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how much would you pay for 6 ft of wire?

Geo-TH,In

Geo-TH,In

Well-known Member
Went to buy the adapter to test the throttle position sensor. Honda wanted $104 for the 6 ft of wire, two ends and 4 test points. It's the middle pic to the right of meter. I told Honda you've got to be kidding, $104. Does it comes with Vaseline with Teflon so it doesn't hurt so bad?

Then I asked them if they heard of acupuncture? I went home, put needle points on volt meter leads and poked through the insulation to make measurements. It worked great, couldn't even see where I poked the wire.

BTW, all is good and no computer codes showed up. Glad I didn't throw away $104.

Honda prices $175 for an oil change, $200 to check valves, now $104 for wire. Do people actually pay these prices?
a198876.jpg
 
Geo,

If I may suggest, perhaps you will insulate he perforations into the insulation. The liquid electrical tape works well.

Good that you engaged your mind, and spared your billfold.

D.
 
George you had better seal those tiny holes or the wire will corrode from them inside the insulation. It does not take much of a hole to corrode wires.

The last belt trailer I bought had a prior owner that liked to poke wires with his test light. I had broken wires all of the time where the calcium form the road would eat the wire clear through inside the insulation. IF I see anyone poking the insulation on the wires on ANY of my machinery they are going to replace the entire wire they poked a hole into.

George I would have unplugged the adaptor wire and put pins between the male and female connections. This way you can get to them to test the voltages but do zero damage to the harness.

If I can not get any other way to check a wiring circuit out I will poke a wire as the LAST resort. I then clean the spot up and use liquid tape an GOOD electrical tape over the wound in the insulation.
 
Ditto-seal the holes:they may not cause problems now,but your shoes will drag moisture in,and it will find it's way to the wiring eventually.Mark
 
How about 6" of "wire"? After a local JD "expert" burned a fiber optic cable behind the dash of my JD 2520 tractor, I found out JD wanted over $100 for it ! I declined.
 
$104 for a test wire? No, the wire is only about a buck, the other 103 dollars is for insurance that your wife or daughter isnt stuck in some parking lot hours away with a car that wont start because the wires look like the Statue of Liberty.

Do people pay that? Heck ya they do. Its a bargain considering what you would pay a shop to test your car. By the time a shop adds enviromental fees, tax and everything else that $104 only gets you about a hour and a half of shop time. Not counting your personal time making an appointment, taking it in, getting a ride home only to reverse it again to get the car back.... all during bankers hours when you should be working. When you think of it that way, $104 is way too cheap.
 
It seems to me that all ATV service and repair items are outrageous. I had to buy a new key switch for my Yamaha, and it cost me $64.00 for a very simple switch. It came with two keys that were different--one didn't work. Complained to the dealer about that, they wanted to sell me a blank key to be machined elsewhere for $7.00. I said, "Wait a minute, Yamaha owes me a workable key!" The manager heard the conversation and said he'd stand the cost of the blank. I still had to take it to a special keymaker to have it cut at my expense.
 

I have read numerous times not to use RTV to seal a wire... Not to say I have not dun'it... I use fingernail polish to seal the vaccination ...

You would have to have a real bad TPS sensor to catch a glitch with a volt meter... You could check the reference voltage, the ground for voltage drop the min/max but anything in between you would be a lucky son of a buick to catch it with a DVOM...

You would need a graphing multimete are a DSO... Sorry but that's the way it tis....

I back prob with a pin just push it into the back side of the connector it will hit the terminal end...

One of my best finds I brought this kit on ebay for $65.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Westward-El...d0afbc0&pid=100040&rk=1&rkt=4&sd=400760027366
 
Don't think anyone is going to drive my kawasaki mule, utv, to look at the Statue of
Liberty. It never gets very far from home.

As for me, I don't work, been retired for 11 years. I just play, have fun and refuse to
pay Honda's high prices.
 
I didn't use TRV, I used 100% clear silicone, water proof.

There was no backside to connector either, connector was water tight, even the side that pluged in the TPS.
 
Unless you need it 'right now' you can often order the correct terminal ends from somewhere like Waytek and make your own breakout harness. Too, if you can have a parts man that's worth a crap they can often find the ends in their books. The cheapest way though it to hit one of the self service parts places and cut the ends off of a harness. You'll have a couple of dollars tied up in, along with your time, but far less than $104.....depending on the value you place on your time.......
 

It looked like it was a molded sealed connector from the pix you posted :cry:

I would have thought the factor tool would have been a break out box not a damm break out jumper harness... They are and any thing else that's not automotive so damm far behind it pitiful...
 
(quoted from post at 21:00:34 08/21/15) Don't think anyone is going to drive my kawasaki mule, utv, to look at the Statue of
Liberty. It never gets very far from home.

As for me, I don't work, been retired for 11 years. I just play, have fun and refuse to
pay Honda's high prices.
Click to expand...

As is so common, you just dont get it....

