Well I have never owned a gun was looking to get one to shoot predators that attack my chickens, I was told to get a rifle which I think would be a 22. But the problem is here in New York state is you can only buy 22 rounds on a very limited basis, But 12 gauge shotgun shells are plentiful so would it be feasible to use a shotgun to shoot predators or would a 22 rifle be better? They've got this safe act in New York now so things have really gotten pretty bad with guns and ammo. I guess the other road I can go down is the states wildlife kills my chickens so they can pay me for the loss ? Lol
- Thread starter JayinNY
- Start date
If your going to be shooting at moving targets than I would go with the 12 gauge shotgun. Also 00 buck shot is real close to the size of a 22 bullet.
If your shooting much at all a 22 is real limited in it's killing power. You have to hit a dog or coyote just right to kill them with a 22. Where a 12 gauge with double 00 buck shot is easier to get a kill shot in with.
Plus shot gun shells are easier to buy now. A good shot gun is about the same price as a 22 any way unless you going real cheap on the 22.
If your shooting much at all a 22 is real limited in it's killing power. You have to hit a dog or coyote just right to kill them with a 22. Where a 12 gauge with double 00 buck shot is easier to get a kill shot in with.
Plus shot gun shells are easier to buy now. A good shot gun is about the same price as a 22 any way unless you going real cheap on the 22.
Yes I agree I don't know what the problem is with a 22 why they stopped us from getting ammo for them?but the laws here in New York are really strict you can only buy one box a day if you can even get them if the dealer even has them. My friend is making his own bullets or packing them wherever you want to call it because he can't buy them. Is a 22 like what the rifle man used to use?
For someone who has not owned a firearm before I recommend a 20 ga. shotgun. You have a better chance of hitting your target than with a 22 rifle. Also the shotgun pellets do not travel as far. I think Savage Arms still makes a 20 ga.shotgun 22 rifle combo. Then you have both. Steve
If you mean the TV series then they used 30-30 Winchester lever actions rifles. Those would be center fire type shells.
As for 22 AMO being in short supply. It is more about manufacturing and demand than legal issues.
IF we get another abundant nnalert in as President then our guns right will go up in flames.
As for 22 AMO being in short supply. It is more about manufacturing and demand than legal issues.
IF we get another abundant nnalert in as President then our guns right will go up in flames.
You fail to say what type of predators and ranges. The drawback to a shot gun is range. Decent .22 can take a fox or even coyote at 100 yards with good shot placement. You'd be hard pressed to get that kinda range with a shotgun and pellets. But a shotgun at shorter ranges can take most smaller predators.
Rick
Rick
onefarmer
Well-known Member
- Location
- 6735 S Lowell Rd, St Johns, Mi 48879
For my first gun I'd didn't want the firepower of a 12ga. A 410 was plenty. 20ga is a nice in between size. With a 22 you would need to hit your mark for the kill. With shot you don't need to be dead on, but you might wipe out a few extra things in the general area.
Do you have some friends with guns you can go target shooting with? Try before you buy, see what you like
Do you have some friends with guns you can go target shooting with? Try before you buy, see what you like
IF your looking at a Henry really look at the sights. I bought a nice lever action 22 Henry. The sights where terrible. The barrel sight was wide enough to hide a car behind. I put a scope on it and that was fine but the iron sights where bad.
I have a Henry 30-30 and that gun has good sights.
I have a Henry 30-30 and that gun has good sights.
old
Well-known Member
- Location
- Camdenton Missouri
Depends a lot on what your shooting at. A 22 is a good little gun for small stuff. As for a shot gun well depends on where your shooting and what. Me I use a 410 shot gun for things like racoon and opossums. A 12 gauge it way over kill for most stuff and can do a lot of damage. That all said I have had /owned a 22 for more then 50 year an still have that gun. I believe one can NEVER own enough guns or ammo but I am former military
Like others have said, a 12ga is a little large for a varmint gun, unless your dealing with some large varmints. On the other hand, a .22 is a little small for anything beyond a medium sized varmint, like say a raccoon or opossum.
Given all of that, and the fact that .22 shells are still difficult to find, as well as expensive, it would rule either out of the running, in my opinion.
To me the best thing would be something like a lever action Rossi M92, chambered in .38/357 magnum. We've got two Rossi Revolvers, and they are well made guns, with a good warranty. I've looked at these rifles quite a few times, but just haven't had the funds available yet to buy one. Price wise, your looking at around $500 to $600 for a new one.
With it being chambered in a pistol caliber, the ammo is reasonably priced. Too it gives you the option of shooting the cheaper, less powerful .38 for smaller game and practice, and when needed step up to the .357 magnum for larger game. In fact the .375 magnum actually has enough power to safely take an animal as large as a deer, should the need arise.
