Might sound like a dumb question but here goes. Our old Kubota had the cable type tach and hour meter. At 15 years old it still had only 6000 hours on it. The new Holland we replaced it with has the same as they pretty much all do now the electronic type where forgetting the key on will rack up the hours. In only 6 months we've put 450 hours on it on top of the 750 that was on it when we bought it. I'm guessing at least 1/4 of those were put on while I was taking net off bales filling feed buckets opening and shutting doors. Does it make sense to shut off and restart pretty much every time you get off to do a minute job before using it just to keep the hours down? I think doing that would wear the starter out 10x faster and the ring gear on the fly wheel but with that math if we had it 10 years there'll be 9000 hours added on it and will drastically reduce the value even though 1500-3000 of those or more were simply just idling hours and not working. Any suggestions?
- Thread starter Philip d
- Start date
If you are using the tractor in the same way you used the Kubota than the issue is not really about tractor wear and tear. The issue is the two methods of tracking hours are not the same. So if you know that 750 hours with an electric hour meter is equivalent to 500 hours with an old style mechanical tachometer then just change how you think about hours on a tractor. Sort of like metric and English measurements.
The key left on was a big thing around my place. My son was cutting the grass before we went on vacation a few years back and when he parked it, the key "mysteriously " got left turned on. After over a three week holiday I went to start it and had almost 600 new hours on it. Takes a chunk out of the resale value for sure. If the tractor is going to be idle more than a few minutes not doing any work, i generally shut them down to avoid hour meter being run up. My logic may be flawed, but why run up hours and spend money on fuel to do it, spending money to lose money on resale doesn't make sense to me. As of this point in time, I haven't had any issues arise from starters to batteries etc caused by my practice.
Bob Bancroft
Well-known Member
- Location
- Aurora NY
I don't know about your application, but, many hour meters are wired through the alternator, or an oil pressure switch, so they really only count running time, not just key on time. Are you sure yours adds up hours if the key is left on? If so, it could be altered. I prefer the electrical ones, as you get a more accurate time than with the old mechanical ones.
ptfarmer
Well-known Member
- Location
- San Antonio, Tx
If you can find the wire that supplies power from the key on position to the hour meter, you could put a oil pressure switch in the circuit to cut the power off to the hour meter when the engine is off.
I have an older utility vehicle with that exact problem. It stalled in the barn and I didn't shut the key off, my 30 some hours actual turned into 240+ by the time I got back to it and noticed. I agree this can be an issue for a potential buyer who doesn't understand or believe what happened and sees high hours and discounts the value because of that.
The older mechanical ones I like because they are hours at... meaning they tell you the hours at a set rpm. In reality its a long range RPM meter, but hours are easier to understand. Still, the work done is a more valuable tool for gauging value and service. I know todays trucks have hour meters and they only rack up when the motor is running. Key on would defeat the whole purpose. I know I really don't look at hours when buying an older machine, but rather how well its been cared for and how well it runs. I certainly would rather leave a machine running at idle for short stops than to stop and start, more for the cooling than for any concerns about the start motor. I'd rather let the water pump circulate than just depend on thermosiphon after a hard job was done.
Welding man
Well-known Member
- Location
- West Virginia
If it is a computer tractor, the hours can be accessed by the dealer by simply hooking up his laptop computer. The computer will tell you hours, if it has been over heated, over revved and even the gallons of fuel it has burned on some of them.On the trucks we work one we can tell the miles driven, hours on the engine and lots of little hidden info.
leroy in ne
Well-known Member
- Location
- Sterling, Nebraska
why? if the engine has no oil pressure the engine is not running so the switch is off and no power to hour meter
ptfarmer
Well-known Member
- Location
- San Antonio, Tx
They seem do to anything they can lower re-sale, or trade in price. In some of the older equipment without a computer, and electronic hour meter you can usually remove the fuse for it if it has one, or wire it to work off a oil pressure switch.
Thank you all for the insight. I don't want to tamper with the wiring to hide hours but if it's still in good condition when time comes to move it extra hours won't be a huge deal but at the same time if I know for sure I'll be more than a couple minutes off the seat I'll shut er down.i guess that way off thinking is partly why the newer tractors can have 5-600 hr oil change intervals compared to 250 recommended years ago.
I bought a new NH T4050 Deluxe in 2008.