The Statue of Liberty reference wasnt that someone was going to drive your mule to [i:11aa104dbe]see it[/i:11aa104dbe], it was in refernce to what the wires will look like after you poke holes in the insulation. The wires corrode and end up looking green like the Statue of Liberty. When the wires are green and rotten, they break. When they break, the juice dont flow. When he juice dont flow, somebody gets stranded. When people get stranded, the $104 that could have been spent is cheap. Others gave you the correct answer, make a jumper, never molest the wires...
 
Yes.

With a coupon you can get them free if you buy ANYTHING else.

I'be gotten about 30 of them free over the past 4 or 5 years to give to friends, etc.

Dean
 
Like the other post said, they give them away for free!

One of those cheapy free meters saved my bacon one time. Out of town on a Sunday afternoon and suburban decides to pull a no start. Happened to have tossed one of those meters in the console. Was able to troubleshoot and find the problem (bad connection at the fuel pump). Had I not had it then tow truck, rental car and big $$$ would have been involved.
 
GEO, U R a busy dude!

Do you REALLY need all that equipment/stuff/toys to get through a week of life at your age (or mine)?

WHY???????
 
I used to keep some needles handy to test wires. I just inserted the needles into the wires and hooked some alligator clips to the needles (made up the wires with alligator clips myself). Often used them to check for internal breaks in the wires. I think fancy meters are sometimes over rated. I have a large fancy meter that sits in the tool cabinet, most of the time I just grab my small hand-held and it is sufficient for my needs.
 
OEM service tools tend to be expensive because they're low-volume items and the manufacturer figures the dealer has no choice. IF you can buy the connectors separately, obviously you could make your own breakout cable for the cost of the connectors.

Having worked on military aircraft for many years, I would never poke a needle through wiring insulation. It's an invitation for corrosion to start and create a problem that is nearly impossible to find. I will, however, back-probe a connector.
 
Can't back-probe. The TPS ends are sealed to keep dirt and moisture out. Tell me how am I going to get corrosion with copper wire in a dry, warm area . I protected the point I probed?

I could see your point if I do this where salt, sand, show and rain is involved, but this is next to the throttle body.

If a pin point can cause corrosion, so will connectors that can be back-probed, they have more area exposed.

The 4 wire plug that connects to the TPS is so air tight, my old fingers can't remove it.

I'll deal with the corrosion if it ever happens.

I think people are making much to do about nothing with my acupuncture. I refuse to pay $104 for a wire that can only be used in one place. NO WAY!
 
Years ago I promised a Honda factory rep I would never buy another Honda vehicle again. They used to make a Prelude with the V-Tech and what they referred to as a "sport shift automatic". Had to be one of the worst transmissions made. My son had one, and yes he abused it, but it started to fail at 60,000 miles. Took to Honda dealer (second mistake), and they took me for about $150 for a "transmission flush" saying that would likely fix the problem (it did not), and then asked $3500 for a reman transmission (yes a reman for $3500). I not so kindly passed on their offer, and after some heavy discussion with Honda, I paid a local shop to install a used transmission for roughly $1200 total, and sold the car. That transmission was starting the same tricks just before it left, and I learned most of them failed in that same way as well as some Acura with that same trans. Honda prices are ridiculous, and in my opinion no better than anything else. I do still own a small Honda motorcycle from the 70s, but I doubt I will ever buy anything else made by them as that left such a bad taste as the rep basically admitted to selling a defective product, but would not do anything about it. Of course today they would likely replace a 60,000 transmission under powertrain warranty. I should have seen the handwriting on the wall when he bought the car (from a Honda dealer) and we declined the warranty for $600 and he replied "You have never owned a Honda have you?" That is the most I have ever spent on any repair on any vehicle (and do not plan on it happening again).
 
George, with your home made cost savings measures, you're a man dear to my heart, I'm sure we would get along just fine lol. If the nit pickers and nay sayers want to buy those expensive special dealer tools for me, SURE I will accept their charity and be glad to use them. Like you, when I do such things, I as an electrical engineer, am well aware of and take preventive measures to insure proper sealing and protection, but if you don't post you did such, they will be all over you lol, all good folks just trying to help.

PS all my life I have used self help and cost savings procedures, just how I was raised and lived my life and got by just fine, maybe that's why I managed to acquire savings at my age versus being in debt. I love Dave Ramsey's rant to people who all their life have maybe a $400 per month car payment to drive a brand new shiny car so they can impress someone at a stop light. He tells them put $400 per month in a savings account for 20 or 30 years and they will be rich I HOPE YOU LIKE YOUR FREAKING CAR LOL

Take care Neighbor, maybe see you and that Wilson character at Elnora after Labor Day

John T
 
> Tell me how am I going to get corrosion with copper wire in a dry, warm area .

Typically the stuff I work on isn't in a dry area.

>If a pin point can cause corrosion, so will connectors that can be back-probed, they have more area exposed.

The difference is that terminals are plated so they don't corrode.

You're right that chances are that wire will still be around long after you and I have left this vale of tears. But I have had some very aggravating experiences tracing down problems caused by someone sticking a needle in a wire, which is why I don't do it.
 
JohnT,
All my red-neck cost savings skills I learned while working with Bill Wilson. He's my mentor and hero. Or perhaps just my mentor and a good friend.