Another thing about the caliber, is that 'snake shot' shells are readily available, usually in .38, for those instances when you need to get rid of a smaller varmint, or something at relatively close range.
Like I said, given all of the factors involved, and the fact your more or less looking for a single gun to do it all, a carbine like this would be my first choice.
As for ammunition for a gun like this, reloads are readily available from places like Defender, and Georgia Arms.
Look below for a link to Rossi's site, as well as the sites of both Defender and Georgia Arms
Rossi
Defender
Georgia
Given all of that, and the fact that .22 shells are still difficult to find, as well as expensive, it would rule either out of the running, in my opinion.
To me the best thing would be something like a lever action Rossi M92, chambered in .38/357 magnum. We've got two Rossi Revolvers, and they are well made guns, with a good warranty. I've looked at these rifles quite a few times, but just haven't had the funds available yet to buy one. Price wise, your looking at around $500 to $600 for a new one.
With it being chambered in a pistol caliber, the ammo is reasonably priced. Too it gives you the option of shooting the cheaper, less powerful .38 for smaller game and practice, and when needed step up to the .357 magnum for larger game. In fact the .375 magnum actually has enough power to safely take an animal as large as a deer, should the need arise.
Another thing about the caliber, is that 'snake shot' shells are readily available, usually in .38, for those instances when you need to get rid of a smaller varmint, or something at relatively close range.
Like I said, given all of the factors involved, and the fact your more or less looking for a single gun to do it all, a carbine like this would be my first choice.
As for ammunition for a gun like this, reloads are readily available from places like Defender, and Georgia Arms.
Look below for a link to Rossi's site, as well as the sites of both Defender and Georgia Arms
Rossi
Defender
Georgia
If only one, I would go with a 12 gauge pump. You can get a cheap one at Wally World that will do the job of an expensive one. Shells are plentiful but you won't be using very many anyway. What does it matter about overkill? Ain't that the point of shooting something? Shotgun pellets don't ricochet very far like bullets, which may or may not be a problem with nearby neighbors. TDF
Not sure where you guys live but here in MO I can still buy 22 in the 500 round bricks. They are more expensive than they used to be but readily available.
Now as to the question as to what to get for varmints at close range a 20ga pump shotgun is a good choice as others have stated. 00 buck shot in a 20ga has 9 33 caliber pellets and will take most critters out to about 50 yards or so pretty easy. Beyond that you will need a rifle.
22LR is a bit small for medium or large critters. Another couple of good choices would be a good 223 bolt or semi, 22 hornet is pretty decent also, 30-30 is hard to beat as well but make sure you get one with good sights (Winchester pre 1964 if new then go Marlin as Win has been made by US Repeating arms since 72).
Another good option is a 410 shotgun as others have mentioned. The 410 is actually very versatile can be used with shot shells and the rifled slugs are fairly accurate out to around 100 yards.
Now with all of this being said if I had to own only one it would be either a 22 or the 410 for critters. If going with the 22 the Ruger 10/22 or the Marlin 60 are both excellent choices. If going 410 my choice would be either the Rem or Win 410 pump.
Just my 2 cents
Now as to the question as to what to get for varmints at close range a 20ga pump shotgun is a good choice as others have stated. 00 buck shot in a 20ga has 9 33 caliber pellets and will take most critters out to about 50 yards or so pretty easy. Beyond that you will need a rifle.
22LR is a bit small for medium or large critters. Another couple of good choices would be a good 223 bolt or semi, 22 hornet is pretty decent also, 30-30 is hard to beat as well but make sure you get one with good sights (Winchester pre 1964 if new then go Marlin as Win has been made by US Repeating arms since 72).
Another good option is a 410 shotgun as others have mentioned. The 410 is actually very versatile can be used with shot shells and the rifled slugs are fairly accurate out to around 100 yards.
Now with all of this being said if I had to own only one it would be either a 22 or the 410 for critters. If going with the 22 the Ruger 10/22 or the Marlin 60 are both excellent choices. If going 410 my choice would be either the Rem or Win 410 pump.
Just my 2 cents
MarkB_MI
Well-known Member
- Location
- Motown USA
Not enough information, Jay. What are these predators you need to shoot? 22 rimfire will kill a raccoon, but isn't likely to take out a coyote with a single shot. Do you have neighbors close by? You don't don't want to alarm them; a 12 gauge shotgun is LOUD. At what range will you be shooting? Shotguns are deadly out to 25 yards or more (depending on the load), but a centerfire rifle is effective beyond 100 yards.
