My take on Veterans Day

Now that Veterans Day is over allow me to comment on the subject.
It may sound a little cynical and I really do not mean to step on any toes; but someone said this same thing on the talk radio yesterday and it got me to thinking.

First off Veterans Day is NOT Memorial Day.
So why they laid a wreath at the tomb of the unknown soldier yesterday is beyond me.
Memorial Day is a totally different subject from Veterans Day in my mind.

Yes there are those that bask in the lime light of Veterans Day.
You hear or see all year long about their service or even their disability from service.
They have license plates or stickers to show it off.
For me you would be hard pressed to know I am a disable vet as I do not talk about it.

I guess you may have to be a vet yourself to understand but I did what I did because it is what I wanted to do.
Your thanks or pat on the back is not needed as I did not do it for your thanks and would do it again if you thanked me or not.
As long as you refrain from spitting in my face we are good.
So go ahead and paint your trucks and trailers. Fly your flag; sing your song; or do what ever makes you happy.
But realize it is all smoke and mirrors to me.

If you really want to support or thank a vet pick up a gun and stand a post along side him.
Tell your child who you raised and nurtured for 18 years goodbye; maybe for the last time; as you watch them board a plane for who knows where.
Because until you have done these things you really have no room to comment on the subject.

John in La
USAF
Honorable discharge under medical conditions

Nailed it!

Thanks John, I completely agree.

Larry

I 100% agree. I have always felt this way. I enlisted because I wanted to, no one made me and no one needs to call me a hero because I'm not, I did my job. Keith

I don't go to veterans day events. No one wanted to see me when I came home from nam. So they don't need to see me now. Not going to be the monkey on the stage. For all to stare at.

I still remember the debriefing My group went through at TI.
Don't wear your uniform.
Don't tell anyone where you have been.
Don't let anyone know you are military.
Leave here go straight to the plane. Keep your mouth shut.
You are sneaking back into your own country.

No one was at the airport. When my two high school buddies. Came home in coffins

For got to add. I joined because I wanted to. But I expected to be shown some respect when I came home. I also expected to get the healthcare I was promised if injured in combat. But I guess that was to much to expect

I did not join I was drafted and had I not been drafted I probably would not have went into the Army. I went in with an open mind willing to learn what I could and be a service to my country if needed. After I went thru basic and AIT I enjoyed being in. Sure there were bad times but I had it easy compared to many In basic when we got to pick what field we wanted to go into I enlisted for an additional year with the thought if I had to be there I was going to learn something I could use the rest of my life, a decision that I have never regretted. I came home after 3 years and missed the new life so I joined the Army Reserve where I was in a heavy truck company. I have traveled all over the US thanks to uncle sam and after a total of 21 years I left. I was proud to have been able to serve. I use to go to the doings just to honer my father's WW 2 service but I have never went to anything for a free meal or whatever on Vet's day. I don't feel I have done anything different than anyone else would

I can understand how you feel. A "thank you" would mean more coming from someone who had also served, but would be unnecessary.

I enlisted in the navy in 1967. I wanted some choice as to what I would be doing and wanted to learn something. I enlisted because I would have been drafted. But I knew it was the right thing to do. I knew that unless we drew the line somewhere we would be taken over by the communists at some point. They were pushing then as they are now. Later I was against the war, but only because we were not committed to a win, we were just half fighting it. But because of the anti war, anti military feeling in this country it took me a good many years to start to really feel good about my contribution to keep us free. Now I feel proud I did my part.

For a long time I have felt that EVERYONE should do at least 2 years of service upon completing high school or college. It would give us a trained reserve force, allow young folks to mature some- possibly saving a little money to get a start in life with. If a person decided to go for 4 years then they would get the benefits veterans get now, two years of service would get benefits only if injured while serving.

I also agree John. Like I said in my post--I went in, did my time, got out and that was it. I still fly the flag every day and belong to the American Legion though. It still sends a chill up my spine when I attend a fellow Legionnaires funeral and we fire our rifle salute and the bugler plays TAPS-the saddest tune in the world. As I was reading your post the TV had on about the big veterans day sale was still on at the mega furniture store and don't forget vets-you get 10% off. The local school has a veterans day program every year. I went once 25 years ago and have not been back. But like I said in my post-when my 11 year old grandson walked in and saluted me and said "Thanks for your service Grandpa" it made me feel good - I think his Dad put him up to it. I went in the USN in 68-at the height of the Asian war. It was before they had a lottery for the draft and my age group was coming to the front fast-so I enlisted. So I am no hero. I do not agree with you about the smoke and mirrors though-I just hope there are enough vets left around here to fold and present the Flag to my widow at my funeral.----Tee

I joined the Navy in Sept 1968. Went to the lakes saw my first snow there. Real shock to a farm boy from North Texas.All we ever saw was ice.