I opened my electrical box this morning to get something. Then I got to thinking about all the nit pickers and nay sayers. The connectors in my box are used in many applications and are exposed to the air. In some applications they are used and subjected to moisture, like on the terminals of an air conditioner compressor. Yes, some of them fail and I've replaced many, but that doesn't stop the people making AC's from using them.

So what's the big deal putting a tiny pin puncture wound in the wire?

If I use these connectors in a wet situation, I'll coat the wires with no-crode, use the connector, then get my caulking gun out and cover it with 100% silicone. How many people use these connectors on their trailer wiring and do nothing?

As for buying a new car, I bought my first new car and truck after I retired. I've always done most of my car repairs, even rebuilt engines when they only lasted 100K. Had to have cylinders bored out to 40 over to clean them up.

BTW, I retired at 55 and loving it. Also bought 4 tractors after I retired.

Gave up motorcycles. Tractors are more fun.
Nice chat. Hope to see you and my mentor later this year. Bill is cheap, I'm frugal.
George
a198950.jpg
 
(quoted from post at 19:26:57 08/22/15) > Tell me how am I going to get corrosion with copper wire in a dry, warm area .

Typically the stuff I work on isn't in a dry area.

>If a pin point can cause corrosion, so will connectors that can be back-probed, they have more area exposed.

The difference is that terminals are plated so they don't corrode.

You're right that chances are that wire will still be around long after you and I have left this vale of tears. But I have had some very aggravating experiences tracing down problems caused by someone sticking a needle in a wire, which is why I don't do it.
Click to expand...

On the common weather pack connector you don't penetrate the wire you slip the probe over the wire and under the weather pack seal and make the connection to the terminal end...
 
Too late, been pricking wires all my life. Been doing electrical repairs all my life
too. Yet to have the issues like you describe. You don't think using wire connectors
will also cause issues? Cars, trucks, and appliances are full of connectors exposed to
the air.

Yes under some conditions wires will oxidize, especially battery terminals. Just deal
with it. There are hundreds of open connectors slip in connectors in cars and there
are no issues with the copper wire turning green. Look look at the fuse box. If fuse
box gets wet, yes problems. Under normal conditions no big deal like you and others
think.

I'll deal with the problem if it happens.
 

RTV (Room Temperature Vulcanizing) silicones contain "Acetic Acid", that's why they smell like vinegar. You can google it its your call I shy away from it to seal a connection...



As far as being cheap you DVOM is too slow (sample rate) to catch a glitch in a TPS sensor I wish it was but its not... In the rare case it will but it would have to have a major issue with the TPS...

Whats the issue you are having that's lead to playing doctor with the wires...
 
OK TRV is gone. Sealed it with grease I use to protect wires from oxidation. We are
only talking about a microscopic pin puncture wound.
 
Now that everybody else has weighed in with their comments, I gave this one a lot of careful thought.
My comment is that this is more than just a "few feet of wire" as you call it. It is much more than that. It is a custom made diagnostic c0nnector. As such, as has already been said, it is a low volume specialty item. The price, while a bit salty, is not unfair. If I were a technician working in a shop fixing these vehicles all day, I would certainly pay the price myself. I might not like it, but it is a tool of the trade. I also see your reluctance to pay that much for something you might only ever use once. No value there for sure.

As to the meter.....well.....a few things there. First off, a DIGITAL meter is USELESS In pinpointing an intermittent or fluctuating problem. Even the top of the line Fluke meter will not be useful in this aspect. For what you are/were testing, an analog meter is the best tool for the job. Flashing numbers are hard to read, need time to settle, and only have a finite sampling rate. You can see a needle wiggle. A digital display simply does not do that one well, if at all.

As to probing the wires. Going back even into the '70s and '80s, I never thought that a lot of sensitive electronic wiring would be compatible with the harsh environment found under the hood of any vehicle. Too many extremes in temperature. Too hostile of an environment. So far, I have been proven mostly wrong. I see no harm in probing a wire. Sealing it up is a good practice as well. I have seen some pretty ragged wiring harnesses under hoods that still worked OK. The whole thing is splitting hairs - kind of like the argument about nitrogen versus regular air in your tires. Effects so minute that even the sensitive equipment at the national bureau of standards might have a hard time to measure them.

Either way, a cheap analog meter would be a good addition to your tool collection.

Over and out.
 
There is a way to access the ECU's menory. You have to short out a special terminal, not on ECU, and codes will flash on DFI light. I have no codes, so any issues I have are mechanical and not electrical. All is well. Please give it a rest.
 
(quoted from post at 18:43:00 08/23/15) There is a way to access the ECU's menory. You have to short out a special terminal, not on ECU, and codes will flash on DFI light. I have no codes, so any issues I have are mechanical and not electrical. All is well. Please give it a rest.
Click to expand...

No problem here I do regard you as a rite smart fellow... In My situation I have to develop Technics are follow recommended Technics to avoid liability issues I hope you understand that...

No one dislikes a molded sealed connector more than I do when it comes to diagnosing a issue and its a fight to tap into it...

When the evolution of EEC came about it was recommended you ware a dog collar and a leash hooked to a ground I hope you put yours own I never did please don't tell any one :wink:
 
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