Personally, I would skip the 22 rimfire if noise is not an issue. A centerfire rifle is much more effective against larger predators. A bolt-action rifle in .223 will do nicely. I have two guns I use for varmints: I have a T-C Contender rifle with a custom .17 Remington Fireball barrel that is deadly against woodchucks and raccoons. For bigger varmints I have Winchester Model 70 in .22-250, although I seldom use it because of the noise. Factory ammo for these guns would be expensive, but I load my own ammo.
Personally, I would skip the 22 rimfire if noise is not an issue. A centerfire rifle is much more effective against larger predators. A bolt-action rifle in .223 will do nicely. I have two guns I use for varmints: I have a T-C Contender rifle with a custom .17 Remington Fireball barrel that is deadly against woodchucks and raccoons. For bigger varmints I have Winchester Model 70 in .22-250, although I seldom use it because of the noise. Factory ammo for these guns would be expensive, but I load my own ammo.
Dan Richardson
Member
How about a Drilling?
MarkB_MI
Well-known Member
- Location
- Motown USA
Chuck Connor's rifle in "The Rifleman" was a Winchester Model 1892 chambered in the once-popular .44-40. Winchester makes the '92 today. You can even get it with the ridiculous loop lever like the Rifleman's.
Traditional Farmer
Well-known Member
- Location
- Virginia
Savage Model 24 would do what you want various calibers over a shotgun.I'd suggest something like a .22 Mag over a .410 or 20 gauge.There was one advertised here lately .222 over a 20 gauge I'm still holding out for a .223 over a .410
Also some company has stated making combo guns again
Also some company has stated making combo guns again
Jay you are wrong about the 1 box a day thing. It is not a law, many ammo sellers self imposed this to try to serve more customers. I have recently bought 1000s of rounds of .22 ammo. Also have bought 2000+ rounds of .40 for my pistol in a day. NYS laws do suck, but the rumors about them are worse.
As for the predator problem? Remington 870 in either 12 ga or 20 ga
As for the predator problem? Remington 870 in either 12 ga or 20 ga
Jay, obviously you're not a gun guy. That's fine. The question on what to get comes down to what are you shooting at and how far away. I know you're down Albany way and that means you probably aren't dealing with bears and probably not coyotes and other people are a concern more so than they are up here 5-6 hours north if you. If it's coons, possums, fox, rats, etc. a 22 is fine. A 22 will work on coyote if you hit it right, I've shot several. But since you aren't gun guy a shotgun makes hitting a lot easier out to 40-50 yards. If the ranges are 50 yards or under, then a 20 gauge shotgun and something like #4 shot, not buckshot, will work fine. The pattern spreads making it easier to hit with.
I'd suggest you stop by a gunshop and talk to a few people before deciding. You don't need a $4-600.00 brand new gun. A used gun will be fine. You certainly don't need a long range, high dollar gun if you don't even know how to shoot.
For my 2 cents it would depend on where you're shooting them and how good of a shot are you. I tend to reach for a shot gun as I can't hit beans with a 22 and sometimes even miss with the shot gun.I've got my Dad's shotguns which are out of the 50's and none of them have can get off more than a single shot and still have a target to shoot at.
Donald Lehman
Well-known Member
Since you are not experienced with firearms, Bret and others suggestion to stick with a 20 ga. is pretty good advice. The suggestion of the Savage over/under would be a good gun to look at also. I would fire a 12 ga. or two before I bought a 12 as my first shotgun to get an idea of the recoil. Some can shoot a 12 ga. without flinching and some can't.
Donald Lehman
Well-known Member
We live in the Pipple's Republic of NY, Comrade, things are different here.
notjustair
Well-known Member
I've got dad's Mossberg 20 guage from eons ago. Nice gun with adjustable choke. He traded a bicycle for it. I think he did ok.
That limit has NOTHING to do with the law! There is still a hoarder-induced shortage of .22 ammo so dealers are limiting customers to one box a day.
If they are telling you that it is a law, they are lying to you. They just don't have the balls to take responsibility for their own store policies. Not letting the customer buy as much .22 as he wants will pi$$ off a segment of customers. Not having .22 for the other customers that want it pi$$es off another segment of customers. By blaming "the law" they avoid having ALL of that pi$$ed-offedness directed at them.
That begs the question: If your gun dealer is lying to you about this, what else is he lying to you about? Can you really trust this dealer to keep you legal and out of jail?
Texasmark1
Well-known Member
Shot gun for me as you don't have to worry about the round going 1.5 miles and hurting something you didn't intend to hurt.
Other thing, in the fall, when bird season is upon us, 12ga shells can be found for about $6 a box of 25 for bird shot (7 1/2 - 8 short brass). .410, on the other hand is $13 a box and you can't find it in cheap short brass bird shot, always reloadable tall brass which helps to increase the price besides it being low volume compared to 12.