John, I've talked with several veterans who feel the same way you do about Veterans Day and Memorial Day as well. The one thing I will agree with is the two days ought not be mixed. I'm not a veteran myself, but was ready to go if my Uncle needed me. When I stood at the graveside of my Dad who was being buried at Camp Butler,(Springfield. I'll.), my nephew who was also Marine, I think still on active duty, stood in full dress, at attention, when the bugler was playing taps, almost quivering, because he wanted to cry but couldn't, It was a moment in time that only deepened the admiration and honor I have for those that have served. Can we have too much hoopla and carrying on? Possibly, too many thank yous? I think not.

Veterans need the work together with the Legion or other vets organizations to work together. Maybe we can stick a cattle prod into the Veterans administration and git it working.

Myself and my two brothers served with honorable discharges.
My oldest brother was drafted and went to Vietnam.
My other brother and myself joined the Air Force.
The trades we learned in service gave us skills for our civilian jobs.
We never talk about our service, even among our self's.
Neighbor kid thanked me for my service yesterday and I was kind of taken back.
I always felt my service was just a choice and it paid off for me.

John,

I pretty much agree with you. I enlisted in the Navy in 1962 when I was 17 years old and still a Senior in High School. I left for San Diego about a week after I graduated High School. I did it because I wanted to, not for fear of a draft or at the urging of anyone else. I had no idea what the Navy was going to do with me, but I wanted to be a part of it.

As it turned out, the Navy put me through electronics schools for just barely short of one year, and then deployed me to land bases where I worked on electronic stuff. I was never within a thousand miles of anyone who was shooting at anyone. I never go to veterans affairs, and I certainly never go for free stuff that many companies offer to veterans.

I OWE the Navy for a lifetime career and unlimited opportunities. I greatly admire the men who participated in combat, but I don't have any desire to take away from them any of the respect or gratitude that they deserve.

Tom in TN

I was in from December of '67 to '73- just about the whole length of the conflict. The Navy taught me a lot of stuff, and over the year much of it has been useful.

But, I have also been called a 'baby killer' and spit on at airports, especially toward the end of my hitch. I even lost a girl that I really liked when she went off to college in Ohio and started joining protests.

For some thirty years, noone gave a rat's patoot about vets, but now these folks come up with 'thanks for serving' like they'd tip the waitress, but no real meat in their meaning. I just don't care to be patronized.

My wife has looked in horror at me when I have snatched a hat off of some fool's head at the ballgame during the anthem. And I still salute the flag on many occasions and even the A-10 that flys over every day. And I would not change anything of how I grew up. Dad was in North Africa and Northern Europe. My brother served in Korea. His son did two tours in Iraq as a Marine. None of us have ever needed to be thanked- Just appreciated for what we have done.

It was our job at the time, because we loved our country and would defend it then- as today- with our lives.

I know an old 98 year old WW2 vet who climbed to a fairly high rank but left the war so disenchanted he didn't want the honor guard at his funeral. He told his family when he dies he does not want notoriety, just bury him quietly. During the war he trained a group of young men, getting to know them during the process. After they were trained, the young men were sent off on a mission he knew they never would return from and he was right, they didn't make it home alive. This made him bitter and he is still bitter to this day. He had nightmares for years. However, he is still very patriotic and when 9-11 happened he was so mad at those 'rag heads' he was ready seriously to re-enlist at 80+ years old because he himself had been ambushed and left for dead in north Africa. After 9-11 his nightmares came back again, showing how strong his feelings are about war. He is a very true hero in my mind.

(quoted from post at 04:56:16 11/12/16) Now that Veterans Day is over allow me to comment on the subject.
It may sound a little cynical and I really do not mean to step on any toes; but someone said this same thing on the talk radio yesterday and it got me to thinking.

First off Veterans Day is NOT Memorial Day.
So why they laid a wreath at the tomb of the unknown soldier yesterday is beyond me.
Memorial Day is a totally different subject from Veterans Day in my mind.

Yes there are those that bask in the lime light of Veterans Day.
You hear or see all year long about their service or even their disability from service.
They have license plates or stickers to show it off.
For me you would be hard pressed to know I am a disable vet as I do not talk about it.

