Married2Allis
Well-known Member
Haven't been paying real close attention but I noticed that Walmart has a 5qt Pennzoil for 13.97. Good time to stock up?
- Thread starter Married2Allis
- Start date
brutus49DC
Member
I guess if you want your engine full of sludge. Ever see an engine with the valve covers off that has been run penzoil, what a mess.
I am running Rual King oil that is a lot less and friend that is a mechanic also uses that Rual King oil and this past year was paying quite a bit under $2.00 quart. Think it was $1.69 that I paid. And as to that comment about Penzoil and crud, others say Quaker state is like that and I knew anouther mechanic years back that said Quaker State is the ONLY oil that did not make that sludge, it is all he would use. So what works for one is not working for a different person and vice versa.
Michael Soldan
Well-known Member
I'm interested in your comment Brutus. Modern oil blends are "detergent " oils that remove all the components that create sludge. I'm wondering why you feel Pennzoil products are inferior ? I pulled a pan on a tractor I bought and there was 2" of black cheese in the bottom, this was because the previous owner did not change oil on a regular bases. I usually buy Quaker State but I have on occasion used Pennzoil. I haven't noticed any difference,the used oil drains black, the filter is heavier than the new one so I'm thinking it works fine, I haven't had the pan off,but have had valve covers off, looks normal to me.
For many years Pennsylvania oil was supposedly high paraffin and some would not use it. However, I used Castrol for all those years and did good. I switched to the new synthetic as soon as it came out and ran it for at least 8000 miles between changes. Now I use Mobil 1 15000 oil and no problems ever caused by oil in any vehicle, motorcycle or boat I owned. It is my belief that most oils are pretty much the same except the synthetics which are compounded differently. Same with gasoline. I worked for a Texaco distributor for a few years and they bought gas from different depots depending on price. That was the controlling factor. Every morning they would call every depot for prices and then send their takers to get the cheapest. I'll bet oil is the same deal.
My experience is that Quaker State is the crap one.Pulled the valve covers on a hemi C-altered to check valves between run and they were full of some kind of mush.Wasn't oil any more.Dad bought a little '79 Cutlass,put a cardboard quart of pennzoil
and a church key in a coffee can in the trunk. It was still there when I scrapped the car couple years ago(got so rusty the bumpers and doors were falling off)Never had anything but PZ10/30
and a church key in a coffee can in the trunk. It was still there when I scrapped the car couple years ago(got so rusty the bumpers and doors were falling off)Never had anything but PZ10/30
BushogPapa
Well-known Member
Ha!!
My brothers '68 camaro ==Quaker State always changed at 2,000 mi..
At 65,000, he came driving into our drive with that 327 sounding like the pistons were swapping holes..
I tore it down and found NO worn parts..ONLY Varnish hanging up the Valve Lifters and SLUDGE up t5o the top of the Valve Springs..
Lifters were so tight I used a 20 oz hammer to drive them out..
NEVER used it since..
MarkB_MI
Well-known Member
- Location
- Motown USA
I just bought a gallon of Rotella T6 "full synthetic" 5W-40 at O'Reilly on sale for 18 bucks. At $2.50/qt for synthetic it makes no sense to buy dino oil.
1948CaseVAI
Well-known Member
That is why the phrase "ABP" was common when I was a kid. It meant "anything but Pennzoil" when calling for a brand to use at oil change.
The difference used to be significant as Pennsylvania crude has a high level of paraffin. So oils refined from Pennsylvania crude (including Quaker State) were said to cause tons of sludge, and some of that criticism was deserved.
I am told that the refiners now mix many types of crude so the paraffin of Pennsylvania crude is diluted. Maybe, but I still tell my mechanic to use ABP.
Married2Allis
Well-known Member
I was just commenting on watching prices fall and since I visit Walmart alot that seemed to be a good indicator. I use Rotella 15-40w in my tractors and power equipment, but for cars and trucks have used Pennzoil in them for over 40 years and run the mileage into triple digits on all with never any oil problems.
modern oils that meet the new api se sf standards will not turn to sludge....... no matter which brand.
the old 30w non detergent oils were full of paraffin, and waxes that would sludge out..Plus full of light weight volatiles that would boil off leaving an every thickening mess behind. Buy a good hd oil of any brand that meets the api se or ce standards or higher and you will not see sludge.. assuming your thermostat is working correctly and youre not dumping water into the crank case. api standards test for these problems. Its NOT the 60s and 70s anymore. Just buy a good oil.
the old 30w non detergent oils were full of paraffin, and waxes that would sludge out..Plus full of light weight volatiles that would boil off leaving an every thickening mess behind. Buy a good hd oil of any brand that meets the api se or ce standards or higher and you will not see sludge.. assuming your thermostat is working correctly and youre not dumping water into the crank case. api standards test for these problems. Its NOT the 60s and 70s anymore. Just buy a good oil.
Those Pennzoil rumors are so old and crazy, it was never a bad oil or unique to other brands. At one time all oil was bad, the technology and refining processes have come a long way in the last 5,10, even 40 years and beyond that. Even engine designs have helped oil last longer, by running cleaner and having better ventilation. Some of you guys might be surprised at how many different brands of oil come out of the same pipes at refineries.
Do you actually think this brand of oil comes from a special place in the ground that no other oil comes from, therefore making it inferior to anything else. The fact is these oils must meet the same API standards which are very high standards as any other brand, these standards even include anti-sludge agents. Did you know Shell oil owns this company, so are you going to go hating and spreading false rumors about Shell oil, Rotella or Quaker State?
