How to Diagnose problems with Starter/Solenoid

steve terplak · Jul 5, 2015

Hello all,
I have a Massey 1080.
We are having trouble with the starting system right now.
The starter was rebuilt last year, spins the Perkins over like a charm.
When I push the ignition button, there is an audible click at the solenoid, and the ammeter shows that power is being drawn but the starter does not even try to turn.
You can do this a few times and then, all of a sudden, it will work, spin it over and fires right up.
Does not seem to be any rhyme or reason, could have sat for a day, or a minute.
What is the process for diagnosing this?
Any clues what it could be?
My thought is that power is not getting from the solenoid to the starter...but I am not sure how to check this...
Thanks in advance,
Steve

rrlund · Jul 5, 2015

Is there a post right on the starter with some kind of a cable or a strap running from the solenoid to the starter? It there is,just touch a jumper cable from the battery to that post. If the starter's good,it should work that way.
Don't overlook a safety switch,such as clutch safety or neutral safety as being the problem.

merlynr · Jul 5, 2015

(quoted from post at 08:13:29 07/05/15) Hello all,
I have a Massey 1080.
We are having trouble with the starting system right now.
The starter was rebuilt last year, spins the Perkins over like a charm.
When I push the ignition button, there is an audible click at the solenoid, and the ammeter shows that power is being drawn but the starter does not even try to turn.
You can do this a few times and then, all of a sudden, it will work, spin it over and fires right up.
Does not seem to be any rhyme or reason, could have sat for a day, or a minute.
What is the process for diagnosing this?
Any clues what it could be?

First thing I would do is check all connections associated with starting circuit for loose or corroded bolts,nuts and clean them up. Grounds and hot sides. Secondly, by-pass the solenoid with jumpercables but be careful cause they will spark.
My thought is that power is not getting from the solenoid to the starter...but I am not sure how to check this...
Thanks in advance,
Steve

Russ from MN · Jul 5, 2015

Make sure you have everything in neutral when you trouble shoot! You can bypass one component at a time until you find the problem.

Fatjay · Jul 5, 2015

My oliver did this. Took the starter off and back on, and it worked. Turns out I had a chipped tooth on the flywheel.

JD Seller · Jul 5, 2015

I would bet that your not getting full voltage at the start solenoid from the crank circuit. Take a volt/ohm meter and measure what voltage you are actually getting at the starter solenoid from the switch. This is a problem on many tractors. More so if they have safety switches in that circuit. You have more connections that can corrode.

Also see what your voltage is at the battery cable at the starter while your cranking or trying to crank. I have had bad grounds act this way.You would not get full voltage all of the time until it arced to make good connection.

IF you are getting full voltage than the solenoid itself is bad. So you maybe able to clean it up if it can be taken apart. If it is one that is crimped together than replacing it is your only option.

IF it is low voltage than work your way back to the power supply to and from the crank switch. JD actually made a kit to put a relay right at the solenoid with full power supplied from the battery terminal. This way low voltage from the starter switch circuit would usually activate the low draw relay which in turn gave good higher voltage to the starter solenoid.

old · Jul 5, 2015

There are a few thing that will cause that to happen
#1 poor connections so when you push the starter button a few times you arch a spark some place and you get thing hot and make a connection
#2 Solenoid is going bad, to test that jump across the big posts on the solenoid and if it spins over every time solenoid is bad. BE sure it is out of gear. The fact you hear the click makes me think solenoid is going bad since the click say it is pulling in like it should just the point inside are burned badly

Hobo,NC · Jul 5, 2015

Go to page 5 of this post (its 6/7 pages of guesses) a voltage drop test would have nailed the issue in minuets..

http://forums.yesterdaystractors.co...;postorder=asc&highlight=lug&start=60

I dunno why folks fear a voltage drop test maybe they are to old to learn. It may be the title gave to it when its actually the voltage that is not being consumed... I have never gave the title much thought because it works. It could be the voltage recorded is the voltage that is being dropped (not used) from the circuit/connection.

Steve@Advance · Jul 5, 2015

"My thought is that power is not getting from the solenoid to the starter...but I am not sure how to check this..."

You are on the right track. If you hear a solid clunk from the solenoid, and you are sure it is the solenoid you are hearing, good chance the solenoid is going bad.

Simple test, connect a test light between the battery terminal of the solenoid and the starter lug. The light should glow full bright.

Hit the start switch until you get the fail and hold it:

If the light is NOT glowing, the solenoid is GOOD.

If the light IS glowing with the solenoid energized, the solenoid is BAD.

If the solenoid tests good, connect the test light between the starter lug and a good ground. Energize the solenoid:

If the light glows bright and the starter does not turn, the starter is bad or loose from the engine (bad ground).

If the light goes dim or out, there is a bad connection in the battery cables or engine ground. Also a shorted starter will cause the light to dim, but there will be other symptoms like smoke from the starter or hot battery cables.

Texasmark1 · Jul 6, 2015

Smack the case of the starter when it doesn't respond. If you get response, the armature is shorting out against the case. If new bushings on the armature don't solve the problem you need a new armature, or better yet just get a new one. My last one off www was $160 and I consider that a great price. Been 10 years and no problems.....yes it was foreign made but forget where.

How to Diagnose problems with Starter/Solenoid

steve terplak

Member

rrlund

Well-known Member

merlynr

Member

Russ from MN

Well-known Member

Fatjay

Member

JD Seller

Well-known Member

old

Well-known Member

Hobo,NC

Well-known Member

Steve@Advance

Well-known Member

Texasmark1

Well-known Member

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