I guess you may have to be a vet yourself to understand but I did what I did because it is what I wanted to do.
Your thanks or pat on the back is not needed as I did not do it for your thanks and would do it again if you thanked me or not.
As long as you refrain from spitting in my face we are good.
So go ahead and paint your trucks and trailers. Fly your flag; sing your song; or do what ever makes you happy.
But realize it is all smoke and mirrors to me.

If you really want to support or thank a vet pick up a gun and stand a post along side him.
Tell your child who you raised and nurtured for 18 years goodbye; maybe for the last time; as you watch them board a plane for who knows where.
Because until you have done these things you really have no room to comment on the subject.

John in La
USAF
Honorable discharge under medical conditions

Click to expand...

I'm proud of my service. I do wear an Army ball cap. But someone saying thank you? Don't really need it. And yea, I've put more than one kid on a plane in uniform too and I'm darn proud of em. I did attend a program yesterday but only because a 9yo granddaughter begged me too. I really wanted to stay home. She was extremely excited that I was there. Made it worth going. Other than that I'd have stayed home!

Rick

It is hard. I do not wish to be rude, so I often say nothing to the people providing thanks, but often, it seems almost like an apology more than a thanks. Almost as though, as in Henry V's St. Crispin Day speech, they hold their live cheap who were not there.

Furthermore, I am a little disgusted by what me and some of my fellow Marines refer to as, Professional veterans."
Caution on content for this one:
http://www.duffelblog.com/2014/07/professional-veteran-takes-pride-new-career/

Same for me. I seldom where anything denoting service. I do have a very small Eagle, Globe, and Anchor on my trucks. It was my
young homeschooler who wanted to attend. It is for her I go, and like yours, she enjoys it tremendously. She has a good sense of
history and what was sacrificed. While they handed out flags, candy, and stickers at the parade, her favored souvenir was a copy
of the U.S. Constitution that was handed out by a vet at his own expense. That she knows from what play, the band of brothers
speech is from and its meaning. That is rewarding to me.

I find it interesting that you can use a machine to build a machine better than that machine. It has occurred to me that a person
can help make a person, or country better than themselves. That is what us vets have done and that is what we are silently most
pleased about.

I was an infantry Marine. Don't sell yourself short. Without support from people like you, there is no way we could have done our job. The people that feed us, provide ammo, transport, heck, even our paycheck, as most of us would not been there without some funds to make it happen. Think about it, who contributed more to the war effort, the individual soldier at Normandy or the designer of the Norden Bomb Sight? Who did more, the trigger puller or the weapon designer? I had a great uncle who developed a machine gun lubricant. What about the engineers that made more effective weapons, planes, ships? In many ways, they are more responsible for the infantryman's success. Many, if not most of the people I cite are not even considered veterans, yet none of it can happen without them. I hesitate to thank a vet because I know the funny feeling it gives me when I receive it, but I am inclined to thank the folks that did so much to supply us and arm us. I am fascinated by the whole process of it. What you did was meaningful and appreciated by the guys in the field.

I joined the Air Force when I was 25, it was my choice, I was a volunteer and I joined as an officer candidate so it's not like I faced much hardship. You don't need to thank me for my service as my service was my choice. I had some good assignments and I served in a hell hole or two. I still feel the Air Force did far more for me than I was able to do for it. If you want to honor or thank me that's okay but I would rather you put that time in effort into holding our elected officials responsible for three things 1- honor the commitments the government made when I, and anyone else joined, this means fix the VA and remove the politics from it, hold VA employees accountable for their decisions and following the rule of law and make sure they're removed from the VA if their actions are unlawful or aren't in the best interest of the veteran. 2-Don't use the military as a political instrument, if you give us an assignment make it clear and concise and don't tie our hands by limiting our options while in the field, or to put it another way give us an objective and your support and turn us loose. 3- Aggressively pursue action against military officers and commands that serve them selves and not the mission and the troops serving under them. if a senior officer plays hard and fast with the rules so they look good that officer needs to be removed from service. One of the major concepts that are drilled into officer candidates is professionalism, and that means it's about the mission and your troops and not about you. Our enlisted and junior officer corp deserves leadership that is professional and committed to them and the missions they're tasked with and we shouldn't be used merely as tools or pawns to get the commander another promotion.