20 is next best from a popularity/price standpoint. Would recommend either.
Other thing on shotguns, you don't have to worry about a stable aim like you do with a rifle. As a senior citizen, that gets more difficult as time passes.
Mark
Other thing, in the fall, when bird season is upon us, 12ga shells can be found for about $6 a box of 25 for bird shot (7 1/2 - 8 short brass). .410, on the other hand is $13 a box and you can't find it in cheap short brass bird shot, always reloadable tall brass which helps to increase the price besides it being low volume compared to 12.
20 is next best from a popularity/price standpoint. Would recommend either.
Other thing on shotguns, you don't have to worry about a stable aim like you do with a rifle. As a senior citizen, that gets more difficult as time passes.
Mark
It would be used for fox, raccoon and coy dogs or coyote. My
neighbor across the road also has chickens, and he shoots the
predators when he is home, but there have been times were
he is not home and we have a problem, I live in a rural area,
and yes it's my land.
neighbor across the road also has chickens, and he shoots the
predators when he is home, but there have been times were
he is not home and we have a problem, I live in a rural area,
and yes it's my land.
Rick in Iowa
Member
if coons are your main problem,get two old pie pans,put fly bait in one,coke cola in the other one.in a few days youll be tripping over dead coons.i have a Ithaca 20gauge single shot I got when I was ten.need to hold it tight cause small butt it kicks like a mule.
rustyfarmall
Well-known Member
Okay, I'll add my 2 cents worth. A .410 single shot will be just about the least expensive, used ones are readily available, .410 shotgun shells are easy to find, and a .410 will definitely get the job done. a racoon or possum shot at close range will be a mess to clean up, and if you miss, you don't need to worry about where the shot ended up, as opposed to a .22 rifle, which can travel easily up to and beyond one mile.
texasranger
Member
I agree with rustyfaramll I think a 410 would be good but a 20gauge would work well
Blackhole49
Well-known Member
- Location
- White Lake MI
I would rather have a semi-auto and have 6 shots
instead of 2. Who needs the weight of a double
barrel?
instead of 2. Who needs the weight of a double
barrel?
Pair-a-dice farm
Well-known Member
I can't imagine going with out both a shotgun and .22. If I had to choose I guess I would say a 20ga shotgun. I bought a 20ga Stevens pump when I was 13 and still have it. It would fill a box car the amount of game I've killed with it in the last 45 years. A .410 or 28 ga are a little light for my way of thinking and the ammo is a lot higher than 12 or 20 ga.
For a shotgun, 12 gauge light field load shells seem to be less expensive than any of the smaller gauge shells. .22 ammo is still less expensive than any shotgun shell. Look into shotgun chokes and pellet sizes to adjust a shotgun to the range and type of animal you are shooting.
If you are concerned about your chickens eating lead shot and contaminating their meat and eggs, use steel shot or some other non-lead shot for water fowl (high cost).
Jay, have you identified the predators that are attacking your chickens?
The predators and your location will influence what gun to use. If you are in an dense urban area, trapping the predators or improving your fences could be the best solution.
If you are concerned about your chickens eating lead shot and contaminating their meat and eggs, use steel shot or some other non-lead shot for water fowl (high cost).
Jay, have you identified the predators that are attacking your chickens?
The predators and your location will influence what gun to use. If you are in an dense urban area, trapping the predators or improving your fences could be the best solution.
Chris Jones
Member
Wow, now that's a question that will result in a screen full of "opinions". 
I don't know how much you know about guns. I don't know the distance you plan on shooting or what you consider a predictor. IMHO go to a shooting range and try some shotguns and rifles or even handguns so you can know how easy and hard it is to hit intended targets and things around the intended target. Guns seem simple point and shoot, but it takes practice especially if your target isn't standing still saying shoot me. Keep in mind shot spread with a shotgun, the potential range of a rifle if you miss what you want to hit--and the fact it might go right through and still have energy enough to kill/hurt. Lastly consider nobody takes a mistake with a gun lightly these days. If that 22 misses and goes across a field and takes out a neighbors window the news will say "deranged gunman arrested after firing into house only feet from where a 5 year old girl was sleeping." I shot at a squirrel sitting under my plumb tree from my bedroom window once. It not surprisingly went through the squirrel but I didn't expect it to ricochet off the ground (just dirt) and it took out my shed window 100 foot away. If you live on a farm out of sight of other peoples property or dwellings you might be safe to use any gun.