It was back to the dealer a couple of times for warranty issues.
It didn't work out for me after my plans changed so I sold four years later with around 50 hours on it.
About half of those hours were put on at the dealer when they left the key on for about 24 hours. The radio was blaring and the cab doors were open when I checked on it in the shop. Turns out that the shop guys were listening to tunes and forgot to turn the ignition off when they went home. I was not happy.
Dean
It was back to the dealer a couple of times for warranty issues.
It didn't work out for me after my plans changed so I sold four years later with around 50 hours on it.
About half of those hours were put on at the dealer when they left the key on for about 24 hours. The radio was blaring and the cab doors were open when I checked on it in the shop. Turns out that the shop guys were listening to tunes and forgot to turn the ignition off when they went home. I was not happy.
Dean
2 edged sword there. Discharging a battery and not fully recharging reduces the battery life. Take about 10-15 minutes to fully recharge a battery after each start at about 1000-1500 RPMs. I've helped a friend feed in the winter when he was sick a couple of times. Between gates and such I'd have to shut down and restart about 6 or 10 times for morning feeding and another 4 or 5 in the evening. And would never once run the tractor long enough or fast enough to fully recharge the batteries. Plus that's a lot of wear and tear on the starter and ring gear. You'd have to sit down and see if it would pencil out, added trade value VS extra cost for maintenance.
Rick
When electric hour meters replaced the mechanical hour meters the livestock guys hours when up around 40%. Guys that idled their tractor a lot doubled the hours.
For wear an tear, stopping and starting the tractor is the hardest thing you can do to it. The few seconds it runs before you have oil pressure is where a lot of the crankshaft bearing wear comes from. The incomplete combustion from a cold motor is where the majority of the carbon comes from. Then you add in the cost of keeping the starter electrical system up to snuff when doing short starts you will negate any thing gained by the shorter hours.
I buy a tractor to use. I know that the resale will be fine as long as I keep the tractor maintained well.
For wear an tear, stopping and starting the tractor is the hardest thing you can do to it. The few seconds it runs before you have oil pressure is where a lot of the crankshaft bearing wear comes from. The incomplete combustion from a cold motor is where the majority of the carbon comes from. Then you add in the cost of keeping the starter electrical system up to snuff when doing short starts you will negate any thing gained by the shorter hours.
I buy a tractor to use. I know that the resale will be fine as long as I keep the tractor maintained well.
BarnyardEngineering
Well-known Member
- Location
- Rochester, NY
You can easily tell if a tractor has had 9000 hours being rode hard and put away wet, or if the tractor has had 9000 hours of light chore duty.
Make sure that the clock actually ticks up hours with just the key on. I know for sure that as early as the mid 1990's the 52XX Maxxums didn't clock hours unless the engine was running. I find it hard to believe anything made in the last 20 years doesn't have that simple bit of logic in it.
Make sure that the clock actually ticks up hours with just the key on. I know for sure that as early as the mid 1990's the 52XX Maxxums didn't clock hours unless the engine was running. I find it hard to believe anything made in the last 20 years doesn't have that simple bit of logic in it.
I agree. You buy a tractor to use so use it in the way that makes it last longest for you. I don't know why people worry about resale value so much. I buy stuff to use not resell. I buy a car to use for the long haul. When I am done with a car it is only worth $500 bucks so trade in value or resale value means nothing to me.
Bruce from Can.
Well-known Member
- Location
- Woodville, Ontario, Canada
As others have said , I too buy a tractor to use, and whatever the hour meter reads means little. I think near all the tractors under 20 years old have electric hour meters, and the higher hours recorded on the meter are understood to be just " on time" and not tractor running at 540 pro speed. Just don't mean what it used to
True, BY.
After experimenting with the headlamps, hazard flashers, turn signals, etc., I neglected to turn the key off on my new Kubota M9960. It was on for 10 days or so, enough time to completely discharge the battery. No time was added to the electronic hour meter.
Dean
After experimenting with the headlamps, hazard flashers, turn signals, etc., I neglected to turn the key off on my new Kubota M9960. It was on for 10 days or so, enough time to completely discharge the battery. No time was added to the electronic hour meter.
Dean
ptfarmer
Well-known Member
- Location
- San Antonio, Tx
I would have gave them a bill for 24 hours of shop labor for using the radio in the tractor.
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