How many of you fun KN air filters in your tractor haulers ( pickups) . Buddy of mine tells me how great they are and has wanted me to switch from regular filters for a long time. Well I bought a new pickup to me a 2011 Dodge with the Cummins and it has a KN air filter on it. I'm trying to decide should I leave it on or put the regular kind in it.
- Thread starter Mtractor
- Start date
grandpa Love
Well-known Member
Had one on a f150 for years. Easy to clean. Some extra power. I liked it. My son owns the truck now ,I bet he ain't cleaned the filter in 2 years. It's still going.
rdandersom
Member
I was given a cold air intake and adapted it to a S10 I was driving at the time. It made a different truck out of it. More power for sure and I believe it used a bit less fuel too. They are louder than stock intakes and don't preheat the air in winter but I have had them on my last 3 pickups.
I never understood why people fall for this stuff. If this stuff truly worked and made a difference the car companies would be putting them on as stock. KN could make a heck of a lot more money selling these in the millions to GM and Ford then they will ever make selling them as an aftermarket item. Every car company is in a race to be the one with best fuel economy and power. Why would they not buy them direct? This is a case where car companies would be happy to add $100 to a car price to get another couple mile per gallon.
Put them on every pickup truck I have owned for the past 25 years. Fuel savings alone has paid for them. Never had a problem with oil on mass air flow sensor or any other problem created by them. Run these pickups 200000 to 250000 thousand miles then give them to the boys to run out. 88 GMC has close to 500000 miles on it now.
Mike(NEOhio)
Well-known Member
- Location
- Newbury, Ohio
Put one in my F250 and our old Grand Cherokee. Seemed to run a little stronger but nothing noticeable in mileage. My thinking is that they were good back in carburetor days but with EFI there isn't much difference.
Billy Shafer
Well-known Member
Or until Ford finds out. You have one under warranty. My brother put one on his 150. Messed up the sensors which Ford said they would not cover under
warranty.
warranty.
One thing your not taking into consideration is how many stock filters will you use to one KN air filter. KN can be washed out and retreated and used a number of times till they need replacing. The stock air filter I use in my 97 GMC cost $59.00-$89.00 depending on how good of filter you want to use.
Even the very cheapest Briggs & Stratton lawn mower or Harbor freight Chinese $100 engine has gone from an oil wetted filter to a dry paper filter, that should tell you something. The auto and truck makers abandoned the oil wetted filters before WW2,more than 70 years ago, efficiency was that much less than an oil bath or dry paper filter.
Arvin Haslem
Member
Those washable air filters such as KN and others are CRAP. I saw too many engines dusted and destroyed and warranties voided because of them.
On a side note I saw what happened after some idiot cleaned one with starting fluid. It was in a Dodge Cummins. The engine revved up so high that the clutch and flywheel came apart. Pieces of the clutch and flywheel cut the bell housing in two and came up through the floor into the dash panel. The engine and transmission were both destroyed.
On a side note I saw what happened after some idiot cleaned one with starting fluid. It was in a Dodge Cummins. The engine revved up so high that the clutch and flywheel came apart. Pieces of the clutch and flywheel cut the bell housing in two and came up through the floor into the dash panel. The engine and transmission were both destroyed.
My 2 cents. They will give you more power as they flow more air than even a new paper filter. If you use these in a dusty environment you might be getting dust into the engine if not oiled properly. If oiled properly, you might run the chance of wiping out MAF sensors and such.
If not cleaned at proper intervals they will clog up real good and no air flow. Best dust free environment? Marine engine. If all your doing is highway driving and never into any dusty environment, then this just might work for you. Just remember, if your running with a MAF sensor or similar, you might have problems with sensors.
If not cleaned at proper intervals they will clog up real good and no air flow. Best dust free environment? Marine engine. If all your doing is highway driving and never into any dusty environment, then this just might work for you. Just remember, if your running with a MAF sensor or similar, you might have problems with sensors.