I don't know how much you know about guns. I don't know the distance you plan on shooting or what you consider a predictor. IMHO go to a shooting range and try some shotguns and rifles or even handguns so you can know how easy and hard it is to hit intended targets and things around the intended target. Guns seem simple point and shoot, but it takes practice especially if your target isn't standing still saying shoot me. Keep in mind shot spread with a shotgun, the potential range of a rifle if you miss what you want to hit--and the fact it might go right through and still have energy enough to kill/hurt. Lastly consider nobody takes a mistake with a gun lightly these days. If that 22 misses and goes across a field and takes out a neighbors window the news will say "deranged gunman arrested after firing into house only feet from where a 5 year old girl was sleeping." I shot at a squirrel sitting under my plumb tree from my bedroom window once. It not surprisingly went through the squirrel but I didn't expect it to ricochet off the ground (just dirt) and it took out my shed window 100 foot away. If you live on a farm out of sight of other peoples property or dwellings you might be safe to use any gun.
old
Well-known Member
- Location
- Camdenton Missouri
One of the first thing you should do is take a hunter safety course since you say you have never owned a fire arm so you have little if any time handling one. Gun safety is more then half of shooting one and with out the knowledge of how to use one your likely to hurt your self or others.
CenTex Farmall
Well-known Member
You have a lot of replies but I'll go ahead and throw in my two bits since I also have chickens and regularly engage in varmint control. I also have neighbors, not real close but not too far away.
If it's between 12 gauge or .22 then go with the 12 gauge. I've killed a lot of predators with a .22 and 90% of the time they don't die right away, although one hit is enough for them to die eventually. You will need "hotter" ammo, such as CCI, for the .22 to be more effective.
Most of the time I find predators out at night trying to get at the birds or get into stuff and it's easier to get a hit with a shotgun on a moving target in the dark while you're holding a flashlight. Or if you're half asleep and stumbling around in your jammies because you heard some noise outside.
The other factor is that the varmints are always in and around buildings, vehicles, equipment etc.
A miss-placed or ricochet rifle round will do significant lateral damage. Possums and racoons like to climb up in trees and with a shotgun I don't worry about a stray bullet that misses or over-penetrates. Even a cheap .22 round can travel over a mile.
On shotguns, a 12 gauge is definately overkill for smaller predator like a skunk or possum. It will certainly be dead but a direct hit on one of those will literally reduce it to little pieces over a table sized area. The upside is you can handle the largest predator with a good buckshot load and ammo is easy to find. It will kick though!
My favorite predator gun is an ancient single shot 410 that I bought a few years ago. Even with BO in the White House I only had to exchange 30 dollars for it. The ammo is higher but I last bought a box 2 years ago. I typically use #4 shot and it is most definately more lethal than a .22 (even with good ammo) and one shot will drop a big raccoon in its tracks. Overall length is a little shorter than typical 12 gauge and it's lighter which helps with aim and swing. It throws enough lead to be lethal but not so much that I'm worried about lateral damage. That said, a 20 gauge would also be an excellent compromise and offer a wider choice of ammo.
Like any tool, it's easy to get carried away with gun features and configurations but I would stick with a single shot or pump action. For general varmint use the single shot is terribly cost effective. For not a whole more the pump offers a quick reload if your birds are attacked by a pack of animals. On a rare occasion I've had a group of dogs show up and get after my birds and it was nice to have something that held more than one round.
The best thing at this point is go shopping and handle some of the guns. Then you can get a better perspective on the weight and grip of the different ones. Ammo availability is more important that absolute price. It all costs something and unless you're hunting or target shooting you won't go through but about a box a year. Find something that fits you and is comfortable to handle.
If it's between 12 gauge or .22 then go with the 12 gauge. I've killed a lot of predators with a .22 and 90% of the time they don't die right away, although one hit is enough for them to die eventually. You will need "hotter" ammo, such as CCI, for the .22 to be more effective.
Most of the time I find predators out at night trying to get at the birds or get into stuff and it's easier to get a hit with a shotgun on a moving target in the dark while you're holding a flashlight. Or if you're half asleep and stumbling around in your jammies because you heard some noise outside.
The other factor is that the varmints are always in and around buildings, vehicles, equipment etc.
A miss-placed or ricochet rifle round will do significant lateral damage. Possums and racoons like to climb up in trees and with a shotgun I don't worry about a stray bullet that misses or over-penetrates. Even a cheap .22 round can travel over a mile.
On shotguns, a 12 gauge is definately overkill for smaller predator like a skunk or possum. It will certainly be dead but a direct hit on one of those will literally reduce it to little pieces over a table sized area. The upside is you can handle the largest predator with a good buckshot load and ammo is easy to find. It will kick though!