Now I'll get down off my soapbox, yes I took my wife out to dinner last night and we went to Applebee's and yes they had a promotion where I ate free (choices from a limited menu) and to top it off they came by and gave me a $5.00 gift card. What I found interesting is their food was significantly better than the last time I was there and maybe we'll start eating there more often. Did they have to do this -NO do I feel entitled, or that they owe this to me- NO. But it was nice that a major restaurant chain like Applebee's would do something like this and the staff at the restaurant last night acted like they were genuinely glad to serve us. That might make some people understand that freedom isn't free and many give some or all to preserve our freedom.

Some people feel that they are as patriotic as anyone else can be, But I think it is a lot deeper in the people who have served this country. Unfortunately, it is not a point that can be proven, and so we have have to let them talk about how strongly they feel about it.
Wed. night I gave a guy a ride home from a gas station. He had hurried to the station to get a twelve pack before the 9:00 dead line. He asked for the ride and laid the I AM A VET on me. Well, so am I, but, I, like many others, I do not use it as a crutch. I feel like he used me, but, to each his own way in life.
SDE

I was very fortunate never to have seen combat. That's just how it worked out for me. I enlisted because I wanted to, felt that I needed to, did my time and ETS'd in January 1986. That being said, I saved up most of my leave and took an early out in November 1985. They called it terminal leave as I recall. I've told this story here before and will again because I feel as though it's fitting.

I got home a night or two before Thanksgiving 1985. My family knew that I was coming home, but not when exactly because I wanted to surprise them. I flew into O'Hare and caught a bus to Elkhart, IN. I walked over to a payphone and started calling around to my family members, but no one answered. I surprised them by not telling them exactly when I would be home, and they surprised me by not being home when I got there. I picked up my duffle bag and started home, and it was snowing pretty good too. I saw a restaurant, Gubi's along the way that wasn't there when I left home years before, so I ducked in the side door. I left my duffle bag outside against the wall, walked in and stood there in my dress greens and overcoat and jump boots looking around the place to take it in, and to see if I would be welcome. I had just gotten home from Germany and while I was in Germany, I was hearing stories that soldiers, GI's back home weren't so accepted anymore, and actually unwelcome. I'm now home, walk into some strange restaurant and wasn't sure if I was going to be attacked or what. So I'm standing just inside the door looking around, people are looking at me and I wasn't looking for trouble. I just ducked in to get out of the snow and try to call my family again if they had a pay phone. Next thing I know, some old fella walks up to me, reaches out his hand to shake mine, says "Welcome home" and thanked me. Just like that, "Thanks and welcome home". Then he walked over to his table, picked up his flatware and continued eating. His wife looked at me, gave me a smile and a wink, picked up her flatware and continued eating. OK, I walked up to the bar and looked around. The owner, Craig Gubi welcomed me and had one of the bartenders get me a beer on the house. We talked, I told them what had happened, and one of the bartenders hands me the phone receiver from behind the bar and starts dialing numbers for me. I got someone at my mother's house. Turns out everyone, all of my family members where there getting ready for Thanksgiving the next day or so. "Mark, where are you at?" they took turns asking as each picked up the phone. I didn't tell them, only that I'd be home soon. I finished my beer, Craig had one of the bartenders drive me and my duffle bag home and I had one of the best Thanksgivings ever.

Lesson learned? To this day, I see an American uniform and I don't care who, I stop what I'm doing and return the favor..."Thank you so very much", sincerely. A lesson that I earned from an elderly couple when I was much younger and unsure of myself. I don't need Veterans Day either, but it's nice that it's there.

I thank everyone that has served and will. Some get lucky like me, and some don't. OUR country is lucky, and blessed.

Mark

"...One of the bravest men that I ever saw was a fellow on top of a telegraph pole in the midst of a furious fire fight in Tunisia. I stopped and asked what the hell he was doing up there at a time like that. He answered, "Fixing the wire, Sir". I asked, "Isn't that a little unhealthy right about now?" He answered, "Yes Sir, but the Goddamned wire has to be fixed". I asked, "Don't those planes strafing the road bother you?" And he answered, "No, Sir, but you sure as hell do!" Now, there was a real man..." - George Patton addressing the troops before Operation Overlord

Mark
Gen. Pattons speech Operation Overlord

Thanks for that. That was great. We were just talking about the decoders that worked at Bletchly Park. They could not talk about what they did, not even to each other, and they were never sure how much good they were doing, but like the communications soldier in your example, extremely important. I began to think, would I want another rifleman or even a whole other company in a fight or to have the knowledge of what was out there or coming at me? The answer is clear. There are so many who are never in the fight that are irreplaceable in the overall picture.

Right on.