I doubt you see too many engineers or mechanics buying them. These things are just another form of snake oil. Everyone gets to decide how to spend their money. I spend mine in other ways. Just think if GM could raise the mileage of their cars by 10% by installing these. They would do it in a heart beat. Much easier to sell a car for a couple hundred more than a competitor if it gets 10% better fuel economy. Heck Ford spent millions to develop and buy tooling to build aluminum body trucks just to save weight and improve fuel economy buy just a few miles per gallon. Ford took a really hard path to better fuel economy and all they had to do was contact KN and make a deal. Remember the JC Whitney catalogue with all the great devices to add to your car to make it more powerful and get better fuel economy?
Brendon-KS
Well-known Member
- Location
- Goessel, KS
I tend to agree. When it comes to improving the performance or economy of vehicles there are no free lunches left because they all would have been found and implemented years ago. Every car company has hundreds of engineers that are continually working to optimize power, economy, longevity, reliability, cost, and emissions control in their engines. If something as simple as changing an air filter from paper to oiled cloth yields only gains and no negatives then every new vehicle would have one from the factory.
I just did a quick check. For my 2001 GMC pickup an aftermarket air filter runs about 1/3 the cost of a KN. I replace air filter about every 50,000 miles. Even at 50,000 miles the old air filters don't look too dirty. Just a little gray in color. So the payback point is 150,000 miles for a KN filter. I understand that you can save some money but not really all that much in the end. If you drive your car 300,000 miles you are only saving $100 or so. Seems like the risk of air flow sensor failure out weighs the saving.
I've heard many claims for years like "I think it has more power, or "much better mileage." All nonsense as far as I can tell. Try to find even one verifiable example of a controlled test on a stock engine - with OEM intake and then aftermarket intake. I bet you will not find results anywhere of a K&N gaining anything, except making your wallet lighter.
Auto engineers do a lot of research and are not going to install an air intake or exhaust that results in worse efficiency.
I did CFM and volumetic efficiency calculations on many of my rigs. 1985 Ford F250 with a 6.9 diesel, 1983 Chevy with a 6.2 diesel. 1978 Toyota truck with a 2.2 gas engine, 1994 Ford F250 with a turbo 7.3 diesel, and 1988 Toyota truck with a 2.4 gas engine. ALL have more CFM allowance in the intake and exhaust then the engine can use - stock from the factory. Most exceed need by 10-15% when engine is at max power.
Auto engineers do a lot of research and are not going to install an air intake or exhaust that results in worse efficiency.
I did CFM and volumetic efficiency calculations on many of my rigs. 1985 Ford F250 with a 6.9 diesel, 1983 Chevy with a 6.2 diesel. 1978 Toyota truck with a 2.2 gas engine, 1994 Ford F250 with a turbo 7.3 diesel, and 1988 Toyota truck with a 2.4 gas engine. ALL have more CFM allowance in the intake and exhaust then the engine can use - stock from the factory. Most exceed need by 10-15% when engine is at max power.
Brendon-KS
Well-known Member
- Location
- Goessel, KS
The placebo effect runs strong with things of this nature.
M-MAN
Well-known Member
- Location
- Bostic, NC
Way back in the early seventies we would pull the paper element out of the the filter housing so you could hear the back two barrels moan louder when they kicked in. Sounded sweet and you could hear a big block kick in a mile away but it was hard on the engines eating all that dust. We don't have all those dirt roads now a day's but there is still dust and it is still abrasive. The K & N lets in more dust with that freeer air flow and the hollow throttle body sound is nothing like a four barrel kicking in. I'll pass.
Around 69 or 1970, I had a very are 1963 Pontiac Tempest with a rear transaxle and a 326 V8 up front. I used to show off by taking the air-cleaner out and nailing it. Sounded pretty mean. One day, when getting ready to show off, I dropped the air-cleaner wing-nut down the carb. I figured I'd just nail the engine and spit that nut out the exhaust. NOPE. Blew the engine to pieces. I mean BLEW. Block and heads cracked and not repairable. Even then when that car was only 6-7 years old - I could not find another engine for it. That 326 V8 was had a special crankshaft to match up with the rear transaxle and a regular 326 or 389 would not fit. Boy, was I an idiot back then.
Don't know about today's engines, but the 90's-early 2000's diesels wouldn't gain much except a little more turbo noise. I remember seeing dyno tests where there were gains, but minimal. 1-2hp. That said, I've had one on my 01 dodge for 8+years now with 0 adverse effects. Some say the oil will mess up a mass air flow sensor, but don't know if it's true.