My favorite predator gun is an ancient single shot 410 that I bought a few years ago. Even with BO in the White House I only had to exchange 30 dollars for it. The ammo is higher but I last bought a box 2 years ago. I typically use #4 shot and it is most definately more lethal than a .22 (even with good ammo) and one shot will drop a big raccoon in its tracks. Overall length is a little shorter than typical 12 gauge and it's lighter which helps with aim and swing. It throws enough lead to be lethal but not so much that I'm worried about lateral damage. That said, a 20 gauge would also be an excellent compromise and offer a wider choice of ammo.
Like any tool, it's easy to get carried away with gun features and configurations but I would stick with a single shot or pump action. For general varmint use the single shot is terribly cost effective. For not a whole more the pump offers a quick reload if your birds are attacked by a pack of animals. On a rare occasion I've had a group of dogs show up and get after my birds and it was nice to have something that held more than one round.
The best thing at this point is go shopping and handle some of the guns. Then you can get a better perspective on the weight and grip of the different ones. Ammo availability is more important that absolute price. It all costs something and unless you're hunting or target shooting you won't go through but about a box a year. Find something that fits you and is comfortable to handle.
Mostly a fox, also a fisher. I saw a fox attack this hen one afternoon when I came home from work. I was able to save the hen, I text my neighbor across the road, by the time he got home from work he had 3 dead hens, he shot the fox but he only hit its leg or something. This isent something that happens every day, but it's enought over the 11 years I have had hens.
just buy an old single shot 12 gauge you can get them around here from $25 to $100 . educate yourself on shot/shells. cheap, effective, easy to get shells for , less chance of missing a coon in the dark.and you can buy slugs and shoot a moose with the same gun or buy #8 and shoot skeet.a box of #6 and a box of #4 will likely do what you want to do and probably have less than $100 tied up.
Bob Harvey
Well-known Member
I have a .22LR over 20 gauge that I have had for over 40 yrs. Came with a wooden case of CIL 20g. mixed bag of shot and some slugs, AND 250 rnds of .22LR for $100. Used it a lot at the farm, but not so much here (neighbors within 500m). Use a paintball gun to deter raccoons and deer and neighbor's dogs now.
Clodbuster
Member
Those pellets are coming out of a .410 just as fast as they are out of a 12 or 20, there just aren't as many of them!
They also don't kick very much if that is a concern for some folks.
They also don't kick very much if that is a concern for some folks.
Clodbuster
Member
For close up work or shooting something out of a tree or the air, a shotgun is great but you tell us that your target may be on the ground and a little farther away.
I'm going to recommend a Ruger 10/22 in .22 long rifle. They are as dependable as a hammer and the one I linked to is on sale with a cool laser sight too! The laser on it can be found on Amazon for around $50 by itself so this is a really good deal. You won't be able to see this laser outside in the sunshine but in shade or lower light, they are great. Of course it will have metal sights and you can add a nice scope later too.
I think shipping is cheap from this place and you can have a local gun store do the paper work for you for a fee. You need to find a local FFL holder or store first that will agree to have it shipped to them. Since you may be younger then your parent may have to buy it and own it for you to use. I don't know your local laws.
The .22 is a good gun to start out with and I agree that you should go through a hunter safety course even if you don't think you need it and also have an experienced adult take you out for some practice and training.
Ruger 10/22 with laser
I'm going to recommend a Ruger 10/22 in .22 long rifle. They are as dependable as a hammer and the one I linked to is on sale with a cool laser sight too! The laser on it can be found on Amazon for around $50 by itself so this is a really good deal. You won't be able to see this laser outside in the sunshine but in shade or lower light, they are great. Of course it will have metal sights and you can add a nice scope later too.
I think shipping is cheap from this place and you can have a local gun store do the paper work for you for a fee. You need to find a local FFL holder or store first that will agree to have it shipped to them. Since you may be younger then your parent may have to buy it and own it for you to use. I don't know your local laws.
The .22 is a good gun to start out with and I agree that you should go through a hunter safety course even if you don't think you need it and also have an experienced adult take you out for some practice and training.
Ruger 10/22 with laser
Close quarters action give me a shotgun every time.12 gauge. 20 gauge shells are the same price as 12 gauge. .410, are ridiculously expensive to buy.
And anybody that thinks you are going to need a lawn rake to clean up after if you shoot something with a 12 gauge has watched too many movies.
12 gauge kick. I have shot 500 12 gauge shells in one day before at trapshoots. Thou would not do that with a Mossberg 500 or handicap loads.
And anybody that thinks you are going to need a lawn rake to clean up after if you shoot something with a 12 gauge has watched too many movies.
