More 2+2 questions

In my area we never saw many 2+2 tractors. Only a few 20 years after they were new. I just assumed they came from auctions. Anyone know how many units were sold, and did they ever get "popular" in any one area?? Al

Can't answer those specific questions,but I know a over by Greenville who had two of them. He wanted to trade them in to Deere on a 8 series FWA. They finally got the deal made,but the dealer really didn't want them. I don't know if they came up on the price of the 2+2s or down on the Deere to get the deal done.

We had a few new ones in my area. We had a few strong IH dealers and our farms are a little bigger for row crop farming so they sold half way well. Biggest problem I saw was front axle housings breaking off under the weight of front mounted saddle tanks.

The hang up with the IH 2+2 is , many of the parts for the tractor are no longer available. And this really hurts their resale value. Two guys near me both had 2+2 tractors, the one fellas tractor could leak away 5 gallon of hydraulic fluid in a days work through the power steering system, and he could not buy the parts to fix his otherwise sound tractor. I believe the front wheel drive was the problem on the other guys tractor, and he could not get the parts he needed either. So the first guy ended up buying the second fellas tractor, to salvage the parts to fix his steering.

(quoted from post at 10:44:45 05/22/18) In my area we never saw many 2+2 tractors. Only a few 20 years after they were new. I just assumed they came from auctions. Anyone know how many units were sold, and did they ever get "popular" in any one area?? Al

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I really don't think so as far as popularity goes. No idea if some were shipped overseas or not be in the US and Canada about 11,500 were built over 5 or 6 years. When you consider that the 1086 had about the same number of years for a production run and they built about 42,500? And that was just one model of the 86 series tractor? The 11,500 is all models of the 2+2. LOL heck the 86 series tractors totaled close to 115,000 units.

Several things hurt IH with the 2X2. One MFWA was cheaper and was just starting to get popular. Another was timing. Just the wrong time to enter the market.

As far as popular in an area? Don't really know. When they started production I was stationed at Ft Riley KS. I drove to West MN often. States traveled in we KS, NE, IA, SD and MN. Never saw one in the field during those trips. Only place I saw em was o the dealers lots (yea I was on dealers lots, drove a Scout back then). Then I was assigned to Ft Bliss TX. So add TX (not just west TX) and OK to my travels. Later I was assigned to Ft Knox KY. States traveled were IN, IL, IA, WI and MN depending on the route traveled. Never saw any on those trips. In fact didn't start seeing them in fields till about 20 years ago, long after IH failed.

Rick

There were a few IH dealers around here in the 60's and 70's, so there was quite a lot of red paint in the area. I know of a few of the 2+2's. Like I said a couple days ago, our local BTO still uses his on the chisel plow - I think for his smaller fields
I was a kid when he bought it, and it created quite a stir. 75 - 80hp tractors were considered big at that time. Nobody had seen anything like a 2+2
Pete

They were popular in pockets around NY when they sold new back in the late 1970's. There were several wet falls back to back around that time so guys who could afford them bought them to chop corn as they could get through the field. What hurt 2 + 2 sales were the late 1970's was when Deutz and Same were making their push for the same small dairy customer and farmers were suffering price shock on new US built units. To go along with that the 2 + 2 tractors carried a rather high selling price versus the competition. We bought a 4 wheel drive tractor in 1979 and we could price an 8440 Deere cheaper about any place than we could a 3788. What ultimately happened for us is we found a very low houred 8430 which we have to this day. The 1970's grain boom brought about increased trade in's on the local market that included tractors such as the Case 2470 so farmers not wanting to spend on new had alternatives. Less than a couple years after the 2 + 2 came out the grain boom ended and Farm Credit started tightening down on loans including for a lot of dairy's. For 1983 John Deere came out with its 50 series row crops which included MFWD and JD credit was a little easier to get at the time so JD gained a lot of market that might have gone to IH. Also, at that time IH was starting to circle the drain with no savior obvious to the farm community so that made customers skittish as to buying IH products.

The big issue with the older 2+2s was that the engineers didnt really count on farmers weighting the tractor down, adding duels all around, and turning the pump up. The transmission (especially the front) was not designed to handle the strain. That is why it is best to leave the pump at factory specs and add just rear duels if needed. The farmers wanted the 2+2s to be a cheap Steiger and soon found out it was not and that is where the bad name came from "Junk tractor done blew up 'nother transmission! I only added bout 50 extra horses and weights! IH cheated me!"

If you wanted the big boy transmissions and more power you would have had to have been one of the few that go a Super 70 2+2 as they received bigger/beefed up transmissions same as the 5X88s (essentially magnum transmissions). By that time IH engineers had caught on to farmers mentality and built the 2+2 to match (and probably priced like a Steiger too). But it was too little too late as the company pooped out before very many Super 70s escaped the factory. Word is that they sent employees down the line of already built super 70s and had them cut a hole in the transmissions before scrapping them.

(quoted from post at 12:21:57 05/22/18) There were a few IH dealers around here in the 60's and 70's, so there was quite a lot of red paint in the area. I know of a few of the 2+2's. Like I said a couple days ago, our local BTO still uses his on the chisel plow - I think for his smaller fields
I was a kid when he bought it, and it created quite a stir. 75 - 80hp tractors were considered big at that time. Nobody had seen anything like a 2+2
Pete

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LOL when we first move to farm country one of the first neighbors we met wound up becoming my sisters father in law. He was one of the few big farms in the area. 1000 acres, 40 head of dairy, 50 head of breeding beef cows. I remember listening to him and other local farmers at one community event or another "anyone who buys a tractor over 100HP is just showing off"! That was around 72/73/74. I also remember looking at the new 2+2's on dealers lots both in Alexandria and Fergus Falls MN just a couple of years later. Most of our local guys must have listened because we sure didn't see anything here.

Rick

When were you at Ft Riley?

there were a few here in se mn my dads youngest brother had a 3588 he liked it . but he put duals all the way around and the rear end went bad. he had it fixed but died a few years later and his son traded it on a caseIH 175 the day the dealer came to pick it up the hyd pump went out. i was at the dealership a few days later and they said the rear end was bad and they sent it to salavage. i was kinda sad i drove that tractor for him it was nice . had the western interior to the tractor was spotless.

(quoted from post at 16:02:46 05/22/18) When were you at Ft Riley?

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Which time?

74-76, 78-80 and 93-96. Was my first assignment after AIT and I retired out of there.

Rick

For decades, IH had troubles with transmissions and rear ends. Every time I went to an IH dealer shop- that"s what they were working on. Simply too much engine for everything else, all the way back. They never learned.

I was stationed there in 82-83, then again 85-87. 1/63 Armor the first time. Rode North once with a guy who was from Northern Minnesota. He dropped me in Brookings SD.

There were 3 in my neighborhood that I know of. That's second only to JD. 4-wheel drives. 3 Whites, couple stiegers. No Allis, No Case. 1 Massey. 1 Versitile. But we had a pretty strong IH dealer here in No. Mankato, Mn.