Simple answer guys, look it up! There are independent tests done to see how big of dust particles a filter will pass. And yes the KN filters have been tested. Now for the guy who is going to run a vehicle for a few years and trade it? No big deal either way. But for the guy who's going to drive one till the wheels fall off? Then it becomes important.
After reading the test results? I won't be running a KN filter.
And a couple of guys have it right. Ford, GM and FIAT all will buy a product that will A: deliver as promised and B: will not adversely effect engine life. If KN was a good as they claim all these companies would be installing them at the factory. It's the same with any of the snake oil products out there. If Lucas was so good a new car/truck would have it in the crankcase. You think Lucas would pass up the opportunity to sell that much product?
Rick
After reading the test results? I won't be running a KN filter.
And a couple of guys have it right. Ford, GM and FIAT all will buy a product that will A: deliver as promised and B: will not adversely effect engine life. If KN was a good as they claim all these companies would be installing them at the factory. It's the same with any of the snake oil products out there. If Lucas was so good a new car/truck would have it in the crankcase. You think Lucas would pass up the opportunity to sell that much product?
Rick
PaGlenn
Well-known Member
- Location
- New Milford Penna
Back in the sixties I bought this device that plugs into the coil before the coil wire. Said to save on gas. Didn't notice any difference in usage.
dr sportster
Well-known Member
As far as a performance thing I don't really think they add much power if any. The re-washable thing is the only good part. I have one on my Ducati only because mice ate paper filters they can't bite the K&N filter. That is the only reason for a forty dollar filter. A clogged K&N will flow way less than a paper filter clogged. You have to maintain and can't over oil them either. A better performance filter would be oiled foam style.
M-MAN
Well-known Member
- Location
- Bostic, NC
I remember those too! A friends Mom had one that he got to drive to school sometimes. We're both old! lol
Although I've cussed car engineers for 40 years I never considered myself smarter than an engineer, if KN filters were the real deal, they'd be standard equipment. And I have replaced a couple of mass airflow sensors behind KN filters, think there was even a GM service bulletin about them.
If you go to K&N's web site. Check the cold air filters. Read the fine print. They tell ya to get a "performance tune" for best results. All of the data they give is with a performance tune on the car/truck. I almost bought one for my Mustang. But the Mustang come's with a cold a filter. They say the Mustang would run better with their filter, again, along with the performance tune. So! why not just do the performance tune ?
Lots of problems with maf sensors.... via the vw forums and the dodge forums....
After having to replace a couple of maf's, I went back to regular filters. Some times I could clean the maf with alcohol and get it out of limp mode... sometimes not... So I can vouch for NOT using them.
If you have tractors with NO emissions, then I dont see a problem.
Any modern diesel or gas engine will have a mass air flow sensor in the air intake that has a hot element in it, and the oil vapor over time will coat the sensor and render is useless, putting the engine in limp mode if your luckey. those who clean their filters more often, and re-oil them will have problems much sooner than those who dont.
Similar threads
We sell tractor parts! We have the parts you need to repair your tractor - the right parts. Our low prices and years of research make us your best choice when you need parts. Shop Online Today.
Copyright © 1997-2024 Yesterday's Tractor Co.
All Rights Reserved. Reproduction of any part of this website, including design and content, without written permission is strictly prohibited. Trade Marks and Trade Names contained and used in this Website are those of others, and are used in this Website in a descriptive sense to refer to the products of others. Use of this Web site constitutes acceptance of our User Agreement and Privacy Policy TRADEMARK DISCLAIMER: Tradenames and Trademarks referred to within Yesterday's Tractor Co. products and within the Yesterday's Tractor Co. websites are the property of their respective trademark holders. None of these trademark holders are affiliated with Yesterday's Tractor Co., our products, or our website nor are we sponsored by them. John Deere and its logos are the registered trademarks of the John Deere Corporation. Agco, Agco Allis, White, Massey Ferguson and their logos are the registered trademarks of AGCO Corporation. Case, Case-IH, Farmall, International Harvester, New Holland and their logos are registered trademarks of CNH Global N.V.
Yesterday's Tractors - Antique Tractor Headquarters
Website Accessibility Policy