12 gauge kick. I have shot 500 12 gauge shells in one day before at trapshoots. Thou would not do that with a Mossberg 500 or handicap loads.
Brendon-KS
Well-known Member
- Location
- Goessel, KS
I too am a fan of the Savage 24 models and have a 222/20 and a 22LR/410. The little Stevens gets far more use around the place than the centerfire - it has been used to dispatch many skunks, possums, and even a badger. A fairly full-choked 410 with 6 or 7.5 shot at the typical varmint range of under 30 yards is all these little creatures require. If they're farther than that, well, just flip the switch and use the rifle. It would be nice if the cost of 410 shells was proportional to their size instead of inversely proportional but at least they're readily available. For the relatively few that I run through it isn't a big deal.
Just FYI as far as I know Savage never packaged the 410 with a centerfire rifle cartridge. They actually started making a 22 (LR or WMR) over 410 combo again, the Model 42, but to my eyes it is quite ugly compared to the previous Model 24.
Just FYI as far as I know Savage never packaged the 410 with a centerfire rifle cartridge. They actually started making a 22 (LR or WMR) over 410 combo again, the Model 42, but to my eyes it is quite ugly compared to the previous Model 24.
Assuming the problem animals are going to be within 50 yards or so, 60 at the max-max, then a 20 gauge ought to do you fine. You can get light 2 3/4" bird shot loads that won't knock you down or penetrate board walls in #6-9 shot. And you can get 3" magnum turkey loads or duck loads that will take a fox or coyote with #4's or steel 3's.
The alternative is something along the lines of a 22 rimfire or one of the 17's in rimfire. Next up the ladder is the small caliber centerfires but you're getting into very loud, long range stuff. If you aren't a gun guy I'd find a nice used 20 gauge pump, Mossberg is often found under $200.00. It'll work without you having to be a dead shot and they are user friendly.
The other thing is to get someone to show you how to use the thing SAFELY. Find a gun shop, gun buff, EnCon officer, Trooper/Deputy/retired cop, etc to show you the ropes. You have to think safety first at all times, just like any other tool.
You may not need a rake but you can pickup pieces. when rabbits were plentiful around here and we hunted all the time when saeson was open I hunted with a 410 single shot Iver Johnson Champion and still do but not much rabbit population around here any more. But a 410 with a 2 1/2 " number 5 aimed about 4" off their nose at about six feet will take their head off and usually no pellet in body.
Thanks to everyone's advice concerning some kind of a gun as you know I don't have much knowledge with them, I only thought all shotguns were considered 12 gauge I had no idea you could change the shot, I have learned a lot from here from you guys so I can purchase something in the future. Thanks again. I'll also talk to my neighbor he's a hunter and he knows about guns.
TerryB Illinois
Member
You could also go with a .22 LR over a 20 ga. shotgun. That would let you take advantage of both.
Texasmark1
Well-known Member
4's aren't too much higher with tall brass. Course range and choke matters too and he didn't initially say what he was after.
Armadillos are a problem here and I have wasted lots of them with bird shot at about 20 feet which the critter will let you do if at night when they are out and you come at them quietly from the rear and down wind....horrible vision but acute smell. 4's will disembowel them. They rip my lawn to shreads digging up worms, which I have thousands, locating them by smell.
Mark
Armadillos are a problem here and I have wasted lots of them with bird shot at about 20 feet which the critter will let you do if at night when they are out and you come at them quietly from the rear and down wind....horrible vision but acute smell. 4's will disembowel them. They rip my lawn to shreads digging up worms, which I have thousands, locating them by smell.
Mark
Im shocked (but really shouldnt be) that with all the replies, this is the only one with the correct answer.... TRAPS.
Traps work 24/7/365, no matter what gun a person has you can never equal that. Not to mention, those animals are smart, they learn real quick when a person is home and what happens when they have a "boom stick" in hand.
Coons. Easy to shoot, can be dumb and bold or sneaky as all get out. Dumb and bold is easy but you still lose a few chickens till you get on the problem. Get a sneaky one or one you "educated" by missing or something, those are tough to get. Traps work well though because dumb or smart, coons rarely will pass up a free meal. Throw out some bait, dog biscut, empty tuna can or marshmellows. After a few days the coon cant wait to get back to the free buffet, thats when you put out the trap. You will get him first night, maybe second. Google "Duke no dog" traps and "conibear bucket set" or even "havaheart live trap".
Fox. You can shoot the first one, maybe the second but after that, you got a tough row to hoe because they are smart buggers and you just tought them what happens to their buddies when they see you and a gun. Its unlikely you will see them again. Learn to set a leg hold trap and let it hunt for you. Google a "hay set" and a "hay bale set", both have worked well for me. If you have something digging into your pen, keep the hole they started and put a trap in it (no bait) and just leave it, something will try digging again and get caught.