My ten years in the Corps were a job I took on voluntarily. I did my job, and from all indications I did it well, but when I left the Corps I moved on with my life.

Truth be told, I was awarded a medal called the "Badge of Honor" by the Nationalist Chinese government on Taiwan, among other awards, but my life hasn't been consumed with seeking accolades for my service.

I did go to a Veteran's Day service at our church yesterday morning, put on by the school students, but I went more for the kids than for myself. And I picked up a free meal at Perkins last evening.

Don't thank me the government thanks me every two weeks with a paycheck. { That's what the drill instructors would tell you to say .]

Some folks are like peacocks and need to wear hats and strut around. Others.. like to do their job and do not want attention or reward. Some... were dumber than rocks.

But... For those who served, we are in a brotherhood forever.. with and without the peacocks and Nose-pickers. I personally never understood the ones in the hats.. but that's just me.

Well put and something we seldom think about, all the support and effort all the way up the line, all the equipment and supplies, all the work involved by many, who as you have said are seldom given credit.

Pretty much agree with you on this. It's nice to have a day of honor for those who served. Some take advantage of this, but most veterans are appreciative of having a free country to live in. We do know that freedom costs something. Each veteran is a part of that freedom. Both of my grandfathers served in WWI. They did not speak much of it and both were in combat in Europe. I have a Broomhandle Mauser that one came back with....never did get the story of that one. I have the bayonet my other grandfather used. Treasures. I got to meet many real heroes of WWI and WWII while in the service ( for medical treatment they needed).

Gary Wilson
U.S. Navy '75-'79 Medic.

The hat thing makes me laugh! Yea I wear a US Army cap. I like wearing a cap. I will wear a cap. But I will not pay to wear a cap doing free advertising for JD, CaseIH or any other company that I have to pay for! Really? I have to pay to advertise for you? I've never gotten a free cap in my life! You want me to advertise for you by wearing one with your company logo on it give it to me! So seeing as I buy my caps I'll wear an Army one! Heck most of the time people walk by and don't even acknowledge that you may have served. So no big deal! But on the other hand I've had a fair number of kids interesting in joining who did stop me, ask if I served and then talked to me about the possibility of them joining up!

Just my take on it. I don't ask for discounts, freebees or help because I served. If offered I do take the discounts most often but I'm not going to go in a ask or beg for one. I have a friend who does that. I don't go to town with him because of that. Drives me up the wall! Heck I don't even go in for the free meal deals on Veterans day.

Rick

I'm with oldtanker.
I'll wear my ships ballcaps before I'll pay to wear someones logo.
I like searching out other guys with navy caps and saying hello to a shipmate. Learn some neat things talking to old salts.
I am proud of being in the Navy. I married a girl who was in, and both of our fathers were in.
I have had folks say thanks for my service and I tell them thanks for their support.
I wasn't in during Nam so I did feel "supported". I can't imagine sneaking back into your own country. When I was in we worried about wearing our uniforms in some mideastern ports not our home port....

Just read through the posts. I was drafted in Dec. 67, didn't object, just went along with the program, did extend my time for some different training. I got to see parts of Germany, Greece, Vietnam, Thailand and Australia plus several bases in different states, most were places I never would have seen otherwise. When I came back from Vietnam after 18 months and was discharged I didn't feel at home, was ready to go back, took a long time to adjust. I don't remember people thanking us but I didn't care either way, just did what I was told at the time. Found the American Legion where I grew up was just a bar, much like other clubs. My first "welcome home" came from another Vietnam Vet who is my neighbor when I moved here 11 years ago. We have a Disabled American Veteran chapter near here, I have met many of them, sadly some of them use it as a way to keep increasing their disability rating to get a bigger check. One of them is a woman who enlisted in the mid seventies, never left the states, claimed PTSD and has been working that until she bragged to me a while ago that she is now 100% and will be paid $49,000. a year and offered to help me do the same, no thanks. I figure that we signed up, voluntarily or not, and should receive what we were promised, and gaming the system for profit shouldn't be tolerated. I have noticed a lack of respect at the VA, perhaps if they were required to serve they might treat us better. I read that the VA is demanding that the California National Guard soldiers that were sent into harms way a decade ago must repay the money that was paid them because some people in charge were not supposed to offer it. If I were still a young person looking at service to this country with the record of mistreatment to veterans I would not join.

Free meals, discounts, other offered benefits are nice, thanks to all that offer them but I haven't gone out of my way to collect.

You all be careful and stay safe.