 3-4 guys from the factory spent a couple of hours with me riding in the tractor, talking etc ! Them were the good old days!
 
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