Coyote. The conventional wisdom is you either have coyotes or you have fox, not both and for me thats pretty true. Coyotes eat the same food and drive out the fox (some say even eat the fox). I have seen both around but not as a rule. Because of that, I dont have much experience with coyotes but I do know the hunters are always looking for new land to shoot them. Give em permission and let them take care of the problem, they usually come around a couple times a year. Make it clear though, you want them all gone and thats conditional on them hunting otherwise they tend to have a little self control by not shooting them all so they can hunt year after year. Of you could learn to trap them.
If you insist on a gun to solve your problems, you will be back here next year with the same problem. If thats the case, get the gun that will give you the highest chances of success, 12 gauge shotgun. There is no way a person unfamiliar with guns can shoot a .22 as well as a shotgun. And why would a person get a lesser gun like a 410 when a 12 gauge can shoot light loads that equal a 410 but a 410 can never shoot equal loads as a 12 gauge? Makes no sense... get the 12 gauge. But remember that traps are the real answer.
Get a single shot 20 gauge shotgun. Have your neighbor teach you about gun handling and safety. Treat it though is is always loaded, never point it at something you don't want to kill or damage. Never store it where kids can find it. Keep the ammo in a separate room and place.
Everyone in the house needs to know these rules.
Everyone in the house needs to know these rules.
Dean Olson
Well-known Member
I recently jumped through all the hoops and acquired an integrally supressed Ruger 10/22. Really quiet. I've shot .22's for over 40 years and never realized how much they bounce/ricochet. You can hear the distinctive high pitched buzz when there's no report covering it up.
For that reason I'll grab a shotgun, especially at night, before my 22. I shoot light 1oz loads of 7 1/2's. out of a 12 gauge.
Or
I have snake shot shells for my 45 with tactical light attached. It works great at close range.
The answer to your question is have several options to fit the situation. I shoot a .223 at coyotes, .22 or shotgun at coons, skunks etc., snake shot at rats and snakes.
For that reason I'll grab a shotgun, especially at night, before my 22. I shoot light 1oz loads of 7 1/2's. out of a 12 gauge.
Or
I have snake shot shells for my 45 with tactical light attached. It works great at close range.
The answer to your question is have several options to fit the situation. I shoot a .223 at coyotes, .22 or shotgun at coons, skunks etc., snake shot at rats and snakes.
Mark - IN.
Well-known Member
What do your laws do for purchasing on-line? I don't have the problem with ammo availability that I had a couple of years ago when everyone started buying up all of the .22LR for AR-22's when there was talk of banning AR-15's along with .223 and 5.56mm, which there is talk of again now through the latest greatest executive order. However, back to my original point...how are the laws in NY for purchasing on-line? When stuff got whacked out a couple of years ago, I started purchasing on-line. Midway is one of my favorites, and the prices are down by about 1/3. Do NY laws prohibit you from purchasing on-line?
For Varmints (fox, yote), I would go .17WMR or even .22WMR. For varmints? I wouldn't use a shotgun because risk spraying your chickens as well, and the velocity of a .17WMR or even the less desirable .22WMR can fix your varmint problems at greater distances before they get to your livestock.
Can you purchase ammo on-line? If so, figure out what will work best, buy the ammo on line, purchase your firearm as you have to...and next election, vote for fix what got broken.
Mark
For Varmints (fox, yote), I would go .17WMR or even .22WMR. For varmints? I wouldn't use a shotgun because risk spraying your chickens as well, and the velocity of a .17WMR or even the less desirable .22WMR can fix your varmint problems at greater distances before they get to your livestock.
Can you purchase ammo on-line? If so, figure out what will work best, buy the ammo on line, purchase your firearm as you have to...and next election, vote for fix what got broken.
Mark
Do you plan to raise chickens long term? For long term peace of mind you might be ahead to upgrade your fences/enclosures and make them predator proof against your local predators.
Every year there will a new generation of predators sniffing around. As much fun as it is to stay up all night and shoot into the dark at shadows, even that gets old after a while. Then it's time to upgrade the fences and maintain them.
Every year there will a new generation of predators sniffing around. As much fun as it is to stay up all night and shoot into the dark at shadows, even that gets old after a while. Then it's time to upgrade the fences and maintain them.
i WOULD NOT suggest using a laser on anything other than close quarters home defense. they are a great idea on paper but in the real world all they do is show you and what you are shooting at how shaky you are.
seen alot of people get bummed out with a laser when its shaking all over at the range.
seen alot of people get bummed out with a laser when its shaking all over at the range.
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