Pics of last years downspout/drain project and a plan for...

I had some success with burying pipe last year (last 2 images) and I'm looking to do more this year. I'd like to combine my "sump pump drain" with a new down-spout drain as shown in the first graphic. I'm looking for opinions/suggestions from some of you guys with experience.

All questions seem to start with this one...

Is this a really bad idea ? If so Why ?

If this is possible with some refinement, what should I improve/address ?

Thanks in advance. I always enjoy the opinions I get from you guys, so fire away.

Problem I see is that the 4 inch line must be surcharged(fullof water) before it empties some out. In a cold climate that means that it will freeze and block any sump pump discharge or roof drainage until it has thawed. Now if you have enough down hill gradiant (which it does not look like) less water will be left in the pipe. I plan to do a similar type of project. Mine will daylight at the end with rodent guard, it will all have positive drainage with no water left in the line. You ask what I thought, you got it. ) gobble

I think that part of the run should be O.K. There is a 6-8 drop on that run of 4" pipe. I am wondering more about the 2" run.

But, I definitely could have a freeze issue if the roof is full of snow and that pipe gets loaded with water and freezes. I will try to keep the outlets (that green cap at the end) clear. I'm hoping that if it's that warm and things melt quickly, they pipe will flow clean. Whatever is left in that last elbow should soak into the pea-rock over time.

At least if it does bust up in the ground, it can't do too much damage. It will just leak where it breaks and not move all the water out into the yard.

It would be nice to use some type of 4" hose that wouldn't disintegrate if it froze (the cost of such a hose might rule that out as impractical).

Yes if it freezes it will be broke under ground--- but the pipe will still be full of ice when it is above freezing during the day and the ground is till froze below. The water will not get away.

Sump pump will be backed up this time of year.

Our septic lines froze up after the tank a few years ago. All kinds of fall away from tank, No snow on the 30 inch deep lines and darn cold in March.

Heck of a mess in the basement.

I just installed drain pipe for 2 down spouts yesterday. We were able to daylight the ends of pipe and we never put an elbow on the end of pipe. How much water are you pumping out with the sump pump? You may have to make a dry well for that if you can't get water to drain away if that is an option.

Would be a disaster here in Minnesota, might work fine in Florida.

Frost goes 4 feet or more deep here. Relative was just commenting last week, the basement sump pump started pumping, the frost started moving up finally, but we were having a cold snap and it was 3 degrees that morning, he had to remove the short hose on the side of the house and let the water fly out the side of the house, would plug up the hose otherwise just between pump cycles.

Pipe needs to be below frost line or flow out empty in a minute or two, or it is busted pipe 'here'.

Paul

In Mich the 4"pvc would freeze solid in most winters. And best case, there "might" be enough heat loss near the foundation for the sump pump to blow UP the downspout and leak out at the downspout pvc joint. Best case there'd be a wet spot at the foundation worst it would all freeze.

I've always understood that you should NEVER combine a basement drain with a roof drain. (I'm assuming your sump pump drains your basement sump) If something restricts your planned outlet, the alternative outlet would be back at the sump pump. Your roof can catch a lot of water - more than you'd probably want in your basement.

You do very neat work, by the way.

I would be very careful about hooking a sump drain to an outlet that drains a higher source of water like gutters. There's the potential to back flood the house with a tremendous amount of water if the pump fails or is without power and the outlet on the 4" PVC becomes restricted or can't handle a deluge. Probably not a strong possibility that both problems occur at the same time but I can tell you I wouldn't hook my sump drain to any outlet that has the potential to back flood my house.

If possible you should at a minimum have the downspout to PVC connection below the top of the sump pit and done in a way it would overflow there before it would back up over the top of the sump pit inside the house. The illustration shows it done this way, it's lower than the sump pit and there's an opening between the downspout and the PVC, can't tell for sure if that's how you have yours.

When we moved to our home 36 years ago, the city made everyone run their sump drain to the street. I put a pvc line out about 2" under the ground and through the curb. The first wnter I ended up with a pile of ice half the width of the street and about 3 ft. tall. Every time the sump pump came on (it ran all winter) water would gurgle out the top like a geyser. We live at the end of a dead end street, so not traffic. The next spring the city came and cleaned up the ice, and ran a drain tile from our house to the storm sewer. Has been there 30+ years and my line has never froze. Comes out the side of the house at the top of the basement wall and drops down to about 2 inches under the lawn.

Hello IHC Red,

You should install a one way check valve in the two in" line at the elbow. Cheap back flow insurance.....


Guido.

Yup. You have a straight shot, sloped.

His diagram shows an elbow, pointing up. The pipe will remain full of water. That doesn't work here, we need to do it like you did. Free flow, slope all the way, free opening.

Paul

As said here already that would freeze solid here in WI.

How sandy is your soil there? My daughter had three downspouts flooding her lawn in heavy rains. Fortunately she had very sandy soil. I dug a French Drain (like a dry well) into her lawn, lined it with landscape paper, laid my drain pipe, and filled it with 3 yards of 2" washed rock. Landscape paper and 6" of soil covered it all. I connected four downspouts to the drian pipe, this included her neighbors. At the very end I put a pipe down to catch leaves, and a green popup like you have upward to give a relief if it overflowed. So far so good and it has absorbed some heavy rains. 3 yards was my educated guess.
I included a picture here. I have more if interested. Paul

I would perforate the last piece of plastic pipe at the dispersion elbow to allow the pipe to drain completely over a few days. This can keep the system cleaner. I also believe the sump pump needs a P trap or check to prevent possible gasses from getting back into the house. Jim

Thanks for the thoughts, etc. Here is a followup for some of the thoughts/comments in case anyone is still monitoring this thread.

I'm not too concerned about water standing in the pipe or needing to be full before draining. The images below show a small slit at the bottom of the elbow. This allows any standing water to empty out in to the pea-rock I'll put below it as a sink. (This is a special 4" elbow designed to fit the cap, not a standard 4" PVC elbow.)

Also, with an 8" drop in 15', the water will drain out of there pretty well. The one in my backyard has a 33' run and only a 6" drop and it works very well. After a hard soaking rain, the elbow is completely empty in a few hours.

Re: the sump pump backing up... one dare not bet against Mother Nature so I continue with caution. The frost around here doesn't let go until April/May. The ground above should be thawed before the pump starts working. It only needs to pump for a few weeks during the spring wet season. (My basement is only 3.5' in the ground.)

I think that a separate 2" line all the way out into the yard might be a better way to go. I should be able to bury it along side the 4" when I'm putting that in. I think an extra check valve is a good idea.