With that said, if I found some oil on a good sale and had the budget and need to stock up on it then I would probably buy it.
Do you actually think this brand of oil comes from a special place in the ground that no other oil comes from, therefore making it inferior to anything else. The fact is these oils must meet the same API standards which are very high standards as any other brand, these standards even include anti-sludge agents. Did you know Shell oil owns this company, so are you going to go hating and spreading false rumors about Shell oil, Rotella or Quaker State?
With that said, if I found some oil on a good sale and had the budget and need to stock up on it then I would probably buy it.
I can't answer that, as I don't know what his experience was, BUT I know what my EXPERIENCE concerning PENNZOIL has been.
I bought a CJ5 new in 1967. It had the V/6 in it and I was working part-time at a big Texaco station just off I25 in C. Springs, CO. My love of the back country meant that I was putting on a lot of miles every weekend besides my daily commutes to two jobs and home again (Manitou Springs), and so I was religious about maintenance. I changed the oil and filter, without fail, at every 3,000 miles. After a weekend foray with a lot of water crossings the gear boxes were checked and drained and refilled if needed. I tell all of this to verify that there was no skimping on preventative maintenance with this Jeep.
One of the issues with the Buick V/6 was the plastic toothed camshaft sprocket which began to make noise at about 40k. When I replaced the sprocket at the station with a steel replacement I noticed a very sticky, grey scum inside the timing cover. I got the boss to look at it and his first question was 'What kind of oil are you using?. Pennzoil?'.
'Yep.' says I, 'Why' He said that Pennz was the only oil that he had seen do this. He recommended Texaco's Havoline and that's what I switched to. Several years later, I had occasion to drop the pan at about 80,000 miles. There was NO sludge of any kind and the oil consumption between changes was less than a quart even at trade-off mileage of 93,000 miles.
I realize that this an old story about old oil but ,hey, I'm an old guy! Pennzoil MAY have changed, but I haven't! I have not used a drop of it in over 50 years.
8)
jimg.allentown
Well-known Member
That gray sludge you found in the timing cover was from the lead in the gasoline - NOY from the Pennzoil. Leaded gas was in wide use back in that era. Unleaded gasoline did not become mainstream until after 1975.
Another thing - many years ago, when I was a teenager and had just started driving, an older mechanic told me that he had never lost an engine to Pennzoil. I have used Pennzoil almost exclusively since then, and I can say the same. I have never lost an engine to Pennzoil.
Another thing - many years ago, when I was a teenager and had just started driving, an older mechanic told me that he had never lost an engine to Pennzoil. I have used Pennzoil almost exclusively since then, and I can say the same. I have never lost an engine to Pennzoil.
the old 30w non detergent oils were full of paraffin
What?
There are two basic types of crude oil, naphthenic and paraffinic. Most conventional engine lubricating oils today are made from paraffinic crude oil. Paraffinic crude oil is recognized for its ability to resist thinning and thickening with temperature, as well as its lubricating properties and oxidation resistance (sludge forming tendencies). In the refining process, the paraffinic crude oil is broken down into many different products. One of the products is wax, and others are gasoline, kerosene, lubricating oils, asphalt, etc. Virtually every oil marketer uses paraffinic base stocks in blending their engine oil products.
Many people believe the term paraffinic to be synonymous with wax. Some have the misconception that paraffinic oils will coat the engine with a wax film that can result in engine deposits. This is not true. The confusion exists because paraffinic molecules can form wax crystals at low temperatures. In lubricating oils, this wax is removed in a refining process called dewaxing. Wax is a premium product obtained from crude oil, and in order to insure that we produce the highest quality base stocks available, Pennzoil removes the maximum amount of wax possible during the refining process. The end result is a motor oil product formulated with premium lubricating base oil.
What?
There are two basic types of crude oil, naphthenic and paraffinic. Most conventional engine lubricating oils today are made from paraffinic crude oil. Paraffinic crude oil is recognized for its ability to resist thinning and thickening with temperature, as well as its lubricating properties and oxidation resistance (sludge forming tendencies). In the refining process, the paraffinic crude oil is broken down into many different products. One of the products is wax, and others are gasoline, kerosene, lubricating oils, asphalt, etc. Virtually every oil marketer uses paraffinic base stocks in blending their engine oil products.
Many people believe the term paraffinic to be synonymous with wax. Some have the misconception that paraffinic oils will coat the engine with a wax film that can result in engine deposits. This is not true. The confusion exists because paraffinic molecules can form wax crystals at low temperatures. In lubricating oils, this wax is removed in a refining process called dewaxing. Wax is a premium product obtained from crude oil, and in order to insure that we produce the highest quality base stocks available, Pennzoil removes the maximum amount of wax possible during the refining process. The end result is a motor oil product formulated with premium lubricating base oil.
yes.. and the "hydro treatment" removes all of waxes.. there are serveral ways to do this... Chevron has the most popular license method. AND part of the api tests are for this problem. Some engine designs were inherit to sludge forming as they trapped oil in the passages in a way that let them cool down when the engine was shut off, and drop out the heavier portions and eventually clog those passages. ON these engines use of a medium to poor oil was a sure fire way to kill off the engine early. A simple redesign of the oil feed location on the oil galley fixed these problems by feeding oil from the low end of the engine and not the high end, so that oil pressure continuously clean the galleys from the bottom up.
Pair-a-dice farm
Well-known Member
I hear this all the time and it may be true. I've been using Penzoil in my gas motors for 30+ years. I've never had one apart and some of them have had 300K miles on them. I've got 2 now that have near 200K. At that rate who cares.
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